Why does buying with Steam Wallet require billing details?

[Shame]

It asks for your full name and billing address now. Not even the e-mail though. It's not like Steam is going to send you a letter, saying you bought a game using your steam wallet, which isn't exactly real currency to begin with. For what purpose is this?

Doesn't do that when buying or selling skin market items though, that's a free-roaming stock market right there!

[Wolf Knight]

steam has to send taxes to the correct government. the steam market is not the same as the steam store

[Shame]

Both use the same method to get digital content though. I am literally moving wallet fund from their already in-system currency to gain access to or a copy of a game. This is like if games were asking for your address and real name for no reason to purchase in-game content in a game with microtransactions using premium currency which you already have enough of. I can understand this being a requirement for when you purchase funds FOR Steam Wallet, but not when using it.

I don't remember needing to set a billing address or put my full name in for the transaction before, when was this change made exactly and due to what? Would I be breaking TOS or something worse if I put in incorrect information for something seemingly trivial as this?

[Wolf Knight]

market - money stays with steam, never leaves
store - steam records a sale, thus causing money to leave steam (devs get paid).

laws change, steam has to follow them. what was before is not what is now.

and putting in false information is grounds for steam to terminate the account. read the SSA, you agree to provide correct and accurate information

[J4MESOX4D]

Originally posted by Shame:

Would I be breaking TOS or something worse if I put in incorrect information for something seemingly trivial as this?

Your account gets locked and then you have to contact Support with an explanation. Consider that 'I didn't want to' is not an acceptable excuse. It's perfectly safe though and merely acts as a location verification more than anything.

[Shame]

That is incredibly annoying and doesn't actually make sense beyond some law passing. You used to be able to buy fund using your bank details where it would show a pop-up to confirm the purchase, so Steam might know your card purchase details, but not your address. It would be great to know what exactly made Valve make the decision to require this sort of information while buying a game, because it doesn't help them at all when confirming a purchase like this.

Originally posted by J4MESOX4D:

Originally posted by Shame:

Would I be breaking TOS or something worse if I put in incorrect information for something seemingly trivial as this?

Your account gets locked and then you have to contact Support with an explanation. Consider that 'I didn't want to' is not an acceptable excuse. It's perfectly safe though and merely acts as a location verification more than anything.

The wallet fund purchasing already provides them with real money with purchase details, doesn't it? What is the point of having Steam Wallet funds then, if not for buying digital content without throwing information left and right? I don't like the idea of Valve knowing my location if they don't have to.

Also, when you make a skin purchase from another user, doesn't part of the fund go to the developer, another part to Valve and then another is left as VAT? Then I'm assuming Valve has to determine how much they have to pay for each to get it sorted. Otherwise developers could not profit from this transaction at all without selling skins as DLC directly. Same goes for Trading Cards to my knowledge. Has something been changed here too?

[Wolf Knight]

steam market uses wallet funds only. you are not buying/selling, you are trading. you cannot withdraw wallet funds. there are no taxes on market trades

if you want to complain about steam needing your address, I believe its the EU that requires it.

[Edifier]

Originally posted by Shame:

It asks for your full name and billing address now. Not even the e-mail though. It's not like Steam is going to send you a letter, saying you bought a game using your steam wallet, which isn't exactly real currency to begin with. For what purpose is this?

Doesn't do that when buying or selling skin market items though, that's a free-roaming stock market right there!

So what makes you trust your ISP company more than Valve?
What makes you trust any other company that you have given the information too in order to buy something from?

Why is this such an issue? Also haven't you already bought stuff on Steam if you're using the market?
So this should mean you've already given them your information.

[cinedine]

Originally posted by Wolf Knight:

market - money stays with steam, never leaves
store - steam records a sale, thus causing money to leave steam (devs get paid).

Market: developers get a 10 % cut, minimum of 1 cent per transaction.

Originally posted by Edifier:

So this should mean you've already given them your information.

The change occured beginning of this year. So if you are still eligible from last year, no you have not.

Originally posted by Wolf Knight:

if you want to complain about steam needing your address, I believe its the EU that requires it.

Nope. EU does explicitely NOT need it. They are perfectly fine with Steam paying VAT to an approximate to each country they have to and VAT is country-wide, so no need for a full address.

---
Frankly, there is so much wrong with the above posts, the thread will most likely being trolled by the usual subjects and subsequently locked before I finsihed posting. So not worth it.

[Shame]

Originally posted by Edifier:

Originally posted by Shame:

It asks for your full name and billing address now. Not even the e-mail though. It's not like Steam is going to send you a letter, saying you bought a game using your steam wallet, which isn't exactly real currency to begin with. For what purpose is this?

Doesn't do that when buying or selling skin market items though, that's a free-roaming stock market right there!

So what makes you trust your ISP company more than Valve?
What makes you trust any other company that you have given the information too in order to buy something from?

Why is this such an issue? Also haven't you already bought stuff on Steam if you're using the market?
So this should mean you've already given them your information.

Certain companies require such information so their service could function. This case it doesn't seem like they do. I don't give my local supermarket store my address every time I go buy groceries. I don't want to give my address to any company just because they ask for it, only if the service I'm asking from them requires it.

Also if you read correctly, you'd notice I had been purchasing games through either the old steam wallet system or the pop-up method I mentioned before. I haven't bought a game in a while. The skin market doesn't ask for your location to buy or at least sell every time... yet.

@cinedine if what you are saying is indeed true, then this is literally a case of "Valve wants to know your location" and nothing more.

[cinedine]

Originally posted by Shame:

@cinedine if what you are saying is indeed true, then this is literally a case of "Valve wants to know your location" and nothing more.

In the EU, yes. Nothing has changed here and it worked just fine over the years.
In the US many stated have introduced an online sales tax and Valve uses your address to determine the rate. Whether or not they absolutely positivel need your address for this is up to debate.

[cSg|mc-Hotsauce]

The billing information is mandatory now.

Since January for the store... https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=6112-TDHB-4392

The Market now requires it too, since the beginning of May.

The info is only for you and Valve to know.

FYI... I had to personally ask a Valve employee on his social media account to request the KB article for billing info back in Jan because they "forgot" to make one. I did ask again about updating it for the Market a couple weeks ago. Still no response.

[Shame]

Well, I just sold 7 skins without my address being requested, and apparently only purchasing a skin requires the information. It just used an e-mail address and phone Steam Guard confirmation and nothing more (don't think you even need a number for that one). Now that I think about it, Valve doesn't put any notices about changes to their TOS whenever you launch Steam, or at least for me that doesn't happen, just game advertisements (which strangely don't load in properly at times).

I have given them my PC spec information before for gathering anonymous data about the specs of platform users, for understandable reasons, which I was perfectly fine with. But this is a bit much. If they don't change this, I don't think I'm ever going to purchase another game through Steam.

[JVC]

Originally posted by cinedine:

Nope. EU does explicitely NOT need it. They are perfectly fine with Steam paying VAT to an approximate to each country they have to and VAT is country-wide, so no need for a full address.

What the European Union in Brussels wants is irrelevant. EU directives must still be implemented in national tax laws, and there's ton of room for how each member state implements these things. Very often it is based on previous procedures. You can challenge that in a court of law, sure. But you've got no guarantee to win the case and it'll cost you a fortune in procedings. So nobody opens those cases.

The tax authorities want adresses because people report nonsense addresses trying to pretend they live in countries with cheaper tax codes.

Denmark, which is in the EU, started cracking down on non-VAT compliance from Amazon purchases as early as 1999.

Originally posted by Shame:

Well, I just sold 7 skins without my address being requested, and apparently only purchasing a skin requires the information.

That actually makes sense. The money leaving your account is the transaction the tax man is the most interested in, since you're eligible to pay VAT on that if you live in an EU country.

The skins you sold again, that's you reselling private property but so infrequently and for such an irrelevant amount (I presume) that you're entitled to do so without being taxed. At least under my local tax code. It is only if the amount of transactions is so great that you're trying to make a living out of it, that you'll be taxed on profits gained.

[Edifier]

Originally posted by Shame:

Certain companies require such information so their service could function. This case it doesn't seem like they do. I don't give my local supermarket store my address every time I go buy groceries. I don't want to give my address to any company just because they ask for it, only if the service I'm asking from them requires it.

The local supermarket is a retail store. Steam is not a retail store. It's an online store.
Can't really compare them.

Originally posted by Shame:

Also if you read correctly, you'd notice I had been purchasing games through either the old steam wallet system or the pop-up method I mentioned before. I haven't bought a game in a while. The skin market doesn't ask for your location to buy or at least sell every time... yet.

If you add money to Steam wallet you'd be needing to put in information for it to go through.
Because that would be a normal transaction.

Originally posted by Shame:

But this is a bit much. If they don't change this, I don't think I'm ever going to purchase another game through Steam.

Oh no, I don't think Valve could handle you not buying a game or two. It's okay, the people buying up all of the Index hardware are making up for you in the thousands.


It's honestly interesting seeing people being so adamant on not giving this to a gaming company that is among the most trusted in the gaming world.
What do you think will happen?

[Tito Shivan]

Originally posted by cinedine:

In the EU, yes. Nothing has changed here and it worked just fine over the years.
In the US many stated have introduced an online sales tax and Valve uses your address to determine the rate. Whether or not they absolutely positivel need your address for this is up to debate.

In addition to that the fact Steam likes a one-size-fits-all approach to problem solving makes this a bigger issue than it could be.

They also like to ask for the whole arm just in case they could need the information.
IMO this could likely go down the 200 Market transaction restriction and the request of information to lift it... Which was ultimately removed.