Leather vs plant/yarn/silk cloth

[[TNC] Thai Lizard]

What's an ideal use for the different clothing material? So far I put work orders on leather backpacks and quivers, since the only other alternative is adamantine. I'm also making leather clothes, with the intention that if a civilian should get attacked, at least the leather offers some protection. I'm making leather bags, but I'm thinking maybe it's better to make bags with cloth.

What are some good uses for plant/yarn/silk cloth, compared to leather? Is certain clothing better as non-leather?

[Fel]

It's harder to mass-produce enough leather for clothing.
Also, avoid backpacks (unless they fixed it?).

I might be mistaken but I don't think clothing has much of a difference based on the material in terms of defenses (even as armor, leather is pretty poor).

Plant cloth and yarn are usually pretty easy to get in large amounts but they are usually lower in terms of price.
Also to note is that threads (or cloth) can be dyes for extra value.

Usually I make most of my clothing out of plant cloth, with a portion in yarn cloth and some specific items out of leather (just because it feels right, no real difference) like shoes.

[AlP]

Leather can be used to make cloaks for additional (minor) protection for your military, although civilians will also grab them.

[[TNC] Thai Lizard]

I guess maybe a benefit with cloth, is that if cloth can be dyed for extra value, then they can wear more expensive clothes for happiness bonus? But I think different leather may have different value depending on the type of animal the original hide is from? Not sure how that compares in value.

[Fel]

You can definitely have some fairly high value leather (roc leather for example) but odds are that you won't be able to catch a couple of that species and make them breed for a renewable source.

Clothing can seem like an afterthought at first but as you continue to play your fort you will notice that your dwarves go through a fairly ridiculous amount of it.
You really need a fairly solid source of whatever you plan on using for clothing because the decay is relatively quick and they will change all of their clothing every 2-3 years if they can (and get unhappy if they can't).

[[TNC] Thai Lizard]

I was doing some theorycrafting on the wiki and it looks like cavies could be a good source of leather, because 1 adult animal should give 1 hide no matter the animal, at least according to the wiki, and cavies become adult sooner. Also their grazing requirement is almost non-existent. Only other ideal hide options would be pigs since they don't require grazing. Or it would have to be some animal with a higher value hide and leather if that is desireable, but in terms of hide and leather frequency it would seem cavies could be good.

[AlP]

You may need several animal types, because there's a pop cap limiting the number of each species on the map.

[xDDD]

Originally posted by AlP:

Leather can be used to make cloaks for additional (minor) protection for your military, although civilians will also grab them.

I've done this before and it works alright, however those leather cloaks get degraded VERY quickly (basically after one fight) which makes them annoying to replace.

[[TNC] Thai Lizard]

I'll try to set up a cavy farm lol, but if the production is too slow, then I might switch to leather only for backpacks, quivers and cloaks. I think maybe I read that shield material doesn't matter, so that leather shields are actually good because of the low weight, but it's convenient to just keep the entire uniform one material like one metal across the board.

[Fel]

Cavies are too small to give you leather:
https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Cavy

Animals need to be at least a certain size to give you their skin, same for bones and meat.

[[TNC] Thai Lizard]

I see, thanks, I missed that, I was looking at the domestic animals page only. Guess pigs is the economic option then for hides.

[Fel]

While they require grass/moss to graze, sheep also give you wool (through shearing or butchering).
Both pigs and sheep can be milked as well.

An alternative to pigs for leather are dogs as they breed quite quickly.
Their advantage is the ability to train some of them as war dogs to suplement your military (or act as bodyguards for dwarves that need to go outside).

[[TNC] Thai Lizard]

I was planning on using pigs for milk and early game hides, possibly continued hides since cavies won't work, and I was planning on using sheep for shearing primarily since they're the most cost efficient shearing animal in terms of grazing cost. But, it is true that I could use sheep for hides too, since looking at the grazing costs, sheep are also cost efficient in terms of meat/grazing. If I remember correctly, they were only surpassed by dogs, beak dogs and alpacas in meat/grazing. Then once pasture size isn't a problem, switch over to water buffaloes since they have the most edibles per butcher. But all of this is mostly looking at grazing costs, could also be interesting to look at value/grazing and total value once pasture size isn't a limitation.

[Lucidess]

The best source of leather is the Caravan. I know it's dumb, but it's true. Sure you can have lots of animals, but they take a long time to mass populate.

[Fel]

Yeah, caravans bring leather in full crates so they are a good source.

[BlackCockDown]

Originally posted by Lucidess:

The best source of leather is the Caravan.

Not dumb at all, leather bins are really cheap especially relative to a bin full of rock crafts. I buy up all the leather and meat/fruit/veggies every time.

Pig tails are definitely top tier for clothesmaking, a decent sized farm and a few work orders for automation of clothes production basically yields an endless supply of clothes that will only get better in quality. Just remember to disable them for brewing, or have a plot reserved for clothesmaking (have your stills take from a stockpile of plants you want to brew and have that plot feed to a second stockpile reserved only for a farmer's workshop to spin).