Overrated game? What am I missing here?

[VoiD]

I got convinced to try it out yesterday, and so I did for about 10h so I am sure I must be missing, at least, something.

But what's so great about this game? I mean, the simulation part I've read about, sure, it's nice and fun that an evolving world actually exists, but from a gameplay perspective why would that even matter? There is no difference between spawning a raid at your colony, or having an actual raid visit you if the end result is that you get to fight the same raid against the same number of enemies at the same colony, in the same manner.

It's nice that the steam version actually has an interface, but simply having one doesn't mean it's a good one, it might still be the absolute worst colony builder interface in the world, there are no priorities for stockpiles, no way to simply tell dwarves to craft a couple more of the same item at the item creation screen, manager menus are just as bad, simply creating a basic set of armor requires going through a horrible menu where you have to use a search function to look up the material you want to use and each armor piece, one, by one, by one, by one, by one, by one.

As a player I spent more time going through bad looking tabs and menus than actually playing the game, then about 30 dwarves arrive, cool, all of them have some traits, or at least I think they do, not that it matters, not that it's possible to care about it, every detail is hidden away behind some tab and there's no way in hell I'll go through them all 30 times just to see who has a different colored toenail.

Honestly, unless I am missing something huge, this is kinda the worst colony builder I've ever played, the UI needed another decade of improvements just to get the game started.

I used to think the vanilla RW UI was terrible and the game was unplayable without mods to fix it and unhide all the important info so the player wouldn't have to keep opening tabs just to figure out basic pawn needs that should be visible at all times, or to have proper work orders, or proper buttons to get stuff done, etc... But DF takes all of those flaws and dial them up to 1000.

[Bagel]

I think you need to understand that DF is more of a simulation than a game. The many stories you hear about people getting from DF have been the culmination of many hours of observing and fiddling with the game. The fact that two people have been working on it for more than 20 years means that certain aspects of it are way more detailed and perhaps overcomplicated than, say, RimWorld is. Them porting it to steam means that they have attempted to make it as playable as possible for newer players, however there is a limit to that as you can only simplify things to a certain degree before they become lacking in substance and/or options. Things will definitely improve in time, however it's probably not the best idea going into Dwarf Fortress with the idea that you will have an easy time navigating menus and learning.

[shoopy]

It's not a colony builder, I don't care what the tags say. A colony builder doesn't need 200 years of pre-generated history. If you're only interested in building successful colonies, you would miss 90% of what DF has to offer.

[Franz]

It's not everyone's cup of tea, the fact you don't find it fun doesn't mean others won't. It's a toy box, a big tub of construction blocks. You can fiddle around aimlessly, you can set a goal for your playtime, you can invent a story years in the making. At the end of the day there is no fun to be had in this game outside of the one you make for yourself.

[POWER WITHIN USER]

Originally posted by VoiD:

I got convinced to try it out yesterday, and so I did for about 10h so I am sure I must be missing, at least, something.

No refunds, by the way.

It's nice that the steam version actually has an interface, but simply having one doesn't mean it's a good one, it might still be the absolute worst colony builder interface in the world, there are no priorities for stockpiles, no way to simply tell dwarves to craft a couple more of the same item at the item creation screen, manager menus are just as bad, simply creating a basic set of armor requires going through a horrible menu where you have to use a search function to look up the material you want to use and each armor piece, one, by one, by one, by one, by one, by one.

As a player I spent more time going through bad looking tabs and menus than actually playing the game, then about 30 dwarves arrive, cool, all of them have some traits, or at least I think they do, not that it matters, not that it's possible to care about it, every detail is hidden away behind some tab and there's no way in hell I'll go through them all 30 times just to see who has a different colored toenail.

Honestly, unless I am missing something huge, this is kinda the worst colony builder I've ever played, the UI needed another decade of improvements just to get the game started.

It's really funny, the game got mouse support at the cost of no longer being able to handle the entirety of the game by using the keyboard.
As a result everything takes longer compared to the free version.

Originally posted by Rudetax:

Luckily I'm not you, otherwise I'd be an idiot lmao.

Weird flex, specially given that you bought a downgraded version of a video game.

[XxDruexX]

~back 10 years ago..i use to play DF with a 3D viewer and the dwarf task manager on while the main game window is just the minimap for my game view..ahh..good time

[jeetrix]

the more you play the more it shines
once you break the toplayer of icing there is really no limit to what can happen

[VoiD]

Originally posted by jeetrix:

the more you play the more it shines
once you break the toplayer of icing there is really no limit to what can happen

I really don't see it but I'm willing to give it another try, I'll probably restart and see if doing it all over again changes something, or if something interesting happens.

[Testikles]

Hm, I feel you exaggerate quite a bit. The UI could certainly use some QoL, but it's far from being un-useable.

"there are no priorities for stockpiles, no way to simply tell dwarves to craft a couple more of the same item at the item creation screen, manager menus are just as bad"

In and Out stockpiles can be set. Use closest materials is an option. More items come through the plus-sign in the work-orders tab, and the manager menu is really basic. Chose task -> set amount -> set condition for task to fire (if needed). You can automate big parts of your colony really quick.

I feel that you want to play this game like Factorio, super efficient and streamlined. It's not that kind of game. The toenails of your Dwarfs, the types of armor you produce and hand out, they matter. It's more of a role play game were you tell the story of your Dwarfs, be it of simple farmer-Dwarfs or battle hardened grumblers in the wastelands.

In this way the game is more like Minecraft (actually the other way 'round) than current other colony builders.

The discussion reminds me a bit on the discussions about Crusader Kings. You can play it super efficient, but then it is boring. The game shines if you take all those biographies and characters seriously and craft your own little medieval story. There is a reason why some people use DF as a template for their RP sessions.

[Lepidus Stupidius]

Originally posted by VoiD:

Originally posted by jeetrix:

the more you play the more it shines
once you break the toplayer of icing there is really no limit to what can happen

I really don't see it but I'm willing to give it another try, I'll probably restart and see if doing it all over again changes something, or if something interesting happens.

Honestly, dwarf fortress isn't for everyone. It's not that your an idiot or something, it's just not your thing. Us DF players are the same kind of people as LOTR geeks, who love DF for it's stories and intricacies.

[Thrillhouse]

Originally posted by VoiD:

Originally posted by jeetrix:

the more you play the more it shines
once you break the toplayer of icing there is really no limit to what can happen

I really don't see it but I'm willing to give it another try, I'll probably restart and see if doing it all over again changes something, or if something interesting happens.

make a cavern level fortress.

[Teemo]

Dwarf Fortress is definitely a "not for everyone" game. If you're not finding the appeal, don't worry, you're not alone. It's not that this game is overrated, it's just that there were quite a lot of fans who already like the game that were waiting for it to release, and many of them gave positive reviews.

[ShadowBastard69]

first couple paragraphs you typed is actually in the game its called WORKORDERS. can set them from the individual workshops themselves or the workorders menu (requires a manager and an office assigned to the manager). there you can;

1. specify materials and other things like what image to use for statues.
ex: i want to make 20 obsidian statues of my baron, so i click the magnifying glass on the work order and specify both material and image. some items have other parameters you can specify too

2. while looking at the workorder, click the green button next to the magnifying glass with a bunch of symbols on it. here you can specify stuff to be made if your stocks run under a certain number.
ex: I want my weaponsmith to make iron shortswords any time the number in the stockpile is less than 20. so click the button, and in this menu there are parameters to set for stuff like that. theres a lot of stuff in here so im not going to type it all out.

[jeetrix]

10 hours is like enough to get the mechanics , then you can crank up the level of difficulty
there are many ways to influence the eventfullness of affairs
1 is settling in a more savage environment with a longer history
another is to piss off the wrong deamon
but you have to iterate and experiment to get out the fine bits
having a well oiled fort in safe environment that's like bible-class where nothing really happens

[SpaceLimey]

Originally posted by GoyslopConnoisseur88:

first couple paragraphs you typed is actually in the game its called WORKORDERS. can set them from the individual workshops themselves or the workorders menu (requires a manager and an office assigned to the manager). there you can;

1. specify materials and other things like what image to use for statues.
ex: i want to make 20 obsidian statues of my baron, so i click the magnifying glass on the work order and specify both material and image. some items have other parameters you can specify too

2. while looking at the workorder, click the green button next to the magnifying glass with a bunch of symbols on it. here you can specify stuff to be made if your stocks run under a certain number.
ex: I want my weaponsmith to make iron shortswords any time the number in the stockpile is less than 20. so click the button, and in this menu there are parameters to set for stuff like that. theres a lot of stuff in here so im not going to type it all out.

It would be very nice if we had more control, not just more automation. For instance, I wish I could click on a finished good or furniture, and select it for gem encrusting. Or search for a specific item in my stocks to be encrusted. I have some masterwork rings and I only have a few very high quality gems, but I have a lot of other rings too. It would be nice to not have to create a bajillion stockpiles when I could just specify certain items for certain things down to an exactness.

Edit: Also it would be nice if there was information like this in the game that was more easily accessible. I had no clue the magnifying glass under workorders did that, since every other magnifying glass icon is basically an 'inspect this' button.

[ShadowBastard69]

^^ I agree with you 100% on that, specifically so i can encrust stuff.