Install Steam
login
|
language
简体中文 (Simplified Chinese)
繁體中文 (Traditional Chinese)
日本語 (Japanese)
한국어 (Korean)
ไทย (Thai)
Български (Bulgarian)
Čeština (Czech)
Dansk (Danish)
Deutsch (German)
Español - España (Spanish - Spain)
Español - Latinoamérica (Spanish - Latin America)
Ελληνικά (Greek)
Français (French)
Italiano (Italian)
Bahasa Indonesia (Indonesian)
Magyar (Hungarian)
Nederlands (Dutch)
Norsk (Norwegian)
Polski (Polish)
Português (Portuguese - Portugal)
Português - Brasil (Portuguese - Brazil)
Română (Romanian)
Русский (Russian)
Suomi (Finnish)
Svenska (Swedish)
Türkçe (Turkish)
Tiếng Việt (Vietnamese)
Українська (Ukrainian)
Report a translation problem
Discussions Rules and Guidelines
Report this post
My question for those who do understand it, is it going to scale well to fortresses of 80-120 dwarves well, thats were Therapist really shines....
I was a new player once upon a time, and I was extremely happy to use LNP, DFHack, and Dwarf Therapist. Methinks thou doth demean the intelligence of the new player too much, because playing this V1.0 Steam Release is about 100x more complication than playing ASCII with Dwarf Therapist, for me, and I can tell you most "new players" would be able to understand the old version much faster than this version. No hate, no vitriol, I'm a veteran DF player and that's my honest opinion.
the answer for me, is yes it scales and i love it.
I'm reposting my own explanation i put on reddit, but another guy has a great post as well regarding the theory behind why its good.
-------------------------------------------------
I'm going to make up words, but follow along and it'll be fine. We have 3 categories in DF when it comes to working. (You can see the following in the "add work detail" button of the labor details screen (hotkey "y") under CUSTOM DETAIL.
We have Fields as the most general umbrella, like "Stoneworking", which itself contains 4 Professions which are "Masonry", "Stonecutting", "Stone Carving", and "Stone Engraving." These four professions pertain to specific tasks that a dwarf can undertake and gain experience in doing so. You then have Work Details which are custom or default groupings of the above Professions and sometimes entire fields.
When considering how you want to divvy up the workload its important to know how STEAM DF currently assigns dwarves to outstanding tasks. By default, every action in the game that is not specified in the default Work Details is completed by every Dwarf based on proximity and skill to the relevant profession and workshop. It seems like currently workshops will prioritize the highest skilled dwarf available to complete the task before checking to see if less skilled but more available dwarves' can complete the task, depending on the priority you have assigned the task. In this manner the game is auto assigning your dwarfs to just get the task done, and try to have the best man for the job available, but like, it just wants to get the task done you know?
You can control this behavior by defining new custom work details and modifying the default ones. You have 3 choices on the top right of this screen, "Everyone does this" , "Only assigned do this", "no one does this". You also have an additional button below on the right next to the assignment of each dwarf that is a little pick that is either red or green. Green means that the dwarf does it work detail its assigned to and prioritizes it (usually) and is also open to other work as well that "Everyone does". Red means that you lock your dwarf to specifically that work detail and he seeks no other job other than that work detail.
When getting specialized in work details what your really asking is, how do i maximize the quality and speed of a given task based on the dwarfs i have available. If you want to make armor, and you have 2 Skilled armor smiths, naturally you will want them to be focused entirely on just churning out armor and getting those exp points. SO what you do is create a custom work detail and call it, i dunno "IRON BOIS" and select "Armor smithing" as a profession. You then ensure that the middle button "Only assigned can do this" is clicked. You'll automatically have the game sort all your dwarfs and their relevant skill under their name. Select your 2 dwarves that are skilled armor smiths. Then, click the mining pick icon on the far right to make it RED. This means that a dwarf will ONLY do the work detail that it is directly assigned to, which in this cause is armor smithing. Perfect, now you have 2 guys who will just sit at the forge and put in WORK and just eat,♥♥♥♥,and sleep iron. You can by the way assign one dwarf to multiple different work details and utilize the above methods to further add finer control regarding task assignment.
This at a base level is how you start the specialization process. The great thing is that if you don't touch anything, and have all your details set to "everyone helps out" the game just gets the ♥♥♥♥ done following its own logic, and for the most part it does well. But sometimes you want to tell the game. "Hey, i need this ♥♥♥♥ done like, today, right now, or we all die. okay? chop chop". You have a couple exceptions, like Mining and Woodcutting. Because these two professions require tools (pick and axe) you need to specifically say, give this idiot a pick, and give that one an axe and send them, and ONLY THEM out to meet jesus.
(pro tip: miners and woodcutters can function just fine in military squads, but because those two professions have a default "work uniform" that allow them to equip their pick and axe this conflicts with their military equipment in that every time they go between civvy and military life they will ALWAYS change their equipment to match the new uniform, even if it shares equipment types or you have military uniform set to "wear all the time". i.e. your woodcutter will drop its "wood cutting" axe in favor for its "battle" axe EVERYTIME instead of just keeping the same axe, and it'll just randomly pick the new one based on the parameters outlined, so those two professions just take a little bit more time to get ready when SHTF, they'll also completely strip each time they change between roles.)
But for everything else you just start to think about how to make the process more efficient. you have 2 guys making armour, okay, awesome. who gets the mats to their forges? Well we have the base "hauler" work detail, but that assigns the entire FIELD of hauling, which is further divide into 11 professions and you just want them to haul ore, which is granted by "stone hauling". So open up another custom work detail, scroll down to the bottom, click "stone hauling" and select 2 poor souls with no other redeeming qualities and make them pack mules. click the icon to make it red, assign them to no other work detail and now you have 2 unwilling assistants who move rocks from point a to point b.
(to note, not all professions or fields give exp i think as there is no relevant skill, although dwarves do increase their attributes by working (see full list of associated attributes and professions here ("https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Attribute")
But what do they do in the downtime? what if the stockpile is full of ore at the forges and they don't need to haul right now? well you could at that time go back in and unclick the icon to make them available to do other jobs.
There is such a thing as overspecializing, you really don't usually need to so specifically in minute detail outline every action you want your dwarf to do, you just want to think about how important is that dorf and his role to you.
my good armoursmiths and weaponsmiths just do their jobs, have sick ass rooms, and drink and have fun, all the other work is for the peasants, because for me, i don't want them out and about hauling or potentially entering caverns to get snacked on. But other things like woodcutting and stone carving (aka stone smoothing) i put together because those two tasks usually happen at different times. ill have my woodcutter chop down a bunch of ♥♥♥♥ every so often, and then go back to mass smoothing, so its no loss in efficiency. i don't even need to go back and forth on selecting what work detail he's apart off, i have his one detail, which i made as stone carving and woodcutting, and all my stone smooth is priority 4 (normal), while all his woodcutting tasks are priority 1 (highest), which means when i designate a tree to be chopped he stops smoothing, chops a tree, and gets back to smoothing. for me this is efficient because he doing a main task paired with a non competing supplementary task. you could do the same thing with mining and stone smoothing instead. You can also add hauling in here if you wanted, but i usually have hauling set to all unless i have uber specific areas like my minecart and miners hauling from far away
the possibilities are endless.
Other than that try and prioritize your least skilled people as military grunts. but be careful, if these are the same guys who haul ♥♥♥♥ then you might have months where they are training and not hauling and things grind to a halt, so it's all about balance.
give guys primary roles and for the secondary things like stone smoothing or i dunno, butt washing, just leave em unspecified at the start and just start to look around and think, "how can this be more efficient"
you can also use burrows to further delineate the tasks given by making sure that dwarves only work within a certain spatial area and ignore other areas to prevent dwarf #1 walking ALL the way across an active battle field to get that refuse sock when dwarf #2 is like, literally right there he's just a little busy now but he'll get to it okay? jesus get off my back mom. burrows basically tell a dwarf, hey only worry about tasks within this area, and ignore tasks outside this, it does NOT however act as a GET THE HECK IN HERE ITS RAINING BLOOD OUTSIDE button since STEAM DF currently lacks the CIV ALERT feature that is present in classic df.
its a very fun puzzle that is always evolving.
hope i helped, sorry for the novel
I'm guessing you (like me), started playing this when the entire game was a sheer cliff. I also didn't wait too long to pick up dwarf therapist because the classic interface is also miserable for labors. What I'm saying is that if you or I were starting fresh and we had this new labor system vs dwarf therapist, the new labor system would have been much better at easing us into the game and allowed us to not worry so much about the labors while we're trying to figure out everything else that is going on at the same time.
New labour system thinks about jobs in different way and allows you to be more flexible about setting jobs. Now you can with one click change between everyone doing the job, nobody doing the job, or only selected dwarves doing that.
Each system has its upsides and downsides, but I would like your suggestion of having more advanced view.
180 dwarves here. Had to create some categories in the beginning for extra jobs, but overall I don't complain. It isn't as clear to use as Therapist but works surprisingly well so far. From time to time I go there to update what dwarves do skilled labour (those where the skill matters the most) because of migrations or skillups due to mood, but I'm touching it far far far less often than I would do with Dwarf Therapist, so I can focus on other things more.
I never bother with looking for pre-existing skills, just toss them in and let them train.
I think this release is overall a huge positive for the community, and for bringing newbs into this one of a kind game. Im also confident most of the missing features and QoL things will get added over time. But the versatility of dwarf therapist is simply unmatched and I really hope its coming to premium.
ETA: but yes, I would like to save things like custom jobs, uniforms, and schedules so they automatically show up in future forts, reproducing them for every embark is silly.
Basically the best part of DT is the available info and the sorting, not so much that you can set labors in it (but it was good for that, too)
As someone running a 200 person fort right now and also being a new player... no it doesnt really. I always have 60 idle dwarves despite having a butt load of jobs.. hunting gathering crafting soldiering etc.. whose jobs stayed qued for 20 minutes with no dwarf coming to complete them.
That has been the bane of my game when the fort is still low pop ( < 50) and even prio 1 tasks are being ignored because everyone feels like gathering plants is more important even though the food stocks are enough to last 10 years if food production was halted.
There needs to be a way to set the priority for any task that can be done, like the job scheduler in rimworld but then per work detail and not per dwarf (that would be super annoying with 200 of them).