Lets talk about Laser Shock and Dartling

[Kraifwraith tha Ill Krayfish, yo]

I just wasted way too much time penning a talk article on the wiki to learn that wiki talks wont even let u post anymore, and Im not about to create an account on fandom/wikia in order to post in 'discussions' there... such a garbage platform.

here is a raw copy paste from my talk (skip past if u dont care):

<ref>Every point of damage applies an extra electric shock damage-over-time onto affected Bloons. Dartling Gunners with this upgrade also deal bonus damage to shocked Bloons.</ref>
I think the laser shock effect and bottom path dartlings with top crosspath needs to be expanded upon. Testing in sandbox does not specifically help when investigating the exact manner which this mechanic operates.<br>
<ref>Path 1 focuses on focused firing, as indicated by increased accuracy and energy-related upgrades. The first upgrade, [[Focused Firing (BTD6)|Focused Firing]], decreases the projectile deviation of the darts, increasing the overall accuracy of the Dartling Gunner. The next upgrade is the first energy-related upgrade, [[Laser Shock]]; this upgrade adds an electric shock effect to the Dartling Gunner's projectiles so they deal an additional 1 damage to Bloons 1 second after they have been hit, as well as making Bloons take +1 damage from any other Dartling Gunner with the Laser Shock upgrade.</ref>
Laser Shock article link should be worked into another section of this page in order to improve site navigation. As a rule of thumb (afaik) the "Description" portion should not be the only place where a ''function'' of the tower is explained ''and linked'' because while searching the wiki I would expect that other users than myself also disregard the Description portion of a tower due to it being a non-exhaustive and general overview. I think the most salient point here is that the [[Laser Shock]] effect is integral to one of the path's functions in crosspathing, and affects '''all dartlings with laser shock'''<br>
<ref>'''Effect:''' Converts into a laser attack that deals increased damage and pierce. Damage improves from 1 to 2, pierce from 1 to 6, and additionally improves duration of Laser Shock effect.</ref>
<ref>'''Effect:''' Blasts out slow bursts of deadly buckshot instead of spinning rapid-fire darts. Buckshot balls deal 4 damage, pierces through 4 bloons per buckshot, and can knock back bloons. Accuracy decreases and projectiles have much shorter lifespan. With Laser Shock, improves Laser Shock to deal 2 damage per tic instead of 1, and take +2 extra damage from Dartling Gunners with Laser Shock.</ref>
[[Laser Shock (status effect)]] should be easier to access from main tower page. I could only get to this page after navigating to the [[Laser Shock]] page. This tower applies this status effect and so should be prominently featured as related material.
The strategy sections relevant could benefit from including [[Laser Shock]] and [[Laser Shock (status effect)]] approaches, even if only as a stub link point in general tower strategies listed. Existing strategy sections are incomplete, requiring more evidence to back up claims of crosspathing advantages and disadvantages. For instance <ref>When used as crosspath for Path 3, Laser Shock's extra damage increases to [[Buckshot|+2]]/[[Bloon Area Denial System (BTD6)|+3]]/[[Bloon Exclusion Zone|+6]]. This allows Upper Path 3 Dartlings crosspathed with Laser Shock to gain a much larger raw DPS boost in exchange for somewhat less superior buffability and lower rates of knockback.</ref> cited portion on [[Laser Shock]] article is misleading. Im fairly certain top crosspathed buckshots and above gain '''more knockback''' effect, but that effect occurs somewhat less often (with a greatly improved viable range). I think the distinction that middle crosspathed buckshots and above are less accurate with less range and less ''knockback per hit'' should be made clear. Super fast bloons will take less damage if the dartling is less accurate, and so the attack speed increase of middle path is not necessarily able to be utilized in a lot of scenarios.
maybe im just salty that no one wants to talk about my favorite tower :shrug: I do not wish to alter the page myself, as it is already time consuming enough to generate this discussion and sufficiently describe where the information within these articles is lacking or misleading. I also do not like fandom/wikia, so this is the most I can allow myself to do on here. (to elaborate ever so slightly, i cant check this wiki on my phone mid-run. I literally cant navigate on mobile without an ad blocking my view every 15-30 seconds... I will step off the soap box now. cheers! ~~~KR

##END

So with that out of the way... I was doing sandbox testing, and it is surprisingly difficult to even observe how the Laser Shock thing works.... and it is lame and sorta low-key b.s. that *only* dartlings can get more damage out of laser shock, especially seeing that we just got a new hero who provides the laser shock debuff.

I think laser shock is actually bugged. In my tests I place a 1-0-4 and 2-0-4 dartling where they will get equal attack opportunity, run a r200 BAD thru, and record popcount. I place a 2-0-5 dart down with these two and record a new popcount.

my 2-0-4 dartling deals *the same exact amount of damage* regardless of whether or not the 2-0-5 dartling is present...

am I missing something?

If the laser shock BEZ hits a bloon and applies shock, then a laser shock BADS should gain the full +6 too right?

I doubt that it is a case of the BEZ not adding enough damage to be distinguishable..

what is going on here?

[Calculus]

1. I don't think 10x buckshots have more knockback, they just have higher accuracy, so more of the projectiles hit the target, so its knocked back more.

2. Doesn't this +x damage is calculated on the shooting tower, meaning that +6 is only applied to 205?

[Ninja Zyborg]

Originally posted by Kraifwraith tha Ill Krayfish, yo:

I think laser shock is actually bugged. In my tests I place a 1-0-4 and 2-0-4 dartling where they will get equal attack opportunity, run a r200 BAD thru, and record popcount. I place a 2-0-5 dart down with these two and record a new popcount.

my 2-0-4 dartling deals *the same exact amount of damage* regardless of whether or not the 2-0-5 dartling is present...

am I missing something?

If the laser shock BEZ hits a bloon and applies shock, then a laser shock BADS should gain the full +6 too right?

I doubt that it is a case of the BEZ not adding enough damage to be distinguishable..

what is going on here?

Laser shock does the bonus damage when it is reapplied. This means that it has no effect on a tower without laser shock, and it doesn't benefit from other towers that apply laser shock outside of the first hit.

You mentioned using a 1-0-4 dartling in your tests; I assume its dps wasn't affected by laser shock either?