Here's how KSP1 looked when it entered Early Access

[Polysorbate]

There's a lot of misinformation being repeated about the state KSP1 was in at the time it entered Steam Early Access on March 20, 2013. I decided to dig up a few videos from that era:

Pre-Steam Early Access (unknown version number) video by youtuber Robbaz, dated December 26, 2012: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1JPM8ZG3ug

KSP 0.19 update summary video by Scott Manley, dated March 17, 2013: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIPbD0Vlh2U

KSP 0.20 update summary video dated May 24, 2013, by a random youtuber. This was the first Steam Early Access patch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHdl1PiFOAg

It should be clear from watching these videos that Kerbal Space Program entered Steam Early Access as a functioning, decently-performing, but somewhat minimal game. It admittedly did not have a career mode or science collection yet. Science collection came in October 2013 and career mode in July 2014.

KSP 1 was available to purchase prior to its release in Steam Early Access, but there are no standards or expectations for software purchased directly from the developer (certainly not for $8), so comparing its condition at that time to KSP2's $50 Steam Early Access launch is disingenuous at best.

From KSP 1's news post on May 29, 2013:

Originally posted by Developer of the original game:

We don't believe every player should have to be a tester.

[FizzyGig]

yeah people are making HUGE excuses and saying ksp was ♥♥♥♥ which isnt even true at KSP 0.10

[Eekhoorn]

Great times!

Nice... the old space center

[Mickk]

Originally posted by Polysorbate:

Here's how KSP1 looked when it entered Early Access
...snip...

I thought this would be an interesting thread but It seems to start with misinformation.
I may not have been in KSP1 at the earliest opportunity but I remember playing KSP1 along time before it came to steam. There were very few parts to even create a rocket with early on.

This is a link to a Wiki entry for KSP1.
https://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/wiki/Version_history

Below is a quote from that link of the part I think is important for this thread.

v0.7.3
Released June 24th, 2011

Initial Release[2]
Notable Features
Downloaded over 5000 times[3]
No SAS, although SAS module is implemented and generates torque
The only engine, the LV-T30 can only be fed by one FL-T500 attached on its top
The AV-R8 Winglet is just a fin and can't be used to control the vehicle
It is nearly impossible to achieve orbit
Kerbin is the only celestial object, does not rotate, and is a mirror reflection of the example planet from libnoise
The sun is a directional light source at infinite distance
The render distance is only 1500 km, and Kerbin will "sink" into the sky background, vanishing entirely as that altitude is achieved
The original Intercontinental Kraken had not been fixed (Moving far from the KSC will result in shaking and even Rapid Unplanned Disassembly due to floating-point precision loss.)

[Dragonsmen]

Just to be clear to compare development times you would need to look at KSP 0.23 vs the KSP2 launch both represent 3 years of work (being generous on KSP2's side) but does include the fact intercept has over 10x the people working on the game vs what Squad did

[dhalloran]

Originally posted by Mickk:

Originally posted by Polysorbate:

Here's how KSP1 looked when it entered Early Access
...snip...

I thought this would be an interesting thread but It seems to start with misinformation.

[...]

Below is a quote from that link of the part I think is important for this thread.

v0.7.3
Released June 24th, 2011

The version of the game you are talking about here had been developed by essentially one person, who had studied game design but had no experience in game development, as a side-gig, for approximately one year. And IIRC it was free. It would be ridiculous to compare KSP 0.7.3 to the KSP2 release.

It is far more sensible to compare the last KSP alpha, or the steam early access release, with the KSP2 steam early access release. The last KSP alpha was released in October 2014. To see the state of the game at that time there are plenty of youtube videos to refer to. All videos posted by the OP *predate* the final alpha.

[Polysorbate]

Originally posted by Mickk:

I thought this would be an interesting thread but It seems to start with misinformation.
[...]
v0.7.3
Released June 24th, 2011

It did not enter Steam Early Access until March 2013, a fact you would know if you read even the first sentence of my post.

Read the entire post, you might be dazzled at what you can learn if you grow your attention span beyond headlines.

[AngryBaer]

It's a weird comparison to begin with because they aren't making a year 2014 game. They have a bigger team but what evidence do we have that this title isn't also that much more ambitious and complicated? I would be this worried if they struggled to recreate the old game, not make an entirely new and modern game

[Polysorbate]

Originally posted by AngryBaer:

It's a weird comparison to begin with because they aren't making a year 2014 game. They have a bigger team but what evidence do we have that this title isn't also that much more ambitious and complicated? I would be this worried if they struggled to recreate the old game, not make an entirely new and modern game

There are fundamental things that clearly work better in these old videos than in the new game, that's the big problem in my view. These are things which, in my limited game dev experience, should be the first priority, before anything else is worked on. So yes it should be worrying that they're still broken in KSP2 as it sits today. It's dumb to build a house on sand.

"It's early access though!!!!" doesn't work for stuff that some random Mexican with no game development experience managed to put together in a few months, to a degree that ~20 people couldn't match in 7 years. Or 3 years if you want to be charitable. Or a year, if you want to be crazy, I don't care.

[Izny]

Originally posted by Polysorbate:

Originally posted by AngryBaer:

It's a weird comparison to begin with because they aren't making a year 2014 game. They have a bigger team but what evidence do we have that this title isn't also that much more ambitious and complicated? I would be this worried if they struggled to recreate the old game, not make an entirely new and modern game

There are fundamental things that worked better in these old videos than in the new game, that's the big problem in my view. These are things which, in my limited game dev experience, should be the first priority, before anything else is worked on. So yes it should be worrying that they're still broken in KSP2 as it sits. You don't build a house on sand.

limited game dev experience? you mean you made a coin dozer for the app store? XD

[Polysorbate]

Originally posted by Izny:

Originally posted by Polysorbate:

There are fundamental things that worked better in these old videos than in the new game, that's the big problem in my view. These are things which, in my limited game dev experience, should be the first priority, before anything else is worked on. So yes it should be worrying that they're still broken in KSP2 as it sits. You don't build a house on sand.

limited game dev experience? you mean you made a coin dozer for the app store? XD

No I mean I made a indie RTS game a decade ago with hundreds of thousands of downloads.

You get the fundamentals right first. It's horrifying that graphics are the only thing anyone's got something positive to say about with KSP2 - especially when the graphics aren't especially good and grind modern systems to a crawl. Though I understand this might be to do with LODs.

[GarbageCollector]

Man, I remember all those Robbaz videos...

Take me back...

[Polysorbate]

Originally posted by GarbageCollector:

Man, I remember all those Robbaz videos...

Take me back...

I can't take you back, but here's a playlist: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL5Qpq35wmrxwkCKc_5QPbOLHpc7Ungt-A

[Polysorbate]

Originally posted by Thatguy:

Games fun yo. I'm having a blast building planes and junk. Its a shame your not enjoying it. Sucks. Dang, well, good chat... cheer up, things will get better.

KSP1 is a better game by any measure. I sincerely hope you're not doing this for free, I think the devaluation of human labor is immoral.

[AngryBaer]

Originally posted by Polysorbate:

There are fundamental things that clearly work better in these old videos than in the new game, that's the big problem in my view. These are things which, in my limited game dev experience, should be the first priority, before anything else is worked on. So yes it should be worrying that they're still broken in KSP2 as it sits today. It's dumb to build a house on sand.

They are not making that game though. They are making a new game. And we have no clue what is 95% done and not accessible in this EA version. I know for most clients there is no difference between 0% and 95% I just find that kind of an unsatisfying attitude.

So far I haven't seen any evidence this game is unsalvageable. The issue I'm seeing is the price tag and the huge difference in experience, ranging from "can't launch the game" and "this part doesn't do what I want". The issues are already being addressed, and you can avoid the price tag by not buying the game at this point.

[sfjuocekr]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7Wl0tifVn8&ab_channel=sfjuocekr

This was also ten years ago and was probably 0.10-0.13, don't look at the other two videos I made when I was stupid drunk :D