Jill is a Mary Sue (SPOILERS)

[The Dirty Chavez]

Let me start off by saying that I am aware that the RE series is known to exaggerate human strength from time-to-time (Chris punching a rock anyone?). However, RE3R is the worst culprit by far.

The first time I played through the game, it was actually annoying how many scenarios they put Jill through where she should CLEARLY be dead. RE3R reminded me of a poorly directed modern Hollywood action movie, with characters surviving time and time again. It really takes away from Jill's character because she has been transformed from badass STARS to a Mary Sue. Interestingly, I can't remember any such moments while playing as Carlos. It just goes to show how much more effort was put into the RE2R.

Here are a few examples where Jill should 100% be dead:

1. When Jill is escaping the apartment, and explosion from behind knocks her with enough force to knock her through a door, but then she is magically stopped by a railing that only comes up to her waist

2. Driving a car off the roof of the parking garage

3. When escaping rocket launcher Nemesis, the last rocket (before the rolling head scene) lands less than 3 feet from Jill

4 and 5. Anytime Jill fires a handheld railgun (so that counts as 2 deaths)

This isn't all of the examples, but just the ones that I remember off the top of my head. I don't understand their inclusion in the game, as the ridiculousness of her survival adds absolutely no value. She would be much more interesting if she survived more realistic scenarios.

Also, Nemesis just toys with her throughout the game. In the original RE3, if Nemesis grabbed you, you were dead. In RE3R, he grabs Jill climbing up a ladder, gives her the stink eye, and throws her? He could have crushed her head like Mr. X in the prison, or stuck a tentacle through her like RE3, or used the flamethrower that he was carrying. This just makes Nemesis feel like less of a threat. Why even include him in this scene? They even somehow managed to make Nemesis 2 feel very non-threatening. For some reason, they made him way bigger than the original game, and he should be large enough to kill Jill with one bite, yet he still just toys with her.

Any time Nemesis grabs you with his tentacle, he just sits there for 5 seconds and waits for you to recover. Why even include such an annoying gameplay mechanic if it doesn't amount to anything? The original game was so much better than this garbage.

[Sticky White Stuff]

You must be the first person to say that, because everyone else is saying that Jill is a strong whamen who gives in to no man, despite her depending on Carlos so many times it's laughable.
If it wasn't for Carlos, she would have been dead so many times.
But nah, bruh, she swears and she is sassy, it must be a work of an enemy 『 Political Agenda 』

Now for the Railgun, that really doesn't have to make any sense. Because in the original, nothing made any sense whatsoever. Why would a City Gate be locked by some weird Crystals that ANYONE can take at ANY time. Or why would she go to the RPD for her Lockpick that is literally made by bending two needles together. AKA a handmade lockpick, not a professional one. Or the Battery for the Substation. Nothing makes sense, however it makes for a fun experience because of the puzzles.

But yes, i agree with you. Other people might not, because they have their head up their ass so deep they perceive an alternate reality.

[FormerFishFarmer]

Well, there are two possible answers here.
1) The obvious: To paraphrase the greatest philosophers of our age:
"I you're wondering how Jill lives and breaths and other science facts (LA! LA! LA!)
Just repeat to yourself it's just a game
And I should really just relax
For the Resident Evil 3 Remake!!!!!!"

2) This is a hint at something much deeper in the game.
Possible Spoilers/Not Really I'm Pulling This Out Of Basically Nowhere But It's Fun To Think About And I'm Bored And Two Bottles Into My Second Sixpack Of Hard Lemonaid:





We see over and over again that the most powerful monsters are made from people with an innate resistance to the various viruses, weather it be the original DNA donor for the Tyrants to the Weskers to Krauser. In fact, it is eventually revealed in RE5 that the progenitor virus either kills the infected or makes them superhuman. Jill is exposed to a very early version of the Virus, very close to that progenitor. She is show, over and over throughout the series, to be hugely resistant to all forms of the virus. The conclusion, therefore, is that she is in fact infected, and has been since the very beginning. It is a slow burn infection similar to the original progenitor infection, making here super human rather than monstrous. This explains both the reactions of Nemesis (he sees her as a target, but once he makes contact she would read as what amounts to a small Tyrant and he throws her aside and looks to reacquire his "actual" target) and her superhuman physical abilities. In fact,
(Real Spoilers This Time)
In one of the later episodes, Jill survives an absolutely unsurvivable fall (thousands of feet onto jagged rocks, if she was human, she died) and shows up later as the brainwashed enforcer to the main baddie. This brainwashed version of Jill displays profoundly superhuman abilities, which she immediately looses upon regaining her senses. Conclusion: Jill behaving human at all is actually a force of habit on her part. That is why minor herbal remedies and antibacterial sprays cause miraculous healing. Green herbs and first aid sprays do nothing. They serve as a mental trigger, allowing her to take the breaks off the virus and let it heal her. It's why she is only slightly inconvenienced by massive falls, terrible burns, and the blast waves from explosives.
One last thing: Vaccines don't kill viruses. They prime a healthy bodies immune system with dead viral cells in order to "train" it to fight the real thing latter (it's a crappy explanation, but close enough for video game work). Meaning that that vial Carlos gave her to "cure" her of the massive dose of virus injected into her by a dying Nemesis did exactly nothing. In fact, it may have actually increased her viral load a little bit. Whatever walked out of that hospital room was far from human.
So if you have a problem with Jill Valentine, ex cop, killing Nemesis, then take solace in the fact that it was actually Jill Valentine, small, royally pissed off, heavily armed Proto-Tyrant that did the killing.

[THE VERY REVEREND MISTER BONK]

Correction - she is a Boy named Sue. This explains her attitude problem.

https://youtu.be/_Gbtm-93oqE

[KatArus]

Mary Sue is the only type of character lazy losers can relate to. Their success is always only one superpower away.

[Grimm Carrolls]

I don't like RE3make's Jill, but she's hardly a Mary Sue. Sure, everyone likes her and notes her ability, but she's saved by Carlos about three times.

She is a horrible character, though.

[The Dirty Chavez]

Originally posted by GLUE:

You must be the first person to say that, because everyone else is saying that Jill is a strong whamen who gives in to no man, despite her depending on Carlos so many times it's laughable.
If it wasn't for Carlos, she would have been dead so many times.
But nah, bruh, she swears and she is sassy, it must be a work of an enemy 『 Political Agenda 』

Now for the Railgun, that really doesn't have to make any sense. Because in the original, nothing made any sense whatsoever. Why would a City Gate be locked by some weird Crystals that ANYONE can take at ANY time. Or why would she go to the RPD for her Lockpick that is literally made by bending two needles together. AKA a handmade lockpick, not a professional one. Or the Battery for the Substation. Nothing makes sense, however it makes for a fun experience because of the puzzles.

But yes, i agree with you. Other people might not, because they have their head up their ass so deep they perceive an alternate reality.

I think there is a difference between "this doesn't make sense" and "this defies all known laws of physics." In the original game, the prototype weapon was fixed in place, so the recoil of the weapon is irrelevant. In the remake, it appears to be a hand-carried railgun. A single shot would destroy whoever is carrying the weapon, at least rip their arms off, but she shoots the thing as if it has no recoil.

Again, if they are going to change something from the original game, at least make it make sense. If it doesn't make sense, then don't change it.

[Sticky White Stuff]

Originally posted by turnbullroad:

Originally posted by GLUE:

You must be the first person to say that, because everyone else is saying that Jill is a strong whamen who gives in to no man, despite her depending on Carlos so many times it's laughable.
If it wasn't for Carlos, she would have been dead so many times.
But nah, bruh, she swears and she is sassy, it must be a work of an enemy 『 Political Agenda 』

Now for the Railgun, that really doesn't have to make any sense. Because in the original, nothing made any sense whatsoever. Why would a City Gate be locked by some weird Crystals that ANYONE can take at ANY time. Or why would she go to the RPD for her Lockpick that is literally made by bending two needles together. AKA a handmade lockpick, not a professional one. Or the Battery for the Substation. Nothing makes sense, however it makes for a fun experience because of the puzzles.

But yes, i agree with you. Other people might not, because they have their head up their ass so deep they perceive an alternate reality.

I think there is a difference between "this doesn't make sense" and "this defies all known laws of physics." In the original game, the prototype weapon was fixed in place, so the recoil of the weapon is irrelevant. In the remake, it appears to be a hand-carried railgun. A single shot would destroy whoever is carrying the weapon, at least rip their arms off, but she shoots the thing as if it has no recoil.

No matter how you look at it, the Railgun doesn't make any sense considering it melts 10 walls when fired. Why would anyone use it in the facilty is beyond me.

One thing to note is that the cinematography when you fire the Railgun is one of the best moments in the game. You fire it, the floor blows off, Nemesis is heavily wounded, the batteries switch to off and the original remixed music kicks in perfectly in sync.

In the original, it's fixed into place, yes. But it also destroys a large portion of the map, which again, goes against the function of the weapon. It says they actually used it to destroy the BOWs such as the Mr.X type Tyrants which Nemesis Parasite feeds at the start of the fight. But how can that be, because it blows a hole through the facility when you fire it?

For me, while funny in REmake3, i still enjoyed that scene. Especially when you show it in his mouth and blast it in a showering pool of blood.

Both endings are decent, however i really like the original when you can use the Magnum to finish Nemesis off. If you don't do anything he spits at you for the last time.
it is more grounded. I think they wanted to go with a big bang here.

[The Dirty Chavez]

Originally posted by TheEvilFatGuy:

One last thing: Vaccines don't kill viruses. They prime a healthy bodies immune system with dead viral cells in order to "train" it to fight the real thing latter (it's a crappy explanation, but close enough for video game work). Meaning that that vial Carlos gave her to "cure" her of the massive dose of virus injected into her by a dying Nemesis did exactly nothing. In fact, it may have actually increased her viral load a little bit. Whatever walked out of that hospital room was far from human.

Actually, some vaccines are proactive (prophylactic) and some are reactive (therapeutic). I just learned that myself. It is entirely plausible that the vaccine is of the therapeutic type.

[The Dirty Chavez]

Originally posted by GLUE:

Originally posted by turnbullroad:

I think there is a difference between "this doesn't make sense" and "this defies all known laws of physics." In the original game, the prototype weapon was fixed in place, so the recoil of the weapon is irrelevant. In the remake, it appears to be a hand-carried railgun. A single shot would destroy whoever is carrying the weapon, at least rip their arms off, but she shoots the thing as if it has no recoil.

No matter how you look at it, the Railgun doesn't make any sense considering it melts 10 walls when fired. Why would anyone use it in the facilty is beyond me.

One thing to note is that the cinematography when you fire the Railgun is one of the best moments in the game. You fire it, the floor blows off, Nemesis is heavily wounded, the batteries switch to off and the original remixed music kicks in perfectly in sync.

In the original, it's fixed into place, yes. But it also destroys a large portion of the map, which again, goes against the function of the weapon. It says they actually used it to destroy the BOWs such as the Mr.X type Tyrants which Nemesis Parasite feeds at the start of the fight. But how can that be, because it blows a hole through the facility when you fire it?

For me, while funny in REmake3, i still enjoyed that scene. Especially when you show it in his mouth and blast it in a showering pool of blood.

Both endings are decent, however i really like the original when you can use the Magnum to finish Nemesis off. If you don't do anything he spits at you for the last time.
it is more grounded. I think they wanted to go with a big bang here.

I am not referring to the practically of the weapon. I am just saying that in the original game, Jill would not have been harmed by the weapon because she wasn't holding it, but in the remake, she effectively should have died twice.

[Erebus]

Originally posted by turnbullroad:

Let me start off by saying that I am aware that the RE series is known to exaggerate human strength from time-to-time (Chris punching a rock anyone?). However, RE3R is the worst culprit by far.

The first time I played through the game, it was actually annoying how many scenarios they put Jill through where she should CLEARLY be dead.

...Did you even play the other games? All the main cast would be dead many different ways dozens and dozens of times over just factoring the canon cutscenes/progression moments.

[FormerFishFarmer]

Originally posted by turnbullroad:

Originally posted by TheEvilFatGuy:

One last thing: Vaccines don't kill viruses. They prime a healthy bodies immune system with dead viral cells in order to "train" it to fight the real thing latter (it's a crappy explanation, but close enough for video game work). Meaning that that vial Carlos gave her to "cure" her of the massive dose of virus injected into her by a dying Nemesis did exactly nothing. In fact, it may have actually increased her viral load a little bit. Whatever walked out of that hospital room was far from human.

Actually, some vaccines are proactive (prophylactic) and some are reactive (therapeutic). I just learned that myself. It is entirely plausible that the vaccine is of the therapeutic type.

The thing I had always understood with Therapeutic variety is that they relied on improving the bodies natural, preexisting capacity to combat a virus, i.e., Jill would have still have to have had the type of Virus resistance seen in the other super monsters such as the Tyrants. Of course, I haven't read up on them in years now, so I may be just crazy out of date here.
And as always, Rule #1 is probably the best answer ;)

[The Dirty Chavez]

Originally posted by Erebus:

Originally posted by turnbullroad:

Let me start off by saying that I am aware that the RE series is known to exaggerate human strength from time-to-time (Chris punching a rock anyone?). However, RE3R is the worst culprit by far.

The first time I played through the game, it was actually annoying how many scenarios they put Jill through where she should CLEARLY be dead.

...Did you even play the other games? All the main cast would be dead many different ways dozens and dozens of times over just factoring the canon cutscenes/progression moments.

Yes I did, as I had previously mentioned and you even quoted me saying so. However, other games did not have as many situations as RE3R, and not as ridiculous RE3R.

[Wrayday]

Well, a few parts of the game are a bit exaggerated but, I wouldn't call Jill a Mary Sue.

Depending on the type of RPG/Rocket used they are usually a shape charge projectile. Meaning they are designed to penetrate the hull of a tank or armored car. They aren't designed to explode out fragmentation like a hand grenade. So yeah, that rocket is hella close for dramatic purposes, but it is survivable.

As for the door at the start .... well, the heat from the fire would of melted all her soft tissue like cartilage/hair/eyes/lungs well before she made it to that door. But, in theory, if that door opened outwards she could hit it hard enough to pop it open. I can't remember but, I think if an explosion pushes you away it's far better than if it passes thru you .,.. something like the shockwave is pushing you instead of your interal organs attempting to absorb the energy.

Part of me just wonders if Jill is laying in the car and the rest of the game is just in her imagination as she succumbs to her injuries... cause yeah, she be dead because that was a 6story drop with no airbag or seatbelt.

IF ONLY THEY HAD JUST STUCK TO THE RE3: NEMESIS SCRIPT - none of this ♥♥♥♥ would come up... because it wasn't in the game. Hell I am kinda sure Carlos shot down that chopper.

[James.Havoc]

Its called "plot armor", not Mary Sue. And plot armor is part of the franchise since day 1. This one isn't even the worst in those terms. That candle goes to RE6.

In the original RE3, if Nemesis grabbed you, you were dead

Only in cutscenes against Nicholai and Brad. In-game a grab could end in:

- Tossing Jill/Carlos etc. around and causing a good portion of damage

- Killing Jill/Carlos etc. if they where low on health by the moment the got grabbed

- Lifting Jill/Carlos etc. up and let them go right afterwards. Causing no damage at all.

[AstrOnUt]

But you have to struggle to get out of nemesis' grasp in the original, he's not tossing his targets arounds for no reason like he's larping as Andre the giant, and you said it, in cutscenes he kills what he grabs.
Nemesis is a joke in re3r (i admit he's great at killing forgettable npc though), the writing is just as terrible as re6 and i don't know who that main character is, probably a sister or a clone of alice from those fking paul ws anderson movies, but that's no Jill. She's not a mary sue but she's one Carlos' save away from deserving that title.