Bifelgan's Bounty is in reality a Magical Attack.

[SaN]

After a quick search I've noticed that there is no discussions on Steam about this.

Despite the game description and what I have just read on fandom.com(top Google result), Bifelgan's Bounty(Merchant DS) is in reality a Magical Attack so its calculated with Elemental Attack stat like all Magical Attacks.

Bifelgan's Bounty is one of the few Neutral Element attacks of the game aka the Seventh Element.

That means Bifelgan's Bounty can't break weaknesses.

Now you can use it well for big damage and money making, HF.

[Melodia]

The description literally says "Deal non-elemental damage"....it's boggling so many people are confused by this. If it were physical, why would it include the word elemental at all? I knew exactly what it was before I ever used it.

And yes, the wiki is wrong for some reason.

[SaN]

People are not confused by this, the game description is wrong because Bifelgan's Bounty have the Physical Attack icon and thats why the wiki is wrong.

As Neutral Element can be Physical or Magical in this game and despite a wrong icon in the game description you said: "I knew exactly what it was before I ever used it." You are very funny Mister "smart" guy. xD

[marcv666]

Yea, the term "non-elemental" is confusing since this is the only skill using that kind of definition in the game. Also like San playing Hades mentionned the skill have a physical attack icon. The game makes it very clear that it is a physical attack while in reality it is not at all.

For those who are familiar with the resources I have shared to the community, this is what I wrote about this skill:
Damage exceeding the monsters HP won't give you anymore gold. Even though the tooptip explicitly says "non-elemental attack" and the icon is a physical attack, this is misleading. The damage is based on your Elem. Atk. and everything that boost you Elem. Atk. will affect this skill and everything related to Phys. Atk. won't do any good with this skill.
from: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/14Kz5mTAYdxqdgjbkbotAMGC2aoiJBbrBUiLeh8Pwu0Q/edit?usp=sharing

And this is not the only mistake in the game. For instance, when you boost the Analyse spell with 3 boost points, the tool tips says it will reveal 4 weakness but in fact it reveal all 5 weakness if an enemies has up to 5.

Also the tooltip for Intimidation support skill is wrong. It says to apply both Physical Attack and Elemental Defense debuff but it's not Elemental Defense but rather Elemental Attack debuff.

[Melodia]

Originally posted by marcv666:

Yea, the term "non-elemental" is confusing since this is the only skill using that kind of definition in the game. Also like San playing Hades mentionned the skill have a physical attack icon. The game makes it very clear that it is a physical attack while in reality it is not at all.

I never did notice the icon, so I suppose that's fair.
The Japanese text according to GTranslate says "non-attribute damage" though removing a weird character changes it to "non-elemental".....someone with actual Japanese knowledge could help there.

Originally posted by marcv666:

And this is not the only mistake in the game. For instance, when you boost the Analyse spell with 3 boost points, the tool tips says it will reveal 4 weakness but in fact it reveal all 5 weakness if an enemies has up to 5.

That is clearly a typo in English. It clearly says 'all' in Japanese. Also says 4 in Spanish and German.....I assume, like seems to be common, the other languages used English as the base translation.

Of course you didn't mention probably the worst description of them all -- that of Werner's Sword which doesn't mention that it only is successful when you crit. Interestingly the Japanese is the same here, Gtranslate gives "Attack effect: Always critical if hit".

[Melodia]

Originally posted by marcv666:

Yea, the term "non-elemental" is confusing since this is the only skill using that kind of definition in the game. Also like San playing Hades mentionned the skill have a physical attack icon. The game makes it very clear that it is a physical attack while in reality it is not at all.

I never did notice the icon, so I suppose that's fair.
The Japanese text according to GTranslate says "non-attribute damage" though removing a weird character changes it to "non-elemental".....someone with actual Japanese knowledge could help there.

Originally posted by marcv666:

And this is not the only mistake in the game. For instance, when you boost the Analyse spell with 3 boost points, the tool tips says it will reveal 4 weakness but in fact it reveal all 5 weakness if an enemies has up to 5.

That is clearly a typo in English. It clearly says 'all' in Japanese. Also says 4 in Spanish and German.....I assume, like seems to be common, the other languages used English as the base translation.

Of course you didn't mention probably the worst description of them all -- that of Werner's Sword which doesn't mention that it has a low hit rate because it only counts crits as successes.
Interestingly the Japanese is the same here, Gtranslate gives "Attack effect: Always critical if hit".

[marcv666]

Also the fandom wiki on Octopath Traveler is not your best source of info for the game. It has several errors in it. I fixed a few of them but I stopped helping the page when I realized that people copy info from other source into the wiki without verifying if their source of info is good or not.

For instance the Exp chart was copied from another chart that was existing on the net but it had an error in it. When I fixed the error on the wiki the original author reverted my changed, and I had to tell him he's an idiot copying and trusting other source without verifying the validity. In the end the wiki got fixed for this one but from this point I saw several other mistake in it but I didn't bother them and created my own resource file instead (link above in the previous comment).

[marcv666]

Originally posted by Melodia:

That is clearly a typo in English. It clearly says 'all' in Japanese. Also says 4 in Spanish and German.....I assume, like seems to be common, the other languages used English as the base translation.

Of course you didn't mention probably the worst description of them all -- that of Werner's Sword which doesn't mention that it has a low hit rate because it only counts crits as successes.
Interestingly the Japanese is the same here, Gtranslate gives "Attack effect: Always critical if hit".

Nice to know that in Japanese it has the right tooltip for Analyse. Having checked on the French translation when I created my resource file, i'm not sure at all if they used the Japanese or English to make the french translation. I've worked with friend helping with the Chinese translation and from what I've talked there are things that both French and Chinese fit but doesn't fit with English. There are other things that fits both French and English. From what i've seen I really don't know but if I had to put money, I'd say they did the French from the Japanese. I think the best explanation would be that they started the translation before the game was finished and while they fixed some things in Japanese, they didn't fix for every language. This would be my best guess of what happened.

As for Werner's Sword, from what i've tested, increasing your critical stat doesn't increase at all the hit rate of the sword. I think this sword is just completely random just like when you use Arrowstorm or Thousand Spears. Probably something like 50% chance to hit but when you land your hit it will be a crit.

About weapon there's also the Battle-tested Blade with: "Attack: Augments physical abilities". "Attack" is wrong. It should be "Equip" because it increase damage by 30% for any weapon you use when it is equipped.

[marcv666]

Originally posted by Melodia:

I never did notice the icon, so I suppose that's fair.
The Japanese text according to GTranslate says "non-attribute damage" though removing a weird character changes it to "non-elemental".....someone with actual Japanese knowledge could help there.

yeah this would be interesting to know! :)

[SaN]

Originally posted by marcv666:

The damage is based on your Elem. Atk. and everything that boost you Elem. Atk. will affect this skill and everything related to Phys. Atk. won't do any good with this skill.
from: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/14Kz5mTAYdxqdgjbkbotAMGC2aoiJBbrBUiLeh8Pwu0Q/edit?usp=sharing

Wow, your doc is the most complete i've ever seen for this game. Very nice job.

[marcv666]

Originally posted by SaN playing Hades:

Wow, your doc is the most complete i've ever seen for this game. Very nice job.

Thanks, took me a lot of time testing and compiling all this info. It is included in one of the Guide here on steam. If you need anything check out some guide here on steam, you're likely going to find what you are looking here.

[SaN]

Ok, thx.

[Melodia]

There's also this for more actual mechanics stuff
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1RJJnHXJICBrQyhxFBqxLwpwf-kzz3tjD/edit

[SaN]

Thx, I am trying to undestand what is the best team of 4 in this game(not including the last hidden dungeon).

For now I am not sure but I am thinking is starting with Tressa then taking Cyrus, Olberic, Ophilia, finally removing Cyrus for Therion and temporary removing Ophilia to switch with any of the others when needed.

Tressa Scholar then Runelord.
Olberic Hunter at start then Apothecary when Axe is the best weapon we have and finally Warmaster.
Ophilia Dancer then Sorcerer.
Therion Warrior at start then Hunter when Olberic become Apothecary.

I am not sure about Tressa maybe starting with Cyrus and keeping him as Merchant is a better team composition because he have a better start and the best elemental attack.

Tressa is the best for money but I dont remember having not enough money. I will do some tests.

[marcv666]

The best team composition in the game is highly subjective. It depends a lot what you are doing. Like are you speed running are you doing a low level challenge, are you in the early stage of the game or are you late late game...

In the early stage of the game if you use every trick in the book and your goal is to start leveling up very fast, I would argue the following team is the absolute best team composition to start with.
1st Tressa as the best starting character for her Purchase ability
2nd and 3rd pick would be Therion for opening locked chest and Cyrus for his 2-hit spells.
and 4th would be H'aanit because of her arrowstorm ability which enables you to farm in Maw of the Ice Dragon (level 45 dungeon) at very low level.

With this team above it takes me less than 1h30 to have all 8 basic subclass, all town teleportation point and very good gear on all 4 characters and ready to start leveling up in Maw of the Ice Dragon (a level 45 dungeon). I usually go there at level 18 and I kill everything on turn 1 without much luck needed.

I'll probably upload a video this week showing you the above, how you can power up yourself in the begining.

[SaN]

There is an objective best team of 4 in the game because the game is always the same and is the same for all of us.

This team is not the easiest to beat the game with but the hardest to kill for the game(It can be the same team.)

In other words this team is the objective strongest team for the game aka the most adapted team to clear the game without game over and without grinding.

Speedrunning is like another mode and grinding is playing the game on easy mode.

For example in Final Fantasy 7 the strongest team possible is Cloud, Barret and Cid(Yuffie is very close to Cid) This is not easy to answer and to understand but its the truth.

For Octopath the question is a lot harder to answer, I think its the hardest RPG I have played for answering this question.

So far with the team of 4 I was talking about I can beat the game without any grinding and any game over and kill the four avatars when I am at chapter 3.

So this team is very very strong but I am not sure is the strongest.

I think Olberic is better than Haanit mostly because he is a lot harder to kill and because Bolster Defense is very strong to defeat physical damage ennemies. With at least one merchant Olberic can use Bolster Defense every turn without using any items and this is insanely strong against Physical Damage. There is a lot of ennemies and bosses that are very strong Physical Damage dealers. Olberic totally ruins them.

Haanit is a very good char and her beasts are very useful too mostly for breaking and debuffing ennemies before Post-Game. She can be better than Olberic later but only in Post-Game(Hidden boss fight)

Therion is faster than Haanit that means as Hunter with arrowstorm he can break ennemies before her.

With Olberic as main Physical Damage dealer, Tressa as main Magical Damage dealer and Ophilia as Dancer its possible to buff Olberic with Abide and Tressa with Peacock Strut in only one turn, this is the best way I know to maximise damage in this game. With Haanit in the team we cant do that. Except with Primrose instead of Ophilia and Therion as Dancer. Ophilia is stronger than Primrose at this role and having Therion as Dancer we loose the ability to switch Therion to another job when hunter is not the job we need the most.

Thats mainly why Olberic > Haanit and Ophilia > Primrose.

Then Olberic is the most hard to kill Warmaster possible and Ophilia is a better Sorcerer than Prim.

Then its hard to understand who is the best between Tressa and Cyrus. Tressa is a better Runelord than Cyrus but Cyrus is very good at Runelord too. Then its hard to understand who is the best. Bolster Defense is no more very usefull at this moment of the game so we can forget about the combo between Donate BP and Bolster Defense but Tressa Mercenaries are still very strong for breaking and for dealing big damage.
Not having Cyrus is loosing analyse and his 2hits spells. Knowing weaknesses is very very strong. But at this moment in the game Olberic and Ophilia can keep the entire party alive for a very long time, the time to find the weaknesses we need to know.

Thats why I think Tressa > Cyrus with this team composition and strategy.