This game indirectly killed Piranha Bytes

[PALPUS]

The studio was shut down..

[spike86]

more semi good news
https://www-cdaction-pl.translate.goog/publicystyka/rewolucja-w-piranha-bytes-co-sie-dzieje-u-tworcow-gothica-tylko-u-nas?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp&_x_tr_hist=true

[spike86]

somehow the link I've seen doesn't work 🤷🏻‍♂️

the original in Polish is here
https://www.cdaction.pl/publicystyka/rewolucja-w-piranha-bytes-co-sie-dzieje-u-tworcow-gothica-tylko-u-nas?_x_tr_hist=true

[Amigo]

Theres nothing really new there

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ABOUT 13 HOURS AGO READING FOR 7 MINUTES
INTERVIEW
Revolution in Piranha Bytes. What's going on with the creators of Gothic? [ONLY HERE]
There has been a lot of talk about the closure of Piranha Bytes for several days now. The actual statement is not expected to be published until next week, but apart from the rumors, there has also been a lot of behind-the-scenes information. We managed to talk to journalist Andre Peschke, who is in contact with the studio's employees.



FILIP CHRZUSZCZ
GOTHIC
ELEX
PIRANHA BYTES
Andre Peschke is a German journalist who has been covering the gaming industry for 24 years. He worked as a screenwriter, managed his own studio and served as editor-in-chief of Krawall.de and GameStar. In 2015, together with Jochen Gebauer, former editor-in-chief of GameStar, he founded The Pod, which has become one of the most popular podcasts (you can find it at this link ) about electronic entertainment in Germany. It was Andre who provided some of the first information about the disturbing situation of Piranha Bytes . Now he shares more with CD-Action and draws a broader picture of the situation in which the creators of Gothic, Risen and Eleks find themselves.

Filip Chrzuszcz: Let's start with the situation with Björn Pankratz. Did he really leave the studio last year?

Andre Peschke: Yes. Björn left the studio back in November, and the closure of Piranha Bytes was rather a catalyst for his decision. There was a conflict of interest within the team, which had been growing for a long time.

This is also visible in the studio's social media, the profiles that Björn and his wife took over to constantly post about Eleks.

There are two issues to note here. The first is regular vlogs, which, as people have rightly pointed out, have stopped appearing since November (i.e. since Björn left). I've heard there are some unaired episodes, but I can't confirm that. The second thing is that the X and Facebook accounts are programmed to post about Elex for a period of time, but there is no real human there to manage it.

Piranha Bytes' social media has not been functioning properly for some time.

Piranha Bytes' social media has not been functioning properly for some time.
The German government funding website had the title WIKI6, which, according to Reddit investigators, was supposed to be Eleks 3. WIKI6 disappeared, but under Piranha Bytes it was signed Currywurst. Are these projects any different?

WIKI6 and Currywurst are basically the same thing. Both projects are subsidies for Eleks 3. There have been speculations due to the title change that since Piranha Bytes is closing, the government has removed WIKI6 from the list of subsidies, but this is more about a simple confusion with the documentation, which is why the project had to be resubmitted for other name. I heard all this from employees, but I have no official confirmation from the government whether the situation was this way. If the studio closes, there will of course be no question of granting funds, but the funding is still active, as we can see on the website, which means that Piranha Bytes will most likely retain three million euros if a new publisher is found. This is not certain and the terms of such a subsidy would have to be reviewed, but from what employees said, it is possible. The question is whether the full amount will be paid in the event of takeover by a new publisher who decides to reduce the scale of the project. Well, a lot of unknowns.

The Currywurst project is actually state funding for Eleks 3.

The Currywurst project is actually state funding for Eleks 3.
Let's move on to the situation of employees. They probably knew about the possible closure in advance and could have prepared for a possible job loss?

They've certainly known since at least November. They kept it really secret, because when I first heard rumors about a possible closure and asked people in the industry, no one had any idea about such a situation, so I wasn't sure if it was true. The German gaming industry is not large and the connections between studios are huge, yet information about Piranha Bytes remained secret for a really long time . Of course, the best insider from the studio was Björn, who left in November and since then it has been really difficult to get in touch with him.

“
Björn left the studio back in November, and the closure of Piranha Bytes was rather a catalyst for his decision.

There were rumors that the team wanted to create a new Gothic. Did Björn block this process in any way, which could have contributed to the conflict of interest?

Piranha Bytes employees did not want to create a strictly new Gothic, in the sense of another part of the series, but something similar, certainly in terms of scale. They wanted to move away from large SF and focus on dark fantasy with a smaller world. Björn has repeatedly emphasized that he does not want to return to this brand or anything like it, so he was fully committed to developing Eleks. This, of course, led to divisions, because if the most important person responsible for the creative direction of the project is not open to other proposals, conflict is inevitable. You know, if we are dealing with a leader who runs his projects with an iron fist, but the studio achieves success, then such a person can be trusted. Then maybe not everyone is happy, but you can see that this person knows what he is doing. Unfortunately, Elex 2 did not work out and there were no arguments for Björn anymore.

Piranhas' plans for the future included something like a "new" Gothic.

Piranhas' plans for the future included something like a "new" Gothic.
And while we're at it, do you know whose idea it was to release Eleks 2 a week after the premiere of Elden Ring?

People from Piranha Bytes and THQ Nordic were not happy with the release date of Eleks 2, so it had to be "patted" somewhere higher, most likely from Embracer. Unfortunately, I don't know the details about this situation. A brave or desperate decision - that's for sure.

THQ Nordic really stood up for Piranha Bytes?

From what I understand, THQ Nordic would love to keep the studio if it was entirely up to them . When employees received notice of termination in December, they were given the entire month of December to prepare a presentation to other potential publishers who would like to buy the studio. People also have great faith in the current president of Piranha Bytes, Michael Rüve, and from conversations with employees it appears that he has the full support of his employees when making subsequent decisions.

“
Piranha Bytes wanted to move away from large SF and focus on dark fantasy with a smaller world.

I heard from one of the employees that an official announcement from the studio will appear next week.

The studio would love to make such an announcement as soon as possible, but it still needs to work with Embracer. I don't know what this message will look like or how much Embracer will let it say. Usually this kind of information is quite limited and does not satisfy the community, but it is better than nothing. I know that Piranha Bytes wants to hear from players as soon as possible, but, as I mentioned, its hands are a bit tied.

Is any publisher already interested in acquiring Piranha Bytes?

At least two are in contact with the studio, and I know this from both employees and potential publishers. Of course, the current times are not conducive to taking over the studies, rather reducing the staff or closing them completely, but the two I mentioned are sincerely and seriously interested. I don't know what it looks like from the legal point of view, but Piranha received funding for an open world game, so there's probably nothing stopping you from converting Eleks 3 for a given publisher into something smaller, while still retaining the funding.

Elex 2 as a project simply did not pay off.

Elex 2 as a project simply did not pay off.
So is there a chance that Piranha Bytes will survive?

Yes. I don't know if it's possible given the current state of the industry, but is there a chance? Yes. Is it huge? Not quite, but it's still not zero percent. One thing I haven't made public yet is that Piranha is considering starting a Kickstarter campaign. Of course, this is plan B if talks with other publishers fail. She wouldn't be able to finance everything on Kickstarter, but it could buy her some time and if the fundraising was successful, she would have a good argument for interested publishers. The problem, however, is that preparing such a project requires a lot of time, which Piranha does not have at the moment. The longer it takes, the more difficult it is to assemble a team, because for obvious reasons employees will leave for other companies.

[gemesil]

I understand why. But their games will be missed

[ParabolaWaVe]

Originally posted by Яeplicant:

Nah, if anything, Embracer Group and a partnership that didn't pan out basically lead to PB and other studios being closed off. Plus, PB clearly made a mistake releasing Elex 2 shortly after Elden Ring, which was expected to impact sales.

It's an interesting read, for those interested: https://gameworldobserver.com/2023/11/23/embracer-group-pipeline-review-200-games-rogers

God, and to think that Elden Ring sucked so much in the gameplay department. Great art work, but... static NPCs? recycled game mechanics from the previous game? stale world forever resetting its state?

[Takohashi]

Originally posted by Disascho:

whereas the team wanted to do gothic 4.

Dude, all their games are made according to the Gothic template.
I play Risen and see Gothic. I play Elex and see Gothic.
They should have stopped developing games after Gothic 2.
20 years of stagnation and no improvement. I'm surprised they lasted as long as they did.

[ParabolaWaVe]

Originally posted by Takohashi:

Dude, all their games are made according to the Gothic template.
I play Risen and see Gothic. I play Elex and see Gothic.
They should have stopped developing games after Gothic 2.
20 years of stagnation and no improvement. I'm surprised they lasted as long as they did.

And still the PB productions played like nothing else in the market. While most, if not all of the others, are a lot less original. Bethesda did the exact same game with Starfield, starting with the engine. Baldur's Gate 3 was Divinity 3, and nobody complained.

[Takohashi]

Originally posted by ParabolaWaVe:

Originally posted by Takohashi:

Dude, all their games are made according to the Gothic template.
I play Risen and see Gothic. I play Elex and see Gothic.
They should have stopped developing games after Gothic 2.
20 years of stagnation and no improvement. I'm surprised they lasted as long as they did.

And still the PB productions played like nothing else in the market. While most, if not all of the others, are a lot less original. Bethesda did the exact same game with Starfield, starting with the engine. Baldur's Gate 3 was Divinity 3, and nobody complained.

You're comparing Baldur's Gate 3 to THIS?:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdAlgqkykOE

[ParabolaWaVe]

Originally posted by Takohashi:

You're comparing Baldur's Gate 3 to THIS?:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdAlgqkykOE

The game deserves credit for introducing the full RPG experience to modern players, and decorate the package with AAA level graphics. But I'm not so sure that BG3 is superior to games like Pillars of Eternity, Tyranny, Pathfinder 1 & 2, and so many others, including the original Baldur's Gate and the first 2 Fallout games.

The fact is, that if you can sacrifice graphics, you have a lot of alternatives to replace BG3 with. Both turn based and real time. Replacing the Elex or the Risen series with something else is actually a bit more complicated. Nobody is doing the kind of games that Piranha is known for.

[PALPUS]

Originally posted by ParabolaWaVe:

Originally posted by Takohashi:

You're comparing Baldur's Gate 3 to THIS?:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdAlgqkykOE

The game deserves credit for introducing the full RPG experience to modern players, and decorate the package with AAA level graphics. But I'm not so sure that BG3 is superior to games like Pillars of Eternity, Tyranny, Pathfinder 1 & 2, and so many others, including the original Baldur's Gate and the first 2 Fallout games.

The fact is, that if you can sacrifice graphics, you have a lot of alternatives to replace BG3 with. Both turn based and real time. Replacing the Elex or the Risen series with something else is actually a bit more complicated. Nobody is doing the kind of games that Piranha is known for.

They should've done it right though. Elex2 was embarassing in terms of dialogue story and quest design. It was like a never ending wave of words thrown at the player meaning nothing. And "kill 40 enemies in this region" is as far from the gothic formula as it gets

[Damocles]

Originally posted by ParabolaWaVe:

Originally posted by Takohashi:

You're comparing Baldur's Gate 3 to THIS?:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdAlgqkykOE

The game deserves credit for introducing the full RPG experience to modern players, and decorate the package with AAA level graphics. But I'm not so sure that BG3 is superior to games like Pillars of Eternity, Tyranny, Pathfinder 1 & 2, and so many others, including the original Baldur's Gate and the first 2 Fallout games.

The fact is, that if you can sacrifice graphics, you have a lot of alternatives to replace BG3 with. Both turn based and real time. Replacing the Elex or the Risen series with something else is actually a bit more complicated. Nobody is doing the kind of games that Piranha is known for.

Even with bitmap graphics and text dialogs, BG3 would be a better game than its predecessors. It has complex and well balanced combat mechanics, and good quests that have a multitude of possible solutions and alternative story archs. All things Elex 2 was lacking btw.
There is a well deserved reason BG3 got game of the year, even though being a turn based game.

[spike86]

Originally posted by Amigo:

Theres nothing really new there

really? two publishers willing to buy, thq trying to protect them and the government funding (currywurst) back it's not really "nothing"....

also bjorn left more for discrepancy in creative ideas (small vs big world) than for the crysis... this was the thing that "forced his hand" to resign, but if the team (only 30 people in total) is not agreeing anymore with the director, there's only one way it can go, financial crysis or not.

[Inquerion]

Originally posted by regina_ragna:

I do like ELEX. Not so Much ELEX II.

Elex 2 is just worse than Elex 1 in almost every aspect. It has no soul and second part of the game was just bad.

[Inquerion]

Originally posted by spike86:

Originally posted by Amigo:

Theres nothing really new there

really? two publishers willing to buy, thq trying to protect them and the government funding (currywurst) back it's not really "nothing"....

also bjorn left more for discrepancy in creative ideas (small vs big world) than for the crysis... this was the thing that "forced his hand" to resign, but if the team (only 30 people in total) is not agreeing anymore with the director, there's only one way it can go, financial crysis or not.

I heard that Bjorn is hard to work with. Outside work he is a ok guy, but not in work. Has a autocratic like personality. He loves Sci Fi and together with his wife Jenny was pushing for Elex 3, but the rest of the team was tired of it and wanted to make a smaller fantasy RPG game [like Risen 1].

As we all know, Elex 2 flopped, so even for pragmatic reasons it would make more sense to make a new fantasy game than continue failed franchise. Sadly Bjorn kept insisting on Elex 3.

Now it makes sense why Mike and Kai left Piranha Bytes once Bjorn took full power over the studio after Risen 1. And why Risen 2 was so different (and worse) compared to Risen 1.

[D3bugzer0]

elex 1 had a more interesting story and missions but the gameplay in 2 I thought was better, the characters in 2 are horrendous but the characters in 1 are also horrible, I think this type of old school RPG has its place