Not happy with resistances or defenses in this game.

[Doubtfu1]

Why am I spending so much time chasing down resistances that just get removed the further I push? Why should I stack 3-4k+ shielding on top of my resists to survive a level 55 boss attack at level 73? The penetration disregards all the work you put into building resistances. Imagine building a glass cannon thinking you can reduce the damage you take. Lmfao, everything on screen dies in one shot, bats, scorpions, including myself.

[Dallaen]

Tell us you don't understand the game mechanics without telling us.

[Astasia]

I think you might be misunderstanding penetration based on how you typed that. You only need 75% resists, having more than that does not help against enemy penetration, you don't need to hunt down anything extra. The game is balanced around having 75% resists, if you have less than 75% you will take significantly more damage, your "work" to get those resists is never "wasted." Enemies at higher levels do more damage, that's how RPGs work, the fact higher level enemies gain that extra damage by penetrating resistances is really a backend mechanic you don't need to be aware of. The only thing you need to be aware of is that as you push further into end game you need to do more damage and have more defenses, that's called progression, it's literally the same in any other similar game.

As for bosses, some hits you just aren't meant to take, move out of the bad.

[Ravenkid9266]

Originally posted by Astasia:

As for bosses, some hits you just aren't meant to take, move out of the bad.

This post entirely, but mostly this point. Unless you are able to stack ward/DR then you can face tank the entire game.

[Ellye]

I don't know what you're on about, considering that capping resists in this game is a lot easier than in other ARPGs.

You only need 75% of each, going above the cap doesn't counteract the area level effect.

You can get 50% in a single affix.

You have resistances in idols.

And, lastly, you don't even need to be fully capped on everything. Mathematically, resistances matter less in this game than in any other ARPG (the difference between a capped character and a 0% character is a lot less than in other similar games, due to the way the area level reduction applies after-the-cap here).

Almost nothing in this game cause any threatening amount of damage, the only big attacks are the ones that are telegraphed so you should move out of the way of those.

[Doubtfu1]

Originally posted by Astasia:

I think you might be misunderstanding penetration based on how you typed that. You only need 75% resists, having more than that does not help against enemy penetration, you don't need to hunt down anything extra. The game is balanced around having 75% resists, if you have less than 75% you will take significantly more damage, your "work" to get those resists is never "wasted." Enemies at higher levels do more damage, that's how RPGs work, the fact higher level enemies gain that extra damage by penetrating resistances is really a backend mechanic you don't need to be aware of. The only thing you need to be aware of is that as you push further into end game you need to do more damage and have more defenses, that's called progression, it's literally the same in any other similar game.

As for bosses, some hits you just aren't meant to take, move out of the bad.

The game looks to remove 1% of resist per enemy level. If you cap at 75% but are in a 55 dungeon you have 20% res remaining. It further clarifies by saying you can go negative in resists. Such that, if you were had 60% fire res in a lvl 75 monolith, your actual resist would be amplifying the damage by 15%. The game also implies that having 15-20% over the cap is ideal because of this exact problem. I understand monsters gain penetration per level, but again dying as a level 75 to a 55 boss in one hit with "maxed res"? absurd. That's a 20 level difference in gear and gems. The penetration is too extreme and completely negates the purpose of you chasing them to begin with. Ironically some people in global were recommending a level 15 unique item for resistances to newer players to beat certain bosses. To recommend a special item so you have enough resist to beat a boss or area, insane. Forget what happens when you remove it.

Rose tinted glasses are still on too many peoples faces. Games great, but this is the first thing to make me alt-f4 and not want to return. Hours grinding resistances only to get one shot by something 20 levels lower.

Originally posted by Ravenkid9266:

Originally posted by Astasia:

As for bosses, some hits you just aren't meant to take, move out of the bad.

This post entirely, but mostly this point. Unless you are able to stack ward/DR then you can face tank the entire game.

Sorry but no, this ain't my first rodeo in ARPG's. For the most part you stack resistances with a solid health pool/shield and cannot die to anything outside ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ mechanics.

There is no excuse a boss level 55 should ever one shot a level 75 player. God forbid what happens when we get the real end game content everyone claims to want. You'd better just dodge everything.

Originally posted by Ellye:

I don't know what you're on about, considering that capping resists in this game is a lot easier than in other ARPGs.

You only need 75% of each, going above the cap doesn't counteract the area level effect.

You can get 50% in a single affix.

You have resistances in idols.

And, lastly, you don't even need to be fully capped on everything. Mathematically, resistances matter less in this game than in any other ARPG (the difference between a capped character and a 0% character is a lot less than in other similar games, due to the way the area level reduction applies after-the-cap here).

Almost nothing in this game cause any threatening amount of damage, the only big attacks are the ones that are telegraphed so you should move out of the way of those.

Did you miss the part where i said my resistances are all at 75% yet I still keep getting one shot? Spending 30 mins to get to the end of a dungeon to only get one shot. Sure, avoid the damage, but you only get one chance at the boss. Mess up a single large attack, restart that 30 mins bucko.

[CyberDown]

I dont understand, i dont have everything capped but like, its not hard to put a decent resist on each item. Have you gotten far enough to unlock the forge?

[Metadigital]

Yeah stacking 7 resists on top of whatever else you're going to need is pretty tedious honestly. I don't think it's great design.

[Astasia]

Originally posted by Doubtfu1:

stuff

Your understanding is still incorrect, you can not counter the resistance penetration. Having over capped res only helps slightly against resistance shreds but those are rare. Rare enough that you can check out serious HC players on stream like Steelmage and he only has 75% resistances. One death and it's over for him, yet he only has 75% resistances because that's all that matters. Without those 75% resistances you take like twice as much damage late game rather than 4 times as much, which if anything only makes resistances slightly less important.

[Ravenkid9266]

Originally posted by Doubtfu1:

Originally posted by Ravenkid9266:

This post entirely, but mostly this point. Unless you are able to stack ward/DR then you can face tank the entire game.

Sorry but no, this ain't my first rodeo in ARPG's. For the most part you stack resistances with a solid health pool/shield and cannot die to anything outside ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ mechanics.

There is no excuse a boss level 55 should ever one shot a level 75 player. God forbid what happens when we get the real end game content everyone claims to want. You'd better just dodge everything.

You can look at your character, now go look up that boss in question here:
https://lastepoch.tunklab.com/bestiary

and how offensive math works under the hood here:
https://maxroll.gg/last-epoch/resources/damage-explained

and defenses here:
https://maxroll.gg/last-epoch/resources/defenses-explained

Or the TLDR is bosses in LE are intended to provide "difficulty" via highly telegraphed attacks designed to one shot you.

"You'd better just dodge everything. " now you are getting it.

[IncognitoOri]

Yup. Getting 7 resists to 75% (or ~100% to counteract certain debuffs) just for the area level itself to reset your resists to 0? Dumbest design I've seen in an ARPG yet. Why have the cap at 75% if the damage difference isn't even that much in this game supposedly? I think I should be able to have 150% resists to effectively have 75% still after the max area penetration. Why have resists at all if you just reset them to 0% in the endgame? Just to have pointless stats on items that could be replaced with more interesting things? Lazy development/balance.

My character is level 86 or so, I consistently do level 90 monoliths and rarely ever die, yet I got one-shot by a level 74 or 75 boss in Soulfire Bastion because of the dumb mechanics in there. Like cool, got it, dungeon content is pointless to do then.

[IncognitoOri]

Originally posted by Ravenkid9266:

Originally posted by Doubtfu1:

Sorry but no, this ain't my first rodeo in ARPG's. For the most part you stack resistances with a solid health pool/shield and cannot die to anything outside ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ mechanics.

There is no excuse a boss level 55 should ever one shot a level 75 player. God forbid what happens when we get the real end game content everyone claims to want. You'd better just dodge everything.

You can look at your character, now go look up that boss in question here:
https://lastepoch.tunklab.com/bestiary

and how offensive math works under the hood here:
https://maxroll.gg/last-epoch/resources/damage-explained

and defenses here:
https://maxroll.gg/last-epoch/resources/defenses-explained

Or the TLDR is bosses in LE are intended to provide "difficulty" via highly telegraphed attacks designed to one shot you.

"You'd better just dodge everything. " now you are getting it.

"You'd better just dodge everything" leads to a meta of "get dodge chance/rating no matter what class you're playing". Boring ass gameplay, horrible design.

[Doubtfu1]

Originally posted by Astasia:

Originally posted by Doubtfu1:

stuff

Your understanding is still incorrect, you can not counter the resistance penetration. Having over capped res only helps slightly against resistance shreds but those are rare. Rare enough that you can check out serious HC players on stream like Steelmage and he only has 75% resistances. One death and it's over for him, yet he only has 75% resistances because that's all that matters. Without those 75% resistances you take like twice as much damage late game rather than 4 times as much, which if anything only makes resistances slightly less important.

I see, my understanding is incorrect. Now, let's address this from a second standpoint. How is this any different than a normal resistance system? I can only see disadvantages for the players game, and understanding. For example if you have a normal game where your resistances get applied to the damage being done. You simply remove the damage being applied. In this case, the game is artificially inflating your need for resistances. It requires you to get the same 75% you would have before, but punishes you more not doing so. Even having full resistance only have a minimal effect, than thank you for making me chase these items over and over.

In POE (been years, not an expert). I remember hitting act 2? or 3? where if you didn't have resistances you just got smeared across the ground. It made you stop and go back to get some of the missing things. However, it would happen with simply mobs as opposed to bosses. In Last Epoch, I feel that im walking over the entire game and getting gimped by a boss for not realizing how the resitances function.

Yes, its my fault, and I'm glad you cleared it up. It now tells me to go stack more shielding and my overall character is highly offensive. However, can you see how these systems lead to a functional difference in game play? Or am I that much of an idiot when trying to "read into" what the tool tips are actually trying to tell me?


Edited to add: like the other commentator, this leads to bosses significantly under leveled 1 shotting you out of nowhere. Monoliths = ez, bosses 20 levels under = better have a party.

[Ravenkid9266]

Originally posted by IncognitoOri:

"You'd better just dodge everything" leads to a meta of "get dodge chance/rating no matter what class you're playing". Boring ass gameplay, horrible design.

Dodge the stat actually scales very poorly, only applies to hits, and there are hit attacks coded to be undodgeable. Movement is perhaps the best solution to the specific situation you are experiencing "friction" with. Also known as don't stand in bad.

[IncognitoOri]

Originally posted by Ravenkid9266:

Originally posted by IncognitoOri:

"You'd better just dodge everything" leads to a meta of "get dodge chance/rating no matter what class you're playing". Boring ass gameplay, horrible design.

Dodge the stat actually scales very poorly, only applies to hits, and there are hit attacks coded to be undodgeable. Movement is perhaps the best solution to the specific situation you are experiencing "friction" with. Also known as don't stand in bad.

How about, one-shot mechanics are super boring and lazy game design. That actually promotes glass cannon gameplay, it doesn't discourage it.

[Astasia]

Originally posted by IncognitoOri:

Yup. Getting 7 resists to 75% (or ~100% to counteract certain debuffs) just for the area level itself to reset your resists to 0? Dumbest design I've seen in an ARPG yet. Why have the cap at 75% if the damage difference isn't even that much in this game supposedly?

Originally posted by Doubtfu1:

Now, let's address this from a second standpoint. How is this any different than a normal resistance system?

It's not at all dumb, it's actually one of the few really ingenious systems LE has. In Path of Exile the game is balanced around you having 75% resists, if you are missing just 5% from one element you are taking 20% more damage per hit from enemies (from 25% damage to 30%) which is pretty brutal so you always need to maintain 75% (or higher) pretty much at all times without exception late game. In Last Epoch the game is balanced around you having 75% resists, if you are missing 5% from one element in endgame you take 5% more damage from those attacks, (going from effectively 0 to -5%), this is a lot more manageable and being a few points off of resist caps in LE is not nearly as brutal. It's still important, but it's not as crucial. Everything about this system is a good thing for players and balance.

The game also has the all resist stat and there are monolith passives for resists to ease up on the gearing requirements later.