This boss is really stupid

[Angrypillow]

I have no issues with Lagos, that one is just annoying. This other boss, though...the snake boss just before you unlock the echo questlines...it's just awful. I don't know if my game is bugged or something, but there's no telegraphs for any of her attacks, she moves around the arena at hyperspeed, there's this "turn you to stone" mechanic that slows you instantly before it actually freezes you...if your teleport is on cooldown, you're just sol.

This isn't a fun encounter...it is just frustrating. If that is actually the intent, I should just uninstall the game right now.

The bosses honestly ruin the overall experience for me. It's too jarring compared to the rest of the game, and I would bet my next paycheck that this one aspect alone will be an instant turnoff for a lot of people when the game gets the full release.

[Ravenkid9266]

https://youtu.be/GN5CyNkqmAo?si=iuI_ydGiBSA7z0g8

[Or0_n3rVo5o]

you can do echoes from lvl 33 . learn the game , first. become stronger inside echoes come back to the boss. kill. cya.

[RhodosGuard]

Get Physical Resistance, and then git gud.

[Angrypillow]

Originally posted by Ravenkid9266:

https://youtu.be/GN5CyNkqmAo?si=iuI_ydGiBSA7z0g8

This actually outlines the core problem pretty well, and the POE/ER examples were on point. The one thing none of these videos address though is the disparity between the bosses and the rest of the game. If you become competent at all the boss fights, the rest of the game devolves into a trivialized grind for more boss fights. There is far too large a difficulty gap between the two. If they intend on keeping the bosses as-is, the base game mobs need to have more mechanics.

[Ravenkid9266]

Originally posted by AngryPillow:

Originally posted by Ravenkid9266:

https://youtu.be/GN5CyNkqmAo?si=iuI_ydGiBSA7z0g8

This actually outlines the core problem pretty well, and the POE/ER examples were on point. The one thing none of these videos address though is the disparity between the bosses and the rest of the game. If you become competent at all the boss fights, the rest of the game devolves into a trivialized grind for more boss fights. There is far too large a difficulty gap between the two.

As pointed out once you learn how to deal with the boss mechanics you never have to worry about them ever again, as they do not change.

Example, did you know the "tell" for Lagon is his eye and head shake thing? Most people never notice, and take the advise of just get your resistances up. Discounting how much of that boss fight is DoT's and mechanics. Its the same with the rest of them, if you know the mechanics all you have to do is "work the mechanics".

As pointed out there is no difference between story boss and corruption 4000 boss, its just drawing out the fight with larger numbers to increase the odds you take a one shot.

As for the story bosses, they suffer from the development time difficulty. As Lagon was the "end" boss for so long he had a difficulty to match, same with Majasa, as she is currently the "end" boss of the story, and it will be the same with the next "end" boss of the story.

Its all a hamster wheel, the actual difficulty is not so easy for the casual to figure out so they keep running on the wheel thinking they are making progress when any gains are just luck. Much like how to sidestep Dynamic DR or even how it works to keep you chasing "upgrades" that realistically wont help as much as you think.

[Angrypillow]

Originally posted by Ravenkid9266:

Originally posted by AngryPillow:

This actually outlines the core problem pretty well, and the POE/ER examples were on point. The one thing none of these videos address though is the disparity between the bosses and the rest of the game. If you become competent at all the boss fights, the rest of the game devolves into a trivialized grind for more boss fights. There is far too large a difficulty gap between the two.

As pointed out once you learn how to deal with the boss mechanics you never have to worry about them ever again, as they do not change.

Example, did you know the "tell" for Lagon is his eye and head shake thing? Most people never notice, and take the advise of just get your resistances up. Discounting how much of that boss fight is DoT's and mechanics. Its the same with the rest of them, if you know the mechanics all you have to do is "work the mechanics".

As pointed out there is no difference between story boss and corruption 4000 boss, its just drawing out the fight with larger numbers to increase the odds you take a one shot.

As for the story bosses, they suffer from the development time difficulty. As Lagon was the "end" boss for so long he had a difficulty to match, same with Majasa, as she is currently the "end" boss of the story, and it will be the same with the next "end" boss of the story.

Its all a hamster wheel, the actual difficulty is not so easy for the casual to figure out so they keep running on the wheel thinking they are making progress when any gains are just luck. Much like how to sidestep Dynamic DR or even how it works to keep you chasing "upgrades" that realistically wont help as much as you think.

Some sort of multiple-attempts mechanic would help immensely. It's hard to learn mechanics with all the stuff you have to do in between attempts, and with the rest of the game doing nothing at all to prepare you for those encounters.

I think the game needs two things:

1) Base-game rare mobs need more actual mechanics to get players used to certain behaviors

2) A mechanism for multiple attempts on a boss.

I would bet my next paycheck that as things stand currently, the boss issue will be an instant turn-off for a lot of people when the full game goes live.

[Ravenkid9266]

Originally posted by AngryPillow:

Some sort of multiple-attempts mechanic would help immensely. It's hard to learn mechanics with all the stuff you have to do in between attempts, and with the rest of the game doing nothing at all to prepare you for those encounters.

I think the game needs two things:

1) Base-game rare mobs need more actual mechanics to get players used to certain behaviors

2) A mechanism for multiple attempts on a boss.

I would bet my next paycheck that as things stand currently, the boss issue will be an instant turn-off for a lot of people when the full game goes live.

1. Hard Disagree. The more you lean into mechanics in place of numbers the more you trivialize numbers. All this would do is extend the "work the mechanics" from just the boss to the entire game, and LE would become one step closer to a different genre. I want my character numbers to matter, I want the source of those numbers to matter, and the more EHG leans into one-shots and mechanics the less those numbers matter.

2. Yes absolutely, you could even tie it into the time travel aspect and have a boss training room where you get no rewards but can practice.

Turn-off? I mean its easy to forget what the average gamer looks like. 8 hours a week and zero interaction with out of game materials. Meaning they wont be aware of the "shadow systems" at play, they wont understand how important these mechanics are, they will keep chasing questionable at best gear upgrades unaware that gear contributes the lowest portion of your player power. It has also become the "lazy standard" just look at WoW or FF, its all mechanics all the way down.

On the other hand, its possible. I mean every WoW guild from back in the day did well in Karazhan then Ulduar hit and those mechanics checked those guilds right out of the game, at least until classic hit and we saw a massive resurgence in numbers matter gameplay.

[Angrypillow]

Originally posted by Ravenkid9266:

1. Hard Disagree. The more you lean into mechanics in place of numbers the more you trivialize numbers. All this would do is extend the "work the mechanics" from just the boss to the entire game, and LE would become one step closer to a different genre. I want my character numbers to matter, I want the source of those numbers to matter, and the more EHG leans into one-shots and mechanics the less those numbers matter.

I actually agree with you. The emphasis on one-shot mechanics regardless of player power really doesn't feel good. My first suggestion was more towards the base game being less of a cakewalk so the boss experience wasn't as jarring.

[Ravenkid9266]

Originally posted by AngryPillow:

I actually agree with you. The emphasis on one-shot mechanics regardless of player power really doesn't feel good. My first suggestion was more towards the base game being less of a cakewalk so the boss experience wasn't as jarring.

How long have you been playing LE?

According to the developers they have been increasing monster difficulty with every patch. Just like how judd claimed at gamescom to have added a new skill with every patch.

Did you notice?

[RodHull]

Originally posted by Ravenkid9266:

Originally posted by AngryPillow:

I actually agree with you. The emphasis on one-shot mechanics regardless of player power really doesn't feel good. My first suggestion was more towards the base game being less of a cakewalk so the boss experience wasn't as jarring.

How long have you been playing LE?

According to the developers they have been increasing monster difficulty with every patch. Just like how judd claimed at gamescom to have added a new skill with every patch.

Did you notice?

Ah the good old EHG fart in your face and tell you the wind is blowing tactic.

[Angrypillow]

Originally posted by Ravenkid9266:

Originally posted by AngryPillow:

I actually agree with you. The emphasis on one-shot mechanics regardless of player power really doesn't feel good. My first suggestion was more towards the base game being less of a cakewalk so the boss experience wasn't as jarring.

How long have you been playing LE?

According to the developers they have been increasing monster difficulty with every patch. Just like how judd claimed at gamescom to have added a new skill with every patch.

Did you notice?

I haven't been around long enough to notice that kind of change. I just know I completely steamroll everything outside of the boss encounters. I keep finishing echos by accident.

[RodHull]

Originally posted by AngryPillow:

I haven't been around long enough to notice that kind of change. I just know I completely steamroll everything outside of the boss encounters. I keep finishing echos by accident.

It's cause its never got more difficult, its just something they like to say like all the other factually lacking statements they put out.

[RhodosGuard]

Originally posted by Ravenkid9266:

Originally posted by AngryPillow:

Some sort of multiple-attempts mechanic would help immensely. It's hard to learn mechanics with all the stuff you have to do in between attempts, and with the rest of the game doing nothing at all to prepare you for those encounters.

I think the game needs two things:

1) Base-game rare mobs need more actual mechanics to get players used to certain behaviors

2) A mechanism for multiple attempts on a boss.

I would bet my next paycheck that as things stand currently, the boss issue will be an instant turn-off for a lot of people when the full game goes live.

1. Hard Disagree. The more you lean into mechanics in place of numbers the more you trivialize numbers. All this would do is extend the "work the mechanics" from just the boss to the entire game, and LE would become one step closer to a different genre. I want my character numbers to matter, I want the source of those numbers to matter, and the more EHG leans into one-shots and mechanics the less those numbers matter.

2. Yes absolutely, you could even tie it into the time travel aspect and have a boss training room where you get no rewards but can practice.

Turn-off? I mean its easy to forget what the average gamer looks like. 8 hours a week and zero interaction with out of game materials. Meaning they wont be aware of the "shadow systems" at play, they wont understand how important these mechanics are, they will keep chasing questionable at best gear upgrades unaware that gear contributes the lowest portion of your player power. It has also become the "lazy standard" just look at WoW or FF, its all mechanics all the way down.

On the other hand, its possible. I mean every WoW guild from back in the day did well in Karazhan then Ulduar hit and those mechanics checked those guilds right out of the game, at least until classic hit and we saw a massive resurgence in numbers matter gameplay.

WoW is a whole different ballpark.
Mechanics mattering is a core to raiding I will always prefer over pure numbers, but even back in the day, it wasnt really "Numbers matter" it was mechanics, that you just couldnt see and therefore hoped to edge to your advantage through numbers.

I can only advice anyone who actually wants to know what happened to WoW to watch Dan Olsons WoW Video (Why it is rude to suck at World of Warcraft)

[DROP TABLE PLAYERS]

lagos is actually terribly designed because the arena you fight him in is complete ♥♥♥♥ unless you're a melee character, the other bosses are fine, hard bosses in the campaign are fun, I think too many ARPGS make the campaign bosses too easy.

[Ravenkid9266]

Originally posted by RhodosGuard:

WoW is a whole different ballpark.

Yes, but the principle holds. Plenty of guilds handled Karazhan easily (because it was mechanic light) and those same guilds got checked by Ulduar (because it was a lot of mechanics among other things) and the most common complaint about "current version" of WoW is its too many mechanics. Juxtaposed against the rise of classic wow.

Meaning if you teach people light mechanics, like Karazhan and then transition into Ulduar (heavier) and then to "current" (extreme) they tend to get filtered out.

Me? I finished WoW when the story ended, in Wrath.

Originally posted by AngryPillow:

I haven't been around long enough to notice that kind of change. I just know I completely steamroll everything outside of the boss encounters. I keep finishing echos by accident.

Too much player power from levels, poor scaling, these are all things that contribute to that feeling. Then you get to bosses and its a HP sponge, thanks dynamic DR, and what do you think the casual player will think? Oh if I just get a better build, or a few more rolls on the LP forge. Hence the hamster wheel.