Best civ, best wonder, and best upgraded unit?

[wormhog]

By upgraded unit I mean specific to a civ, like panzers for Germany, or legions for Rome. My personal opinion is: Best civ- Japan, for their damaged unit bonus. Best wonder- statue of liberty, for the massive production buff and free policy. Best upgraded unit- probably Japanese zeros, their excellent at defence from bombers and don't require oil, which helps immensely if there is none in your territory. Let me know what you guys think.

[JVteam]

引用自 Twelvefield：

Best Unit = Settler

Talamare, this guy is making us look like fools...

[JVteam]

I'll admit, I'd rather have a settler than a Keshik at the beginning of the game.

[JVteam]

Wait, never mind,

引用自 wormhog：

By upgraded unit I mean specific to a civ, like panzers for Germany, or legions for Rome.

We're fine.

[Crim]

引用自 Twelvefield：

Best Unit = Settler

If Settler was the best unit then why doesn't Venice use them?

引用自 jrocker314：

My point is that a veteran Keshik army can hit-and-run the hell out of anything- and acquire many Khans and promotions in the process. That is part of the Keshik, the promotions and khan generation bonus, and that's why I factor it in. A Bazaar has no direct combat correlation with the Camel, so it isn't really part of the combat of the units.

Also, you said yourself that The great wall is the best wonder- but it doesn't stop a Keshik hit-and-run. It does, however, greatly impede Camel hit-and-run in a hilly terrain area, it turns it into just hit. Camels may be more powerful to begin with, but once the Keshik army gets going, they cannot be stopped. They are the masters of the Hit-and-run.

Ah but my point to counter your point is twofold
To begin - 1 Great General has basically the same effect as 5 Great Generals (or Khans). So having more won't help your push, sans the extra Citadels

This is a comparison of the best unit, which would be Keshik vs Camel. If you begin factoring a second unique from your Civilization, doesn't this seem a bit unfair?

[Crim]

Here is another pretty massive kicker towards Camel Supremacy - Mass Production

Your primary argument about Keshik superiority is the fact that if you personally take care of a small squad, and get them very advanced promotions. They will be superior. However Arabia could mass produce with a mere barracks, and not only compete with this specially trained force but beat them. With 15% promotion and a GG, they will be comparable still to your vastly trained Keshiks, but their losses would be mostly meaningless. While every one of your loss of your vastly trained Keshik would be a significant loss. Keshik can hit and run every unit in the game... Except for Camels

[A Bat From Wuhan]

Best Civ - Rome
Best Wonder - Kremlin, Tanks, so many freakin tanks...
Best Unit - Legion, may not be the actual best, but is my favorite. I like to name them random "latin" names like "Legio Portuga IV" if it was fighting Portugal, or "Legio III Roma" if they were defending Rome. I love them :P (I have no idea how to write latin so I just make up latinish names.)

[JVteam]

引用自 Talamare：

Here is another pretty massive kicker towards Camel Supremacy - Mass Production

Your primary argument about Keshik superiority is the fact that if you personally take care of a small squad, and get them very advanced promotions. They will be superior. However Arabia could mass produce with a mere barracks, and not only compete with this specially trained force but beat them. With 15% promotion and a GG, they will be comparable still to your vastly trained Keshiks, but their losses would be mostly meaningless. While every one of your loss of your vastly trained Keshik would be a significant loss. Keshik can hit and run every unit in the game... Except for Camels

Well played. Keshiks can run faster, but Camels can hit harder. I tip my hat to you, Talamare.

I know when I'm beaten.

[JVteam]

引用自 SpitfireMK-Pony：

Best Civ - Rome
Best Wonder - Kremlin, Tanks, so many freakin tanks...
Best Unit - Legion, may not be the actual best, but is my favorite. I like to name them random "latin" names like "Legio Portuga IV" if it was fighting Portugal, or "Legio III Roma" if they were defending Rome. I love them :P (I have no idea how to write latin so I just make up latinish names.)

Eh...Eh... Can I ask why you think Rome is the best civ? I see Rome as an Early-Game warmongerer who is stopped by a Strong turtle and a tech advantage...Babylon...

[Crim]

引用自 jrocker314：

I know when I'm beaten.

Cheers, Always enjoyable

引用自 jrocker314：

引用自 SpitfireMK-Pony：

Best Civ - Rome
Best Wonder - Kremlin, Tanks, so many freakin tanks...
Best Unit - Legion, may not be the actual best, but is my favorite. I like to name them random "latin" names like "Legio Portuga IV" if it was fighting Portugal, or "Legio III Roma" if they were defending Rome. I love them :P (I have no idea how to write latin so I just make up latinish names.)

Eh...Eh... Can I ask why you think Rome is the best civ? I see Rome as an Early-Game warmongerer who is stopped by a Strong turtle and a tech advantage...Babylon...

I would say that Rome has a good window of oppourtunity to absolutely destroy Babylon, but once that window passes they are basically done.

Even worse is the fact Rome has zero bonuses, they are pretty vanilla after their uniques are gone. Their UA is based on bringing everyone up to average, they have no aspect in which they surpass average. Definitely not top tier material. Definitely not best civ.

[TheGaleRider]

引用自 Twelvefield：

Best Civ = Random
Best Wonder = the one you build 1 turn before the other player is about to finish theirs
Best Unit = Settler

I cannot imagine any debate on this, as I have truly picked out the best the game has to offer.

Yes. Best Civ, UU, and Wonder right here. I can't believe I didn't think of that.

[TheGaleRider]

引用自 Talamare：

引用自 Twelvefield：

Best Unit = Settler

If Settler was the best unit then why doesn't Venice use them?

Because Venice is so awesome they only need one.

[Aliapoh]

Best Civ= Egypt if you're on vanilla for wonder spamming and Babylon if you have DLC
Best Wonder= Depends on what victory you're trying to get. Either the Opera House or CI
Best Unit= Nuclear sub. The power to destroy any unit and coastal city with near impunity is powerful

[wormhog]

引用自 jrocker314：

Wait, never mind,

引用自 wormhog：

By upgraded unit I mean specific to a civ, like panzers for Germany, or legions for Rome.

We're fine.

Wow, I feel like an idiot for not saying UNIQUE unit instead of UPGRADED unit. Loved that long debate between Talamare and jrocker314, I love reading debates as well as having them. After trying both units out in-game, I agree that both Keshiks and Camel archers are both incredibly useful, but overall I prefer the camel archer (sorry jrocker314). Their increased power makes them useful for much later into the game, hit and running rifleman with them made my day. Also, another great unit I forgot about are longbowmen. That extra 1 range can destroy attacking armies and navies, and are a great unit to have bombarding a city.

[wormhog]

引用自 Talamare：

Best Civ - The one you enjoy, All Civs have their ups and their downs. There is no clear Civ that is superior in every regard. Thus there is no "Best" Civ

Sorry, I meant in your opinion, or which you enjoy most. Probably should've specified that.

[Swetcan]

引用自 PSG.jrocker314：

引用自 Talamare：

Here is another pretty massive kicker towards Camel Supremacy - Mass Production

Your primary argument about Keshik superiority is the fact that if you personally take care of a small squad, and get them very advanced promotions. They will be superior. However Arabia could mass produce with a mere barracks, and not only compete with this specially trained force but beat them. With 15% promotion and a GG, they will be comparable still to your vastly trained Keshiks, but their losses would be mostly meaningless. While every one of your loss of your vastly trained Keshik would be a significant loss. Keshik can hit and run every unit in the game... Except for Camels

Well played. Keshiks can run faster, but Camels can hit harder. I tip my hat to you, Talamare.

I know when I'm beaten.

i think someone forgot keshiks don't have a penalty against cities (if camels dont then nevermind)