Cauldron puzzle investigation

[LootMech]

i don't know if this is new or if ppl already had this angle longa go but here I go.
recently tehre was fury forged video where he wanted help with solving the cauldron puzzle,
Strange enough that video seems to be gone now, or I would have commented this there.
being inspired by the video I googled a bit and tried to find out more things about alchemy and stuff.
DIdn't get very far there but there was one coincidence that i can#t get out of my head.
I asked google "Finland Cauldron" and the result was very interesting.
Apparently there are things inf finland called "hiidenkirnu" which are also called giants CAULDRONS.
Heres a quote from an article abou them "Giant’s kettles or giant’s cauldrons are called hiidenkirnu in Finnish (hiisi = a troll or a giant, kirnu = (butter) churn) "
Notice that it has something to do with hiisi?
I am on full cosnpiracy mode now, maybe we need to get the correct hiisi to the cauldron?
Or what do you think? Am I just insane and should start wearing tinfoil?

[Blahness]

You could always go to the cauldron with some unstable poly and test it out.

[LootMech]

Originally posted by Blahness:

You could always go to the cauldron with some unstable poly and test it out.

That could work but it could also fail due to it being the player as a hiisi and not an npc.
The wiki alos lists teh friend as a hiisi, can you turn into the friend with poly?

[TheSpecial_K]

Afaik, every mob in the game has been brought to the cauldron to test this. Substance combinations, etc. The devs have mentioned that the Cauldron puzzle may be unfinished, so who knows if it does anything at all. I still think it's a cool easter egg, especially since it doesn't appear with mods active.

The Noita Discord is the most current place for discussion on the topic. Check it out, man. They've tried some crazy stuff with that room.

I've tried a handful of things with it - from ending runs with HP+ drops left in the cauldron, stacking different corpses/mobs/spells, filling the cauldron with Precursor... Nada.

Maybe someone will figure it out eventually but the devs have a history of including pretty obscure puzzles in their games. e.g. Baba is You, ESA. Noita being what it is it could be years before someone figures it out - if there is a solution at all

[0P0DRA0]

@FuryForged sorry for the ping, but i tink you should see that

[0P0DRA0]

Originally posted by LootMech:

i don't know if this is new or if ppl already had this angle longa go but here I go.
recently tehre was fury forged video where he wanted help with solving the cauldron puzzle,
Strange enough that video seems to be gone now, or I would have commented this there.
being inspired by the video I googled a bit and tried to find out more things about alchemy and stuff.
DIdn't get very far there but there was one coincidence that i can#t get out of my head.
I asked google "Finland Cauldron" and the result was very interesting.
Apparently there are things inf finland called "hiidenkirnu" which are also called giants CAULDRONS.
Heres a quote from an article abou them "Giant’s kettles or giant’s cauldrons are called hiidenkirnu in Finnish (hiisi = a troll or a giant, kirnu = (butter) churn) "
Notice that it has something to do with hiisi?
I am on full cosnpiracy mode now, maybe we need to get the correct hiisi to the cauldron?
Or what do you think? Am I just insane and should start wearing tinfoil?

there is another thing, there is some days with void and others without it, but what about leap years? the ones with 366 days, with th 29 february, the list of the caldron days from 2021, don't have it, since 2021 was not a leap year

[Helios]

I think you're onto something, but the biggest issue is apparently the cauldron puzzle isn't finished yet, since a dev said:
"I'd maybe recommend not being too concerned about the cauldron for the time being"

However, I don't think that should necessarily stop us from digging for something, even if it's a few small clues that can't be fully answered yet.

On the Noita Wiki, there's a few things people have tried out to see if anything happened, which can be viewed on the Cauldron Room/Test logs and notes page.
One interesting thing is in the game files an "Altar of Permanence" is mentioned. Maybe the cauldron has something to do with this?

As Il0R3Z pointed out about leap years and 2021's days, I find that intriguing too

[Prodeses]

I'd like to point out Kalevala as the lore of Noita is clearly based on Kalevala. Specially Rune 9: Origin of Iron seems to fit somewhat here.

First there are this:

"Ukko’s eldest daughter sprinkled
Black milk over river channels"

This is where Void liquid in our cauldron refers I believe.

"Swiftly flew the stinging hornet,
Scattered all the H(i)isi horrors,
Brought the blessing of the serpent,
Brought the venom of the adder,
Brought the poison of the spider,
Brought the stings of all the insects,
Mixed them with the ore and water,"

Hornet is also referred as "Evil Hi(i)si’s bird, the hornet" a bit earlier. Originally this receipt was supposed to be:

"Little bee, thou tiny birdling,
Bring me honey on thy winglets,
On thy tongue, I pray thee, bring me
Sweetness from the fragrant meadows,
From the little cups of flowers,
From the tips of seven petals,
That we thus may aid the water
To produce the steel from iron."

Later on same poem a young boy has been sent to make healing balsam from following:

"From the herbs of tender fibre,
From the healing plants and flowers,
From the stalks secreting honey,
From the roots, and leaves, and blossoms."

This one was "unworthy" so the boy gathers similar ingredients with superior quality and then:

"Three days more he steeped the balsam,
Three nights more the fire he tended,
Nine the days and nights he watched it,"

This balsam by the way restores a birch tree near, "Wickedly it had been broken,
Broken down by evil Hi(i)si". So maybe also achievement pillar tree is involved.

Disclaimer. The translation seems to be bit off as for example sometimes "sima" is translated as "honey" (yet still sometimes honey is just honey). Also the ingredients brought by hornet are off. In original there are following animals mentioned: snake, worm, ant and frog.

If you are interested about this, you might want to read whole Rune 9:

https://www.gutenberg.org/files/5186/5186-h/5186-h.htm#chap09

[0P0DRA0]

Originally posted by Prodeses:

I'd like to point out Kalevala as the lore of Noita is clearly based on Kalevala. Specially Rune 9: Origin of Iron seems to fit somewhat here.

First there are this:

"Ukko’s eldest daughter sprinkled
Black milk over river channels"

This is where Void liquid in our cauldron refers I believe.

"Swiftly flew the stinging hornet,
Scattered all the H(i)isi horrors,
Brought the blessing of the serpent,
Brought the venom of the adder,
Brought the poison of the spider,
Brought the stings of all the insects,
Mixed them with the ore and water,"

Hornet is also referred as "Evil Hi(i)si’s bird, the hornet" a bit earlier. Originally this receipt was supposed to be:

"Little bee, thou tiny birdling,
Bring me honey on thy winglets,
On thy tongue, I pray thee, bring me
Sweetness from the fragrant meadows,
From the little cups of flowers,
From the tips of seven petals,
That we thus may aid the water
To produce the steel from iron."

Later on same poem a young boy has been sent to make healing balsam from following:

"From the herbs of tender fibre,
From the healing plants and flowers,
From the stalks secreting honey,
From the roots, and leaves, and blossoms."

This one was "unworthy" so the boy gathers similar ingredients with superior quality and then:

"Three days more he steeped the balsam,
Three nights more the fire he tended,
Nine the days and nights he watched it,"

This balsam by the way restores a birch tree near, "Wickedly it had been broken,
Broken down by evil Hi(i)si". So maybe also achievement pillar tree is involved.

Disclaimer. The translation seems to be bit off as for example sometimes "sima" is translated as "honey" (yet still sometimes honey is just honey). Also the ingredients brought by hornet are off. In original there are following animals mentioned: snake, worm, ant and frog.

If you are interested about this, you might want to read whole Rune 9:

https://www.gutenberg.org/files/5186/5186-h/5186-h.htm#chap09

sima is also a liquid in noita... and time specific... + the jungle have hornets and the end of everything spell quest portal is needed to be done in the jungle and the spoell look similar to the caldron shape like letsufertogheter sayd in his video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6atmc7XXLoU&t=567s... + there is another thing... also in the 1 message of this talking, loot mech says something about hidenkiirmu, i am from brasil so my english understanding is not very good... but i finded some things about the hiisi https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hiisi but got lazy to read everything right now... in the page there is things about music sounds spell too... what if there be a music song with the note spells that need to be cast on the wand that Lets sufer togheter used in his last caldron video when shifted void liquid, the wand did churn the caldron... and acording with wath lootmech sayd i undertanded that kirnu means butter. and butter is made of milk, and you sayd about black milk over "rivers chanels", that is also what creates the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giant%27s_kettle what if we need to shift void liquid into water and put the end of everithing spell inside the caldron while cast the valut wand that letsufertogheter used in the video with some music notes... and with the hisi chef being aroud, like lootmech sayd "about bring a hisi" what about a chef to a caldron... now what if the hisi chef need to cast the wand to churn the caldron? bro i tink we are maybe in the right path

[Helios]

Originally posted by Il0R3Z:

Originally posted by Prodeses:

I'd like to point out Kalevala as the lore of Noita is clearly based on Kalevala. Specially Rune 9: Origin of Iron seems to fit somewhat here.

First there are this:

"Ukko’s eldest daughter sprinkled
Black milk over river channels"

This is where Void liquid in our cauldron refers I believe.

"Swiftly flew the stinging hornet,
Scattered all the H(i)isi horrors,
Brought the blessing of the serpent,
Brought the venom of the adder,
Brought the poison of the spider,
Brought the stings of all the insects,
Mixed them with the ore and water,"

Hornet is also referred as "Evil Hi(i)si’s bird, the hornet" a bit earlier. Originally this receipt was supposed to be:

"Little bee, thou tiny birdling,
Bring me honey on thy winglets,
On thy tongue, I pray thee, bring me
Sweetness from the fragrant meadows,
From the little cups of flowers,
From the tips of seven petals,
That we thus may aid the water
To produce the steel from iron."

Later on same poem a young boy has been sent to make healing balsam from following:

"From the herbs of tender fibre,
From the healing plants and flowers,
From the stalks secreting honey,
From the roots, and leaves, and blossoms."

This one was "unworthy" so the boy gathers similar ingredients with superior quality and then:

"Three days more he steeped the balsam,
Three nights more the fire he tended,
Nine the days and nights he watched it,"

This balsam by the way restores a birch tree near, "Wickedly it had been broken,
Broken down by evil Hi(i)si". So maybe also achievement pillar tree is involved.

Disclaimer. The translation seems to be bit off as for example sometimes "sima" is translated as "honey" (yet still sometimes honey is just honey). Also the ingredients brought by hornet are off. In original there are following animals mentioned: snake, worm, ant and frog.

If you are interested about this, you might want to read whole Rune 9:

https://www.gutenberg.org/files/5186/5186-h/5186-h.htm#chap09

sima is also a liquid in noita... and time specific... + the jungle have hornets and the end of everything spell quest portal is needed to be done in the jungle and the spoell look similar to the caldron shape like letsufertogheter sayd in his video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6atmc7XXLoU&t=567s... + there is another thing... also in the 1 message of this talking, loot mech says something about hidenkiirmu, i am from brasil so my english understanding is not very good... but i finded some things about the hiisi https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hiisi but got lazy to read everything right now... in the page there is things about music sounds spell too... what if there be a music song with the note spells that need to be cast on the wand that Lets sufer togheter used in his last caldron video when shifted void liquid, the wand did churn the caldron... and acording with wath lootmech sayd i undertanded that kirnu means butter. and butter is made of milk, and you sayd about black milk over "rivers chanels", that is also what creates the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giant%27s_kettle what if we need to shift void liquid into water and put the end of everithing spell inside the caldron while cast the valut wand that letsufertogheter used in the video with some music notes... and with the hisi chef being aroud, like lootmech sayd "about bring a hisi" what about a chef to a caldron... now what if the hisi chef need to cast the wand to churn the caldron? bro i tink we are maybe in the right path

These are really great ideas! Coincidentally, Let's Suffer Together made a new cauldron video two days ago:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9w7tEDIlt4E

What caught my attention is he mentions the Squared Circle, a real-life alchemical symbol representing the 'interplay of the four elements symbolising the philosopher's stone'.

This can be viewed under the Mundane Elements and Later Metals segment:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alchemical_symbol

Maybe we need four elements or ingredients mixed in the cauldron with a certain wand. The cauldron room itself and the Hiisi puzzle required to obtain the Varpuluuta wand both vaguely look like the Squared Circle, as he explains. There's also the End of Everything spell, which is a direct reference to the Squared Circle.

The Philosopher's Stone is a mythical substance capable of turning metals into gold and silver, as well as being able to lengthen someone's lifespan, among other miraculous things:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosopher%27s_stone

One cool thing to note is:
'Efforts to discover the philosopher's stone were known as the Magnum Opus ("Great Work").'
Noita has The Work at the end, which, funnily enough, turns everything into gold. However, I don't know if Noita's Work is more of a reference to Finnish legend.

I definitely think there is a connection to the Varpuluuta wand, since it makes the cauldron bubble as you guys pointed out. What's also intriguing is its name Google translates to 'sparrowbone'.
In the desert are the remains of a giant bird skeleton. Another noteworthy thing is Stevari bleed bone dust. Maybe that's an ingredient?

[Prodeses]

Varpuluuta is broom made out of subshrub. "Sparrowbone" would be "Varpusenluu". Also, @Helios "kirnu" is crockery used to make butter.

One of the problems related to Kalevala is that I have no idea how much and which version the devs have read. The "original" written by Elias Lönnrot is actually inspired from collection of poems gathered by Elias. So I have been searching for the poem that earlier mentioned "Origin of Iron" is based upon (there's online archive).

Why am I so keen to assume the answer lies in Kalevala? Well even the "key" to end the game is Sampo. Sampo is a mythical item from Kalevala, far more useful than say, philosopher's stone as Sampo can be used to churn money, salt and wheat endlessy but in a controlled manner.

[Helios]

Originally posted by Prodeses:

Varpuluuta is broom made out of subshrub. "Sparrowbone" would be "Varpusenluu". Also, @Helios "kirnu" is crockery used to make butter.

One of the problems related to Kalevala is that I have no idea how much and which version the devs have read. The "original" written by Elias Lönnrot is actually inspired from collection of poems gathered by Elias. So I have been searching for the poem that earlier mentioned "Origin of Iron" is based upon (there's online archive).

Why am I so keen to assume the answer lies in Kalevala? Well even the "key" to end the game is Sampo. Sampo is a mythical item from Kalevala, far more useful than say, philosopher's stone as Sampo can be used to churn money, salt and wheat endlessy but in a controlled manner.

Thank you for your corrections, I appreciate the thought put into your reply. You can't always trust Google XD

Upon re-reading everything so far, I agree with the strong ties this cauldron mystery has with Kalevala. Later I'll start reading more of Rune 9. This feels like the right direction.
Is there a big difference between the versions? Upon looking online, all I can gather is the newer version is simplified and has more poems

[Prodeses]

Machine translation is usually useless what comes to Finnish.

About the versions. The one I linked earlier seems to be translated correctly as the idea is translated. A downside is that some individual words are not same in english version. Also Lönnrot published Kalevala at 1835 and therefore language is bit different compared to say, modern Finnish. Then there's different dialects as well... (Wands Vihta and Vasta are good examples. Both means same thing)

So for the sake of everyone's mental health let's assume if the answer is hidden in Kalevala it's not version dependent.

[Prodeses]

I managed to get my hands on year 1975 edition (boys they put effort to books back then).

This one seems to be more or less similar enough to my earlier references so maybe the answer isn't version bound (still if it's even related to Kalevala).

During rereading Rune nine I paid more attention to mothers of iron. Yea, there's three of them. Each of them has a different color of milk. Black (mentioned earlier), white and red.

Red is obliviously Blood. White, maybe Levitatium (looks closest to white in my eyes) and black is likely Void liquid. Or Instant deathium, whatever that's actually is (I hasn't played beta branch).

Anyone skilled enough to mix these three ingredients up?

[Helios]

Originally posted by Prodeses:

I managed to get my hands on year 1975 edition (boys they put effort to books back then).

This one seems to be more or less similar enough to my earlier references so maybe the answer isn't version bound (still if it's even related to Kalevala).

During rereading Rune nine I paid more attention to mothers of iron. Yea, there's three of them. Each of them has a different color of milk. Black (mentioned earlier), white and red.

Red is obliviously Blood. White, maybe Levitatium (looks closest to white in my eyes) and black is likely Void liquid. Or Instant deathium, whatever that's actually is (I hasn't played beta branch).

Anyone skilled enough to mix these three ingredients up?

Yooo, new Cauldron Puzzle theory!

Levitatium is a good idea to try. Whilst looking for other options of what could play as one of the different milks, I came across a whitish liquid called Hearty Porridge. When consumed it can heal the player. I don't 100% know if this is still in the game, but I thought it might be worth noting.

[Prodeses]

Healthy porridge. Just pick "Eat you vegetables" perk and you get a full potion of that.