Songs of Conquest

Songs of Conquest

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-Tau- 19 ABR 2024 a las 22:10
Fourth mission loth campaign
Damn that mission is fuu... hard, send me a smoke signal if it gets balanced and i will gladly come back :lunar2019piginablanket:
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Mostrando 76-90 de 92 comentarios
Fransens 26 ENE a las 4:50 
Not gonna lie, this stuff is why I eventually always get turned off by HOMM and the like.
You are supposed to be everywhere with your 3 heroes and are facting bullcrap opposition.

You don't know where the beacons are. And once you spot them they usually are out of reach or behind encounters for your current army, so rushing them is not an option.

Trying to focus on the big city to get stacks of high tier units to counter the literal doomstacks of ELDER DRAGONS you face later also doesn't work.
If you think you can go high-tier, think again!
You can only improve your army sizes and have Legions or go full tech but you don't have the build slots to get all tier 3 buildings.
I've managed to nab the Barya city only to find frogs backdooring me like I'm an extra in a Johnny Sins flick.

Long story short:
Campaign story, lore, the songs... I like all of that.
But when the mission expects me to do total mapcontrol with 3 heroes, of which only one is really ever going to have a full 9 slot army, while you are up against 3x Level 15+ Wielders that come with full doomstacks and just either chase you down or snipe your mission objectives or towns... yeah, I call BS.

I'm 100% sure it's possible.
But I'm not playing this kind of game to constantly save and load just so I get that one particular sequence of events right that doesn't end up screwing my whole run over.

Enough ranting.
I just don't have the time and energy anymore to repeatedly bash my head against the wall to beat a level like when I was a kid.
Oh and if you wanna laugh, all that was on Fair difficulty.
So I guess I'm not even Worthy but whatever.
Fransens 26 ENE a las 5:00 
Publicado originalmente por Lavapotion:
...Rana aggression for example is based on if you act aggressive towards them...

This is probably the single most helpful tip for the mission.
Maaayyybe I'll give it another shot by focusing north to get the 2nd city from Barya at the very start.
yakyakos 28 ENE a las 11:51 
Hi, as everyoneget to this point in worthy with no real big problem (some save/load) but no blocking point. Here well... i get destroyed by all the wielder attacking from everywhere.

I didn t see a tip on what kind of troops you use ? Only undead ? what level 3 building did you choose to win ? (you can have 2 on 3 at beginning not all 3). Do you use rats sometimes ?

any good tips on troops will be welcome

thanks
Fransens 29 ENE a las 0:00 
Publicado originalmente por yakyakos:
Hi, as everyoneget to this point in worthy with no real big problem (some save/load) but no blocking point. Here well... i get destroyed by all the wielder attacking from everywhere.

I didn t see a tip on what kind of troops you use ? Only undead ? what level 3 building did you choose to win ? (you can have 2 on 3 at beginning not all 3). Do you use rats sometimes ?

any good tips on troops will be welcome

thanks
What I've heard is to stick to the left and top side from when you get the city to the bottom left. One of the devs said that the Rana don't really go for you until you attack them.
Which may include invading swamp territory but that is just my guess.
If you go north from the actual city and then east and take the city from Barya you should, theoretically, be set when it comes to income and building slots.
The starting city alone just won't cut it.

Another thing:
It seems you can at least put the Barya wielders out of commission once you've defeated them so going for them first will help alot.

Disclaimer:
This is just what I've read about the mission so far.
I haven't had the time or energy to try again yet with those pointers.

Good Luck!
Together For Her!
Lavapotion  [desarrollador] 29 ENE a las 4:32 
Publicado originalmente por yakyakos:
Hi, as everyoneget to this point in worthy with no real big problem (some save/load) but no blocking point. Here well... i get destroyed by all the wielder attacking from everywhere.

I didn t see a tip on what kind of troops you use ? Only undead ? what level 3 building did you choose to win ? (you can have 2 on 3 at beginning not all 3). Do you use rats sometimes ?

any good tips on troops will be welcome

thanks

I think you've gotten som great tips already. But I'll throw in a few more?

Take the first bigger city to the south early, it will be your backbone.

I prioritize Research before Legions, especially if you plan on attacking Barya first, they have a tendency to throw some justice spells on you.

The first Wielder (or one of the first) that you will meet is Everthink, Going toe to toe with essence against him is tricky because he soaks the damage, so use the spells on buffs and non-damage things instead, it'll serve you better.

Remember that rats are nice and together with research they come in massive numbers and bite hard!

And don't be afraid of switching tactics after you've beaten Everthink, other Wielders don't have his magic resistance.

And remember that the beacons are teleports, move around, get back home and restock!
Fransens 29 ENE a las 4:56 
Publicado originalmente por Lavapotion:
Publicado originalmente por yakyakos:
Hi, as everyoneget to this point in worthy with no real big problem (some save/load) but no blocking point. Here well... i get destroyed by all the wielder attacking from everywhere.

I didn t see a tip on what kind of troops you use ? Only undead ? what level 3 building did you choose to win ? (you can have 2 on 3 at beginning not all 3). Do you use rats sometimes ?

any good tips on troops will be welcome

thanks

I think you've gotten som great tips already. But I'll throw in a few more?

Take the first bigger city to the south early, it will be your backbone.

I prioritize Research before Legions, especially if you plan on attacking Barya first, they have a tendency to throw some justice spells on you.

The first Wielder (or one of the first) that you will meet is Everthink, Going toe to toe with essence against him is tricky because he soaks the damage, so use the spells on buffs and non-damage things instead, it'll serve you better.

Remember that rats are nice and together with research they come in massive numbers and bite hard!

And don't be afraid of switching tactics after you've beaten Everthink, other Wielders don't have his magic resistance.

And remember that the beacons are teleports, move around, get back home and restock!
Yeah, Everthink's -80% magic damage taken cost me the first try.
Until then I've rolled over everything with our favorite sassy scholar and his magic.
Everthink made me re-evaluate getting magic resist on all future wielders.
Lavapotion  [desarrollador] 29 ENE a las 5:45 
Sassy Scholar is a great way to describe him.
Fransens 29 ENE a las 6:28 
Publicado originalmente por Lavapotion:
Sassy Scholar is a great way to describe him.
Brother Vermintide...
yakyakos 30 ENE a las 6:57 
Well after many other try, save/load, my conclusion is easy : i didn t get the chance to get spel dommage reduction on any of my heroes. And without it, this mission is just impossible. Any frog fireball make 400+ dommage to my army. and they can cast it sometimes 2 times per turn. they just entangle and destroy my army piece by piece. i can make some dommage but they DO have spel resist on my run. Even the simpliedt forg, full upgraded with 80 and the defend skills, i can barely scrtach them. dragons are the easiest with justice. but every big stack is impossible to kill. they do 1000+ to any of my stack. and that is the first hero frog i met... i was able to crush the others color. My problem is not the stacks and i have even upgraded most of the troops and the stack too. but their heroes are just supra strong and the frog are just 10 times better then any undead. so end of the story for me (about 15 hours in that missions total). thanks for the tips anyway :)
Bumc 31 ENE a las 11:11 
Just beat it on overwhelming.

Didn't have magic resist on anyone, so instead I just never fought Everthink or Fae army and took 7 other beacons. Rana spellcasters pretty much wiped out my main stack every engagement, but the map has a lot of free skeletons to collect and those eventually get 50% magic resistance.
koh_earl 31 ENE a las 21:23 
Loth 4 is not hard. Try barya 1, thats hard

Loth 4 is hard if you go Ambertia and stack destruction spells - You lose hard as some rana wielders have ridiculous spell resistance

If you focus on rat boy and focus on rats/ necromancer, the campaign is pretty straightforward. Rats + the arcane spell that pushes units gives you a free retaliation attack that makes Hilar very cost efficient. Always remember to cast generate essence on your necromancers before their turn starts to boost your total essence per turn.
yakyakos 2 FEB a las 6:07 
It is hard. i beat it finally... because i started the whole campaign again and get magic resist on one of the wielder. with this, it was "easy". But without impossible. That is what is not well balanced. i have the same exemple during the last campaign. Mission 3. The heroes against me get magic resist specialization. and bad luck i specilaise my tinker in full magic dommage. Guess what ? Hard mission. So far i am able to contain the 2 heroes, but i don t think i will win this one again. because i get all the south of the map they get the north, but each time i kill them in 2 or 3 turn they come back with a full army. I have only 2 town so i will eventually be out of troops way before him . and i am capped at 20 so except i have all of the items on the map i will not be able to strengh myself . So i will need to restart this one and i assume be much more agressive and don t let them occupy the whole north
Lavapotion  [desarrollador] 3 FEB a las 0:25 
Publicado originalmente por yakyakos:
It is hard. i beat it finally... because i started the whole campaign again and get magic resist on one of the wielder. with this, it was "easy". But without impossible. That is what is not well balanced. i have the same exemple during the last campaign. Mission 3. The heroes against me get magic resist specialization. and bad luck i specilaise my tinker in full magic dommage. Guess what ? Hard mission. So far i am able to contain the 2 heroes, but i don t think i will win this one again. because i get all the south of the map they get the north, but each time i kill them in 2 or 3 turn they come back with a full army. I have only 2 town so i will eventually be out of troops way before him . and i am capped at 20 so except i have all of the items on the map i will not be able to strengh myself . So i will need to restart this one and i assume be much more agressive and don t let them occupy the whole north

It shouldn't be so hard that you have to have a certain "build" to complete it, but well done regardless. I did a recent playthrough on worthy again and I didn't remember it being THAT hard. Now I am far from the best player at the office and worthy usually sits pretty well with me.

I rushed and took the city to the west with Hillar as fast as I could, I focused on research instead of High Legion and I remembered that Hillar is good with rats, then I tried to tackle Barya as fast as I could so that they didn't go east and mess with the frogs and start a two-front war that I couldn't handle. After beating Barya I refocused a bit and used my second city to build some HIgh Legions and used that as a staging ground to push against Rana.

Tough but doable. Had to flee using the beacons a couple of times.
-Tau- 3 FEB a las 10:21 
Publicado originalmente por Lavapotion:
Publicado originalmente por yakyakos:
It is hard. i beat it finally... because i started the whole campaign again and get magic resist on one of the wielder. with this, it was "easy". But without impossible. That is what is not well balanced. i have the same exemple during the last campaign. Mission 3. The heroes against me get magic resist specialization. and bad luck i specilaise my tinker in full magic dommage. Guess what ? Hard mission. So far i am able to contain the 2 heroes, but i don t think i will win this one again. because i get all the south of the map they get the north, but each time i kill them in 2 or 3 turn they come back with a full army. I have only 2 town so i will eventually be out of troops way before him . and i am capped at 20 so except i have all of the items on the map i will not be able to strengh myself . So i will need to restart this one and i assume be much more agressive and don t let them occupy the whole north

It shouldn't be so hard that you have to have a certain "build" to complete it, but well done regardless. I did a recent playthrough on worthy again and I didn't remember it being THAT hard. Now I am far from the best player at the office and worthy usually sits pretty well with me.

I rushed and took the city to the west with Hillar as fast as I could, I focused on research instead of High Legion and I remembered that Hillar is good with rats, then I tried to tackle Barya as fast as I could so that they didn't go east and mess with the frogs and start a two-front war that I couldn't handle. After beating Barya I refocused a bit and used my second city to build some HIgh Legions and used that as a staging ground to push against Rana.

Tough but doable. Had to flee using the beacons a couple of times.
Are you going to balance that mission a little bit more or are you going to leave it that way? I'll wait if that's the case.
While the mission is certainly difficult (especially on your first attempt, even more so on Overwhelming), it is far from unbeatable.
Here's some advice:
- Everthink and 2/3 of the Rana wielders are magic users, so the battles with them tend to be short and explosive. Since they are so heavily invested into magic, their units tend to die fairly quickly, making initiative very important. Luckily, there's a Seers Hut to the North East with the "Prepared" skill
- It's worthwhile grabbing the initiative research on your undead units for the same reason
* If you manage to get a bit of an initiative lead, you can slam Quicken on High Legions and charge into the Baryan backlines. They won't last long due to Justice, but this early cleave can deal immense damage and decide the battle
* This also allows you to reposition your troops at the start of the battle to minimize the damage of AoE spells, cannons and neutral dragons
- Magnolia is (as far as I know) the only wielder you have that can learn Magic Resistance (prerequisite: Order Magic), so if you wanna be able to tank their spells, you'll have to rely on her
- The small settlement at the start, the city and the large settlement of Barya can all be taken fairly early. You'll lose units, but there are plenty of free units on the map and Ambertina will supply you with some as well.
- If you don't want to fight a 2 front war, then just don't attack the Rana. They'll leave you alone if you do. This alone makes this mission SO much more bearable
- You don't necessarily need to fight with all your wielders. 1-2 of them can just be on collection duty with no or minimal troops. This leaves more movement points for your combat wielder(s) to spend on getting stronger. They can also sit behind your main wielder(s) with troops to resupply them after a battle
- I primarily used Legionnaries, Banes, Necros and High Legions, but the other 2 Tier 2 units are also perfectly viable, Blessed Bones for their high durability, magic resistance and initiative and Seneschals for their ability to easily get into backlines and their ability to steal essence. Rats might also be viable, but I'm just not a huge fan of these glass cannons, so I rarely tend to use them with Loth
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