My opinion on Subnautica/Below Zero

[Big Bozzles]

First off everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I don't judge anyone for liking or disliking a game. This is just my opinion on Subnautica and it's sequel and i'm curious if anyone agrees or disagrees with what I have to say. (Sorry if i cover things others have talked about already... i'm not gonna read through thousands of posts)

I'll start by saying that Subnautica quickly became one of the best games I personally ever played. When I learned they were returning with below zero I had high hopes and knew going in that it would be hard to live up to any expectations I had.

So I gave below zero a lot of slack early on. I didn't want to judge it for not being the exact same experience I had with the first game. After all the devs should try and push the game forward and try new things.

Where I think they fell short was all in execution. It's my opinion (and i know this has already been discussed all throughout early access) that the story just felt unbelievable, corny, pointless at times and just over all disappointing.

The thing that made the story in Subnautica work was it's simplicity. What were you trying to do? Survive. That's it. So the game felt less like a game and more like what your experience might really be like if you were in that situation.

Now as far as the story in Below Zero, i've yet to experience the final ending that they released upon launch so I won't comment on that. And feel free to criticize me for commenting at all on a story I haven't finished yet, I get your point. But my issues are with the convoluted nature of how this story compares to the simple one of the first game. It feels like two unrelated stories happening simultaneously. Once you get to the point where you found out what happened to Sam and you cure the Kharaa virus, from Robin's point of view she did what she came to do, but oh yea know there's this alien in my head so I gotta deal with that. I just feel like you could've told either story alone and the experience would've been better. Mixing the two together just makes me less engaged with both to the point where I don't feel anything about what's going on. Where as in Subnautica the story it told was never once hindered by what your goal was. And that's not to mention all the plot holes the plague Below Zero, but I know this post is already gonna be long enough so I won't even go into that.

Then there's the voice acting. In Subnautica you get the bulk of the dialogue through PDA logs left behind by other people. The acting in the original game was never mind blowing, but it felt believable. You could feel the tension between the members of the Degasi crew. I thought Maida was a little over the top with her delivery but I get it, you wanted a badass, cut throat mercenary type so you have her talk like one. As for the PDA's of the survivors from the Aurora, some were okay, others were pretty good and then you had the 1 or 2 that I remember that actually impressed me. Like that one guy "I am the one, on and off and on again" as he's sinking to his death knowing there is no hope left.

Meanwhile in Below Zero, I just can't stop myself from cringing with nearly every PDA I pick up. Every time I search online for any opinions on below zero's voice acting the vast majority of what I see are people praising the acting. Again, everyone's entitled to their opinions but I just can't see how some of those logs can be considered good acting. It feels lifeless, like half the actors are just reading their scripts with half-assed emotions. And that "Manu" guy, jesus I can't stand that dudes voice, but maybe i'm just overreacting. Over all they could have gotten rid of probably half or more of the logs in the game and the player wouldn't have known any difference. You get bits and pieces of what was going on here and there but there's also so much nonsense thrown in that's completely unnecessary.

All in all I reduced my expectations for Below Zero drastically since I first heard about it and even further when I learned of all the road blocks they hit along the way. But I still remained excited and hopeful that I would get some sense of that awe I had when I played the original. And I have to say, i'm a little shocked at just how disappointed I really am.

There is a lot more I could talk about but that'll just devolve into rambling so i'll leave it here. If you guys agree, disagree with anything I said i'm open to reasonable discussions about it. I'm not trying to argue with anyone here

Also I will definitely finish the game, but unfortunately I doubt I will come back for a second play through.

[silvanfan]

To be fair, Marguerit is in Subnautica. We just thought she had died in the PDA that indicated she was going off to hunt the reaper leviathan around the Degassi base. PDAs in BZ indicate she fought the reaper, won, and rode its body to safety. I actually listened to one of the Degassi PDA's and her voice actress, if not the same, is similar to the first game. So I her current voice would be confinuity of that, really.

[Lu]

For me, having played the game as soon as it came out in early access and knowing that original story, it was a bit of a let down to play it now.

I loved the premise of Robin being a scientist that stumbled upon Al-an, and that story line being the main focus of the game. The vesper in the sky was a really cool idea and robin getting to talk to Sam and still working for Alterra while having to keep Al-an hidden, it made for a cool premise.

But with the current story, everything is kicked off with what happened to Sam, a murder mystery story almost. It's like Al-an's storyline, which should be the main focus, is a side effect and not the main plot line. And the whole Robin going to the planet incognito, and the action sequence at the start, it feels over the top in comparison to the original story.

The new premise is dramatic, and the focus on Sam's story line kinda takes away from Al-an's story line. To me it doesn't truly come together in a cohesive manner.

I didn't hate it, I just wished maybe I hadn't played the first version so I wouldn't feel disappointed now.

[silvanfan]

Originally posted by Big Bozzles:

Where I think they fell short was all in execution. It's my opinion (and i know this has already been discussed all throughout early access) that the story just felt unbelievable, corny, pointless at times and just over all disappointing.

I totally agree with this bit here. I wrote a post earlier about my feelings about the game, and the story in particular.

Honestly, while I agree with you about the voice acting sounding passionless, I preferred the voiced PDAs because it was easier for me to play recording while going off on my business, instead of having to wait until I'm in a safe, oxygenated, warm place to read. But I do agree with you about the quality of the acting. I give it a pass though. I don't expect marvels from a small studio.

Honestly, I came on here because I had seen so many positive reviews, but honestly, reading the comments, there's a lot that are flat out negative for very arbitrary reasons. You'll find a lot that (supposedly) won't buy the game because the PDA voice sounds Indian, or that a few characters are queer (which makes it politicial? I TRULY don't see how). I would say, my dude, you'll find a lot of people agree with you, and a few that will disagree.

In the end, you're not alone in your thoughts about this game.

[#1 Slime NA]

I can forgive a weak story with a strong game behind it and vice-versa, but I truly don't think Below Zero lives up to its predecessor on either point. Subnautica managed to do a lot with a silent protagonist and immersive, organic exploratory storytelling, along with some visual storytelling. Hell, the opening moment of the game when you first climb out of your lifepod and see the vast ocean around you and the burning ship in the distance manages to tell a more memorable story in a few seconds of wordless animation than the entirety of Below Zero does. The rule of cinema is "show, don't tell" - books tell you a story, movies show it to you. The rule for videogames has to be a point beyond that. If the player doesn't feel immersed in the game world, the story is going to bounce right off the same way it does when a film tells its entire story through expositional dialogue.

[Andreas]

Originally posted by SlyGoat:

Hell, the opening moment of the game when you first climb out of your lifepod and see the vast ocean around you and the burning ship in the distance manages to tell a more memorable story in a few seconds of wordless animation than the entirety of Below Zero does.

Yes, that's one of the best moments in Subnautica and BZ has nothing even remotely comparable.

[Ruiner]

Originally posted by Andreas:

Originally posted by SlyGoat:

Hell, the opening moment of the game when you first climb out of your lifepod and see the vast ocean around you and the burning ship in the distance manages to tell a more memorable story in a few seconds of wordless animation than the entirety of Below Zero does.

Yes, that's one of the best moments in Subnautica and BZ has nothing even remotely comparable.

BZ can't compete. In Subnautica you're injured, alone, and your lifepod is on fire. When you fix that issue and start exploring, the Aurora explodes, which is a huge event. Things just keep going from bad to worse. A rescue ship is coming, it's destroyed by planetary defences. Things are still going from bad to worse. There's radio messages, when you check them out, everyone has been killed. Bad to worse.

Everything is fine in BZ, practically everything is pointless when it comes to the story and completely irrelevant. Sam who? Marg who? AL-AN, that's who.

[Andreas]

Originally posted by Ruiner:

Everything is fine in BZ, practically everything is pointless when it comes to the story and completely irrelevant. Sam who? Marg who? AL-AN, that's who.

Actually, Al-An feels not very different from the PDA. He doesn't really help nor does he seem particularly interested in your situation, apart from some light conversation.
He's a GPS with some Siri mixed in.

[Ruiner]

Originally posted by Andreas:

Originally posted by Ruiner:

Everything is fine in BZ, practically everything is pointless when it comes to the story and completely irrelevant. Sam who? Marg who? AL-AN, that's who.

Actually, Al-An feels not very different from the PDA. He doesn't really help nor does he seem particularly interested in your situation, apart from some light conversation.
He's a GPS with some Siri mixed in.

Al-An is interesting and engaging. But unfortunately he's talking to a tween pretending to be a scientist, who has absolutely no scientific curiosity at all. It's not possible to have an interesting conversation with a brick wall.

[Andreas]

Originally posted by Ruiner:

unfortunately he's talking to a tween pretending to be a scientist, who has absolutely no scientific curiosity at all. It's not possible to have an interesting conversation with a brick wall.

You have a point there.

[Big Bozzles]

Originally posted by silvanfan:

To be fair, Marguerit is in Subnautica. We just thought she had died in the PDA that indicated she was going off to hunt the reaper leviathan around the Degassi base. PDAs in BZ indicate she fought the reaper, won, and rode its body to safety. I actually listened to one of the Degassi PDA's and her voice actress, if not the same, is similar to the first game. So I her current voice would be confinuity of that, really.

Well just to clarify, when I mentioned Maida's voice acting I was only referring to the performance in the original Subnautica. I was saying that although I enjoyed the vast majority of all voice acting in Subnautica I didn't think everything was perfect by any means.

Then comparatively when I thought about Below Zero's voice acting I thought that very little met that same caliber.

I think the point you're making is that Maida's voice and the way she talks is a representation of all the bad ass things she does? Which I totally agree with. Her voice acting just wasn't my favorite from the original game.

Lemme know if I misunderstood your take

[Big Bozzles]

Originally posted by Doom Kitten:

For me, having played the game as soon as it came out in early access and knowing that original story, it was a bit of a let down to play it now.

I loved the premise of Robin being a scientist that stumbled upon Al-an, and that story line being the main focus of the game. The vesper in the sky was a really cool idea and robin getting to talk to Sam and still working for Alterra while having to keep Al-an hidden, it made for a cool premise.

But with the current story, everything is kicked off with what happened to Sam, a murder mystery story almost. It's like Al-an's storyline, which should be the main focus, is a side effect and not the main plot line. And the whole Robin going to the planet incognito, and the action sequence at the start, it feels over the top in comparison to the original story.

The new premise is dramatic, and the focus on Sam's story line kinda takes away from Al-an's story line. To me it doesn't truly come together in a cohesive manner.

I didn't hate it, I just wished maybe I hadn't played the first version so I wouldn't feel disappointed now.

Yea I played a good bit of both games while they were in early access too. I totally agree that I kinda wish I hadn't just so everything would be completely fresh but too late haha. And yea when I found out they had revamped the story half way through I got really concerned. Not because I loved where it was going exactly (I did think it was cool though) but because that's a huge 180 in the making of anything and who knows where it'll go from there.

I think you said it better about the 'two story issue'. I wasn't really sure exactly how to put it but what you said made me realize that it kind of seems like the two stories are fighting to be the main plot line rather than working together to tell an overall interesting story.

I agree with you too, I don't hate Below Zero either. I think it just fell flat from what it could've been.

[Big Bozzles]

Originally posted by silvanfan:

Originally posted by Big Bozzles:

Where I think they fell short was all in execution. It's my opinion (and i know this has already been discussed all throughout early access) that the story just felt unbelievable, corny, pointless at times and just over all disappointing.

I totally agree with this bit here. I wrote a post earlier about my feelings about the game, and the story in particular.

Honestly, while I agree with you about the voice acting sounding passionless, I preferred the voiced PDAs because it was easier for me to play recording while going off on my business, instead of having to wait until I'm in a safe, oxygenated, warm place to read. But I do agree with you about the quality of the acting. I give it a pass though. I don't expect marvels from a small studio.

Honestly, I came on here because I had seen so many positive reviews, but honestly, reading the comments, there's a lot that are flat out negative for very arbitrary reasons. You'll find a lot that (supposedly) won't buy the game because the PDA voice sounds Indian, or that a few characters are queer (which makes it politicial? I TRULY don't see how). I would say, my dude, you'll find a lot of people agree with you, and a few that will disagree.

In the end, you're not alone in your thoughts about this game.

God, I know what you mean. The PDA is Indian and i'm a girl. Who cares. That doesn't bother me in the slightest. I loved Subnautica and despite my reservations about where Below Zero was headed before it finally launched I was always going to play through it at least once no matter what. I just can't help feeling like they really missed the mark, but you also can't please everyone so what can ya do?

I will say though that while I don't expect marvels from small studios either, I would expect that from a sequel of a widely loved game the devs would at least meet the same quality in most aspects or if not improve upon them. But this felt like a downgrade to me in many ways. I know that they went through big overhauls mid way through so I gotta cut them some slack for that at the same time.

And in Subnautica you can still listen to voice logs while playing. That may not have been possible when it launched but I know they at least put an update out at some point so you could, which I agree is a good piece of mind thing especially when 200m below the surface haha.

Overall I still enjoy Below Zero, I haven't written it off as a bad game. But in my mind it doesn't come close to the original. Thanks for feedback bro

[Big Bozzles]

Originally posted by SlyGoat:

I can forgive a weak story with a strong game behind it and vice-versa, but I truly don't think Below Zero lives up to its predecessor on either point. Subnautica managed to do a lot with a silent protagonist and immersive, organic exploratory storytelling, along with some visual storytelling. Hell, the opening moment of the game when you first climb out of your lifepod and see the vast ocean around you and the burning ship in the distance manages to tell a more memorable story in a few seconds of wordless animation than the entirety of Below Zero does. The rule of cinema is "show, don't tell" - books tell you a story, movies show it to you. The rule for videogames has to be a point beyond that. If the player doesn't feel immersed in the game world, the story is going to bounce right off the same way it does when a film tells its entire story through expositional dialogue.

100% agree with you. Subnautica did such an elegant job of telling it's story right from the jump to the very end. I wanted to know every detail in every voice log or data entry I came across because there wasn't anyone holding my hand along the way. And the mystery of it all was so engaging.

In Below Zero it just feels like their throwing it all at you so fast sometimes I don't even want to hear it.

It's that first experience that made the game what it was for me and I was hoping that somehow they were going to deliver again, something different of course but just as memorable and that's not at all what I felt.

I don't mean to sound all negative about Below Zero. It's still a good game and an amazing world but if i'm going in for another play through anytime soon it'll be in the original.

[Big Bozzles]

Originally posted by Ruiner:

Originally posted by Andreas:

Yes, that's one of the best moments in Subnautica and BZ has nothing even remotely comparable.

BZ can't compete. In Subnautica you're injured, alone, and your lifepod is on fire. When you fix that issue and start exploring, the Aurora explodes, which is a huge event. Things just keep going from bad to worse. A rescue ship is coming, it's destroyed by planetary defences. Things are still going from bad to worse. There's radio messages, when you check them out, everyone has been killed. Bad to worse.

Everything is fine in BZ, practically everything is pointless when it comes to the story and completely irrelevant. Sam who? Marg who? AL-AN, that's who.

Exactly. There are very little stakes. The main fear aspect of the game is through your experience being one person alone on an alien water planet with giant creatures that want to eat you. In Below Zero the majority of those creatures don't feel threatening. With the exception of the leviathans down in the crystal caves. I will say those were the only ones that ever made me nervous while exploring. While the ice worm scared the crap out of me the first time I saw it, because I had no idea it was even in the game at that point, it quickly became more annoying than anything.

Meanwhile I can jump into my 3rd play through of Subnautica, know exactly where the nearest reaper is and sneak quietly passed it without a problem, but when I hear that roar I still get goosebumps thinking back to when I was staring at an abyss not knowing what was ahead of me and hearing that same faint sound in the distance.

Below Zero seems to try and add other threats at the same time. Maida doesn't like you because she thinks you work for Alterra (which I guess technically you do now) but her threat is only ever superficial, she never really does anything bad to you. Alan is in your head and you gotta find him a body to get him out, but he's treated more as a nuisance than anything. And you're hiding from Alterra because you're not supposed to be here. Which I find the weirdest part. Why are we hiding from Alterra? And what are the repercussions if we're caught? That's never mentioned so why should we care? It just seems like something they say at the very beginning to be dramatic but has no real reasoning in the game. Now maybe that's something that comes back at the very end and I just haven't gotten there yet, but for 90% of the game it's irrelevant.

So there doesn't feel like anything to be scared of in Below Zero which is a stark contrast to Subnautica. Which I have sunk 100's of hours in and played several times. There are still moments where my skin crawls.

[Kanthric]

Originally posted by Big Bozzles:

Originally posted by Ruiner:

BZ can't compete. In Subnautica you're injured, alone, and your lifepod is on fire. When you fix that issue and start exploring, the Aurora explodes, which is a huge event. Things just keep going from bad to worse. A rescue ship is coming, it's destroyed by planetary defences. Things are still going from bad to worse. There's radio messages, when you check them out, everyone has been killed. Bad to worse.

Everything is fine in BZ, practically everything is pointless when it comes to the story and completely irrelevant. Sam who? Marg who? AL-AN, that's who.

Exactly. There are very little stakes. In Below Zero the majority of those creatures don't feel threatening. Meanwhile I can jump into my 3rd play through of Subnautica, know exactly where the nearest reaper is and sneak quietly passed it without a problem, but when I hear that roar I still get goosebumps.

Below Zero seems to try and add other threats at the same time. Maida doesn't like you because she thinks you work for Alterra (which I guess technically you do now) but her threat is only ever superficial, she never really does anything bad to you. Alan is in your head and you gotta find him a body to get him out, but he's treated more as a nuisance than anything. And you're hiding from Alterra because you're not supposed to be here. Which I find the weirdest part. Why are we hiding from Alterra? And what are the repercussions if we're caught? That's never mentioned so why should we care? It just seems like something they say at the very beginning to be dramatic but has no real reasoning in the game.

So there doesn't feel like anything to be scared of in Below Zero which is a stark contrast to Subnautica.

Unknown Worlds did say they were aiming to make Below Zero a less terrifying experience for players. In this, they succeeded...but doing so was a massive failure.

One of the things Subnautica did so brilliantly was blending a beautiful environment with unbridled terror. The whole starting sequence where you haven't the faintest clue what's happening, then open your lifepod to see your ship crashed and burning and nothing but ocean all around, was a great way to hammer home "Yes, you're alone. And you're screwed." Then diving into the shallows opened up a breathtakingly gorgeous environment that just invited exploration, but showed from a very early stage that you can't take your safety for granted.

Even in the "Safe Shallows", you could run unexpectedly into Crashfish or get mobbed by Gasopods. When you tentatively explored the green haze of the kelp forest, the Stalkers were waiting to jump out at you before you had the tools and speed to give them the slip. In the Grassy Plateaus, the Sand Sharks happily ambushed you from nigh-on invisibility in the sea bed and the Biters randomly struck out at you if you didn't keep moving. One look at the Crabsnakes in the Mushroom Cave told you that swimming around those mushrooms hunting for magnetite was going to suck something awful.

Almost every biome carried explicitly hostile fauna happy to leap/charge at you, and even those which appeared safe were generally hiding surprises somewhere (hello, Bleeders hiding in the dark caves in the Sparse Reef). And mixed in with that were Mesmers taking control of your player, the Crabsquid and Leeches wrecking your energy and disabling your equipment, the warpers pulling you out of vehicles when you least expected it, and that's not even touching on the horrifying roar of the Reaper Leviathan or the unsettling-until-you-know-better moans of the Reefbacks. And hey, if you want to save yourself, you've got to face your fears and keep on descending into those darker, deeper depths which you just know will be the hunting grounds of something even worse...

Especially in the first playthrough, exploring and surviving and coming away with something useful felt like an achievement. But masterfully, the game never forced you down a path where you would face generic jumpscare #54, but just sat back and let you inflict it all on yourself while trying to get to the lifepod/wreck/installation you hoped would be the next drip-feed of something useful.

In Below Zero, things just don't *feel* as dangerous. On paper, the aggressive fauna still hits about as hard on average, but they don't have the psychological edge of their Subnautica cousins. Some of that is in the sound - there is no BZ equivalent of the Reaper's colossal roar of "death is coming for you...", or the ominous clicking of the Crabsquid. Some of it is in biome design - there are no areas comparatively crawling with Leviathans or sharks, and most biomes can be explored without risk of ambush. Some of it is in the creature design - the Squidshark itself is a surprisingly underwhelming ambush predator. The slow, obvious Rock Puncher is much less threatening to share a space with than hearing the multiple skitterings of cave crawlers who could jump you from a distance. The Sea Monkey and Lily Paddler are softer replacements for the Stalker and Mesmer.

And then the story follows the same path. Having (I think sensibly) not tried to repeat Subnautica's starting situation given we know about the planet and the precursors, the new setting introduced a number of potential hooks to create a sense of danger or threat but didn't successfully land any of them.

AL-AN, who is a member of a race with unrivalled telepathic control over machines and a distinct lack of ethics towards lesser races, seems content to be a passenger in your head who never screws with your equipment and who politely calls you before speaking to you rather than imposing himself Sea-Dragon style onto your vision and demanding you do his bidding. And the less said about how Maida was crowbarred into the story (oh yes, your sister randomly bumped into her and decided to discuss options for acts of terrorism over a fruit salad, and it's vitally important that Alterra be prevented from tracking you after the fact even when they already know you're both there and this isn't just a random quest involving a McGuffin because...uhm...oh look, a squirrel) the better.

I mean, don't get me wrong - BZ is still objectively good, and I'm enjoying it, but the shaken-up approach compared to the original just hasn't landed as effectively in so many different areas that overall it falls well short of the magic of its predecessor.