Scarab

[Dæmon]

I like the customization and all but why do we get to store weapons for the Scarab in the Scarab inventory if we can't use it for anything?

I thought that you could swap out turrets on the fly instead of being locked to 4/4 or 8/8 ammo and then done. The trade off being that you would have to pay to refill like the rest of the weapons, and the danger in keeping fx 7 weapons and it getting destroyed.

[Kanjejou]

So you can chose a weapon but cannot swap it in battle?

[Dæmon]

You can put weapons FOR THE VEHICLE into the inventory... which makes no sense... that it can carry extra ammo and medpacks for the soldiers is nice... but it just makes no sense that you can put the weapons for the vehicle into the inventory of said vehicle and take it into battle x) it doesn't matter much once you know it, but I could just aswell have thrown a couple of extra turrets away unless I savescummed :-P

[Faust]

While some weapons are fine, but some....
4 Flamer shots or 1 goo shot feels quite weird when you compare their effectiveness with Scarab or Buggie rocket weapons. I understand that something must be done in order to preserve balance, but may be it would be possible to add some sort of vehicle ammo packages (make them expensive or make reloading to take full turn for vehicle and probably one soldier that will do ammo reloading). Biggest problem with most weapons - they fall off in the middle and late game quite drastically du to numbers and resilence of enemies.
Early on - 4 shots from scarab cannon is absolutely brutal for tough enemies, but in the middle of the game - there are just too many of them, and most of the time Vehicle is used as scout and glorified cargo truck.

[DaBo81]

You can use vehicles well into the late game, even on legend setting - it's more viable than ever with the vehicle upgrades, although some of the upgrades need a boost to be on par with the better options. In most missions they're really useful.
The only vehicle that I don't like much is the ASPIDA - not enough health, not enough armour, and its weapons are low impact.
People sometimes post that they want ammo reloads for the vehicles, but I think they'd become OP - perhaps more ammo for some of the ASPIDA and armadillo weapons, but 8 rockets is plenty for the scarab, and the buggy already has lots of ammo between its 2 guns.

[Kanjejou]

Maybe not reload but when most vehicules weapons can only shot between 4 to 8 times.

That less than most soldier weapon magazine and few deal more than soldiers weapons.

[mergele]

Out of curiousity, are vehicles still 3 capacity? I've modded them to be 2 and think that is a good spot for them to be at and I think to remember them also saying pre-kaos engines that they set the mutogs to 2, but not sure if the normal vehicles are also at 2 now in vanilla.

[DaBo81]

Vehicles use up 3 slots still; I guess mutogs curl up in a ball on the plane. I think the ASPIDA should only take up 2 slots as well, since it is much less effective than the other 3 vehicles - they can say it's a lightweight vehicle or something.
@ Kanjejou - a vehicles weapons are only part of what makes them useful, it's the damage soaking, transport, immunity to most special attacks. All those things are so useful, and the DLC gave 3 of the vehicles armour boosts.

[Kanjejou]

@DaBo81: it's the damage soaking, transport, immunity to most special attacks.

Aspida and Scarab dont soak that well after early game , immunity to Which special attack? mind effects?Vehicules recieved armor boost? what was their previous armor values?

Still think vehicules should have more shots available per weapons (as a slot upgrade for exemple, expanded ammo rack?) or reload available or only take 2 slots maybe as a later game research.

I find that mid late ennemies shred armor and hp so fast that vehicule loose some utility

[Artek [General]]

Originally posted by mergele:

Out of curiousity, are vehicles still 3 capacity? I've modded them to be 2 and think that is a good spot for them to be at and I think to remember them also saying pre-kaos engines that they set the mutogs to 2, but not sure if the normal vehicles are also at 2 now in vanilla.

Vehicles are still 3, yes. Considering that latest DLC effectively acts as a buff to them - that sounds a lot more reasonable now.

Upgraded Scarab is terrifying with those 120 damage rockets and can pretty much delete any pandoran below a siren. Those who survive are usually left without multiple limbs causing them to either escape from the map or bleed out trying.

Upgraded Armadildo can cover majority of maps in a single turn, making drive by tactics even more ridiculous. Napalm GL guarantees death to any arhtron or triton it hits.

Haven't tried Aspida, but i doubt its falling far behind.

Mutogs were reduced to taking only 2 slots to let them keep up. You can put one on Helious and rapidly deliver him as extra reinforcements to any Manticore operation.

[DaBo81]

@Kanjejou
I don't like the ASPIDA and I only use them if I find them, but the scarab has high armour and 900hp, which is a really good baseline for soaking damage. On top of this you can include a technician that can repair damage as long as he has the gadget arms - it just costs 1 action point and 1 WP. The new DLC allows you to buy an upgrade to the armour that adds 20 to most locations - that's a lot of damage soaking.

By immunity to special attacks, I mean vehicles aren't affected by fire, poison, psychic, and a bunch of other things - there are some that affect them, such as shred, piercing, acid, and goo, but it's a much shorter list.

Transporting soldiers and allowing them to fire and then re-enter a vehicle is really strong and it's another reason I don't like the ASPIDA, as it can only carry one soldier - or 2 if you pay extra.

[Kanjejou]

yeah but aspida already inflict a lot of paralysis (enough to one turn paralyse most pandoran) and is very very fast for little AP and have half the size of the two other, if it was also a good drive-by vehicule he would be too good

[MagnusGrey]

The only use for vehicles past the early game is for base defense, since you are not limited by squad size, i havent tried ones from the expansion yet though.

[DaBo81]

I personally think the buggy, scarab, and armadillo are fine going into the late game, with support from technicians, but the ASPIDA could use a boost, such as more ammo, since it's such a poor transport vehicle and doesn't take much damage.
I've tried the upgraded weapons for ASPIDA from the DLC and many of those shots miss - the bendy arms cause a lot of paralysis but it's melee only - they just feel low impact. If you want a melee vehicle use a mutog, they can absorb loads of damage, have no ammo limit, and now only take 2 slots on a plane.

[LeftPaw]

Where does it tell me how many slots a vehicle uses up in my aircraft?

[Dæmon]

Originally posted by WetNose:

Where does it tell me how many slots a vehicle uses up in my aircraft?

I am not 100%, but I believe it is in your Phoenixpedia ingame somewhere; it is written in connection with the tutorials, that is for sure.