I don't understand the mod.io hate

[Snæbjørn]

As I understand it mod.io for TP is free and seamless (no account, no login - on the surface at least).

I don't care if it uses one or the other. Why do you?
If you think that steam workshop support will grant you access to the tabletop sim mods, then I can assure you that it will not. As they're not compatible.

Please explain why it matters, because I don't get this debate.

[Niall]

Well already some of the mods from TTS have been made for TTP. Games like this have a casual playerbase and workshop is simple and easy to use. I know mod.io is easy to use as well. The lack of it may just put people off. The player counts for TTP are shockingly low on Steam.

At time of writing there have been 6 players in the last 24 hours. There was a maximum of 33 players ever. That is terrible. Maybe its too niche and TTS has had years to build a community and perhaps they are reluctant to leave, even though TTP is a better engine. I fear the devs for TTP have shot themselves in the foot by omitting workshop.

Both could coexist. I hope they do implement workshop it would be nice to get a game once in a while. I can barely find any games.

[Snæbjørn]

Lack of community and lack of mods for TTP I can understand. It's pretty much a Catch 22 :(
Lack of mods is what is holding my purchase back.

Both could coexist. I hope they do implement workshop it would be nice to get a game once in a while. I can barely find any games.

Does the steam workshop help you find games? I thought steam workshop was the mod stuff.
Unless you're referring to people not buying TTP because of no workshop support.

[bluemonday]

TTS was released 6 years earlier and was the first game of this kind. It already had a huge community and most people who are interested in this niche will already own it or at least know about it. They may have all kinds of reasons why they don't switch, but workshop support surely isn't at the top of the list. Most of them probably just haven't even heard of TTP, others wait for the community to grow.

[Malbrek]

The big issue is that they shot for the moon way too early. Mod.io future-proofs their modbase so that when they port the game to other consoles, like the Switch, then players can download the same mods. This is definitely a good feature.

However, this game is currently available on PC only, meaning that having to use mod.io is more trouble for users to download and maintain their mods because it requires users to make another account just for mods. If they had focused on using the Steam Workshop while they develop the game for PC, this game would be much more popular than it currently is.
I agree with the developers choosing to use mod.io for the sake of console compatibility, but there are no console releases. A console port is something that seems too distant in time to wait for.

Most players who use this game don't want to bother making another account to store mods when they are aware that there is already integrated mod storage via the Steam Workshop.

[Snæbjørn]

Originally posted by Malbrek:

Most players who use this game don't want to bother making another account to store mods when they are aware that there is already integrated mod storage via the Steam Workshop.

I saw the devs address this

Originally posted by https://steamcommunity.com/app/838410/discussions/0/3004430610119535509/#c5544461758378807195:

She doesn't need to know or care about mod.io, and she doesn't need to set up another account. There's only a single click to agree that she wants to use mod.io the first time it is used (which is legally required in some countries). I hope you can enjoy the game together!

That says that it's completely integrated into the game without requiring another account.

That's why I claimed it's "seamless (no account, no login ..."

[Plasticity Studios]

That's true: while you technically have an account with mod.io, it is created with a single click and connected to your Steam account. No registering by mail or remembering another password is required.

[crossmr]

We hate it because it doesn't work. I thought I'd give this another try since the first time mod.io wouldn't even let me register properly. I subscribed to a set of figures, there was definitely a download, I saw the bar go, and then..nothing. I can't find them anywhere. If I try to start a game and go to load, no entry. If I start a game with an empty table and then go to the object library nothing there. Edit mode..nope still can't be found.

[Plasticity Studios]

Originally posted by crossmr:

We hate it because it doesn't work. I thought I'd give this another try since the first time mod.io wouldn't even let me register properly. I subscribed to a set of figures, there was definitely a download, I saw the bar go, and then..nothing. I can't find them anywhere. If I try to start a game and go to load, no entry. If I start a game with an empty table and then go to the object library nothing there. Edit mode..nope still can't be found.

If the download happened, that is most likely not related to mod.io. The package itself might be the issue, please contact us on Discord or via mail so we can help to resolve it.

[Rioden]

I don't like the idea I have to give my steam info to a third party so I can play a game on steam. I think that could lead to some bad things happening to people's steam accounts.

I have been playing TTS for quite a few years now. I am just under two thousand hours on the game. I do agree that TTS does have a lot of issues, both from a player point of view and as a content creator point of view.

I have watched quite a few videos on the creation process, and game play on TTP. It seems like they have improved on a lot of the issues with TTS. The creation process seems a lot more streamlined.

But I don't have to give my steam info to a third party provider to get my content for TTS. This is one of the main reasons I feel hesitant on picking up the game.

[hickname]

Originally posted by 22-ACR♞ Rioden:

I don't like the idea I have to give my steam info to a third party so I can play a game on steam. I think that could lead to some bad things happening to people's steam accounts.

This is the same mechanism as "Log in with Google" or "Login with Facebook". Do you fear that something bad will happen to your e-mail when you give your address to somebody?

[Scott [DBolical]]

Originally posted by 22-ACR♞ Rioden:

I don't like the idea I have to give my steam info to a third party so I can play a game on steam. I think that could lead to some bad things happening to people's steam accounts.

I have been playing TTS for quite a few years now. I am just under two thousand hours on the game. I do agree that TTS does have a lot of issues, both from a player point of view and as a content creator point of view.

I have watched quite a few videos on the creation process, and game play on TTP. It seems like they have improved on a lot of the issues with TTS. The creation process seems a lot more streamlined.

But I don't have to give my steam info to a third party provider to get my content for TTS. This is one of the main reasons I feel hesitant on picking up the game.

Completely understand your concern. For the record if you sign into mod.io in-game via Steam, we don't get access to your steam account, or anything like that, we also don't need or want that, and nor would we ever use it. All we get is information from the steam API that is public (like your username and avatar and steam id), and it is used only to make authentication easy so you can manage your board game collection in-game using mod.io. Happy to address any concerns you may have - and feel free to contact me, i'm scott at mod.io if needed.

[Scottx125]

Because I like the steam workshop and don't want to go to a random alternative mod website I don't know or trust to get mods. There's literally no reason not to have both giving players the freedom to choose what mods they want or where they want to host them. It's pretty much a situation of "we know best so only mod.io". And if you're concerned about keeping parity, ditch mod.io for the workshop. Your player traffic will increase 100x. I've said this multiple times. Not implementing the workshop will and is hampering the growth of TTP.

[Niall]

Originally posted by Scottx125:

Because I like the steam workshop and don't want to go to a random alternative mod website I don't know or trust to get mods. There's literally no reason not to have both giving players the freedom to choose what mods they want or where they want to host them. It's pretty much a situation of "we know best so only mod.io". And if you're concerned about keeping parity, ditch mod.io for the workshop. Your player traffic will increase 100x. I've said this multiple times. Not implementing the workshop will and is hampering the growth of TTP.

Sadly there has been no growth. The game is DOA.

[SZ]

They could even still keep mod.io, but also integrate the steam workshop specifically for the PC version.

I actually think the only way that TTP will rival TTS is by the devs either trying to fill their library themselves or hire someone to actually start converting the most played games from TTS to TTP. I know that's not quite legal, but I don't know if there is any other way.

[Menagerie]

Originally posted by Snæbjørn:

As I understand it mod.io for TP is free and seamless (no account, no login - on the surface at least).

I don't care if it uses one or the other. Why do you?
If you think that steam workshop support will grant you access to the tabletop sim mods, then I can assure you that it will not. As they're not compatible.

Please explain why it matters, because I don't get this debate.

So here's the thing. If they use mod.io I have to use mod.io.

Using steam workshop
It's been around. Steam has been around. We expect it to BE around in a few years.
It's integrated in the steam client
It's well known and has a familiar review, subscription, comment, and packaging system
It's better exposure for mod makers because people *do* browse workshop when looking at these types of games for purchase as evidenced by this entire debate.

Conversely, mod.io
is new (from the moddb.com people, but still new and therefore no history of reliability)
requires you to leave steam
is missing most of the convenience of Steam Workshop.
Adds no value at all for your average user.

The question is not "Why is mod.io good?"
The question is "Why would I want to use it instead of Steam Workshop?"
and nobody has given a reason for the *user* to want that.

The only thing that's been put forward is that it's easier for the company to branch out into other releases when this one isn't at function equivalence to its competitor yet (full scripting support, "tablet" integration, large library of games) etc.

For your average Steam user (which is who the user base is for now), there's absolutely no advantage to mod.io except that your data goes into yet another company's database.
This is where the developer tells you that you don't need to login or give identifying details, but the truth is that most data collection like this is anonymized and used to define trending data and provide advertising info... none of which requires your real name or financial data.

So that means we now need to see the policy of those running mod.io. I mean they might just blatantly state they're using your data for advertising or something....

Originally posted by https://mod.io/privacy:

.6. We may use your Personal Data to contact you with updates, news or promotional materials and other information that may be of interest to you. You can opt out of receiving these communications from us any time by following the unsubscribe link in any email we send to you.

...

5. How do we use "cookies" and other usage information?

5.1. We may collect and use your Personal Data to monitor your usage of our Service to customise your experience.
[Has anyone ever seen a way this 'customization' is done that doesn't mean advertising?]
...

8.2. We may provide your Personal Data to third parties for the following purposes:

customer support for the use of the Services;
secure storage, management and back up;
website analytics;
process payments;
efficient communications between you and mod.io;
any other purposes so that we can effectively operate the Services.

Now I'm not saying this is a bad faith move from the developers or from mod.io

I am saying that it's exposing myself to yet another company for no benefit on my end.
Saying "Give us Steam Workshop" isn't about "hate for mod.io" it's for there being absolutely no *advantage* to mod.io