Sword Saint wind sweep "cheat move": blind angle? Countermove ?

[Gamall Wednesday Ida]

. I'm in NG+, but I don't think that matters a lot.

I'm interested in a *single specific move*, not generalities on sword saint

That move is the *horizontal* charged wind sweep, present in all sword saint phases.

Much like Father Owl's Firecrackers, it's the one ♥♥♥♥ing move I have a real problem with. I'm annoyed that this move is not even listed on the fextralife wiki, and videos on sword saint either don't mention it or as an afterthought saying it "rarely happens" or say "run away" or "just cheat and use firecrackers to interrupt it".

With me, it happens *all the time* -- I almost never see the ashina cross or the vertical wind. I suppose that's because I stay in his face... And I do because I want to win on posture, which is quite possible. Only this move stands in the way of that.

- It's uninterruptible; even by Ichimonji.
- Unblockable (damage leak).
- possibly perfect deflectable and iframe dodgable, but too risky unless you're Lobos because...
- It takes 90% of full health if it hits. (30% if blocked, I think?)
- It covers an area roughly the size of Europe.
- It's a sweep, but if you jump, you die.
(note: in a previous thread I read

引用自 LAG：

if it's the giant aoe wind slash move that covvers a 360 degree angle then just goomba stomp his dumb face.

I trried that and just die; Sekiro seems to jump in random directions; maybe that's because I'm running, anyway that seems situational. I've never seen it done in video.
)

The only reaction I know of so far that actually works reliably to keep me alive is "run away". But that's not acceptable, because he regains half his posture thanks to the distance created. If runaway is the only no-emblem answer, then it becomes a broken move, allowing him to regain half his posture, or more, at will, with impunity, forcing the fight purely onto vitality. I hope that's not the case.

Firecrackers... I hate using prosthetics against bosses. If that's truly the only answer, that's deeply disappointing.


Pretty much by accident I found out that there is a blind angle where the wind won't hit you; it happens in the midst of panic so I don't know exactly where it was, or what actions I took. It's likely to be to the right. Has this been documented ?

Is there any reliable *countermove* to that move, ie something that lets you both live and attack, thus keeping his posture from regenerating. I'd expect that to exploit the blind spot.


(rant: The boring genichiro phase makes learning this boss such a tedious process imo. I'd enjoy it a lot more without it. It's like having to deal with 10 NPC before getting to the boss, only to get one shot by the move you're trying to learn.)

[Gamall Wednesday Ida]

引用自 Sokurah：

I started a ng with no cha[rm] and wanted to make no prayer bead upgrades, no attack upgrades and no skills/ tools except mikiri.

That's small potatoes. Play blindfolded, with your feet, while reciting the Iliad and Odyssey in the original ancient Greek, then I'll be impressed.

More seriously, I can confidently state that I shall *never* try any of this. There are faster, more convenient paths to insanity.

[Sokurah]

引用自 Gamall Wednesday Ida：

引用自 Sokurah：

I started a ng with no cha[rm] and wanted to make no prayer bead upgrades, no attack upgrades and no skills/ tools except mikiri.

That's small potatoes. Play blindfolded, with your feet, while reciting the Iliad and Odyssey in the original ancient Greek, then I'll be impressed.

More seriously, I can confidently state that I shall *never* try any of this. There are faster, more convenient paths to insanity.

well i made it past bull, 7 spears and matsumoto now ;)
maybe its time to activate the bell

[Smokey]

love this thread, love the game. I also noticed the "dead angle" where Isshin does his horizontal sweeping attack, but I only ever encounter it when he pulls out his spear. As with your experience, running away from the move is the only RELIABLE way I have found to deal with the move. I'm on NG+11/12 at the moment, attack power maxed out at 99, full vitality, etc. The bosses dont get that much more difficult in NG+, they just deal slightly more damage with their moves. After absolutely detesting Isshin, he's become my favorite boss in the entire game. He's so much fun to fight when you get good at deflecting his moves. I have found that the posture recovery he gets from that move is VERY intentional. You have to chip away at his vitality to keep his posture from recovering quickly. The lower his HP, the slower his recovery gets. Around 3/4 hp is when i see the posture damage actually building up. The wind sweep attack is a way for him to push you away and recover his posture. It is in some sense "broken" but he is the FINAL boss, so he should have some type of move that seems "cheap" because he's supposed to be one of the biggest challenges the game has to offer. NG++++++ with no charm and demon bell always active was one of my favorite runs of the game. Although I was fully upgraded, it forced me to really learn all the bosses/minibosses in the game. Sekiro becomes an easy game once you've beaten it a couple times, so the added challenge brought me back to feeling like i was "underpowered" for a certain area. Isshin was so incredibly difficult when you have to deflect everything perfectly or be forced to back off and heal (allowing his posture to recover as well). Boss Rush mod really helps you practice if that's what you're looking for. I've never used it, but I might install it now because i want to fight genichiro and isshin again without needing to kill Owl and the other not-so-fun bosses inbetween.

[Gamall Wednesday Ida]

It turns out you have more than enough firecrackers to prevent him from using the move, so phase 1 can be won on pure posture. That's how I got him.

引用自 Smokey：

l Around 3/4 hp is when i see the posture damage actually building up.

According to a reddit post I saw (so take it with a grain of salt, which as we all know Ashina samourai need...) posture recovery actually has breakpoints every 1/4 of vitality, for every enemies and for Sekiro himself (the only difference being that Sekiro still regenerates some posture at < 25% vit, while others do not).

Prior to reading that I assumes there was some smooth function at play; apparently not.

[Xaphnir]

jump

引用自 Gamall Wednesday Ida：

I've never seen it done in video.
)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhUdCfCmniY
2:29, 2:59, 4:34, 5:06, 5:40

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ek67HX_Qzi0
2:25, 3:04, 3:11 (kind of), 3:57, 4:04, 4:37, 5:07, 5:47

[Gamall Wednesday Ida]

Thanks!

Note: that's phase 2's sweep, which is interruptible by Ichimonji anyway. Better to do just that, I think.

I'm not entirely sure the hitbox is the same in phase 1's sweep, which is different at least in that it is *not* interruptible by Ichimonji --- although I'm pretty sure I was usually farther away when I attempted the jump, so the point is moot. I'll have to try jumping like that next time I run into Isshin in phase 1.

Thanks again for the videos and plethora of timestamps !

[Xaphnir]

I don't think I have a video recording of him using that attack in phase 1, as I rarely see him use it. If you just stay as aggressive in phase 1 as I was in those videos, you'll almost never see it.

[Gamall Wednesday Ida]

I was as aggressive as I could manage, and that was pretty much the only wind attack I got, and quite frequently at that. The wind wall came out instead if I stayed too far.