Started using a trainer...for actual training, change my mind! (I changed my own mind in the end!)

[Arndell]

My biggest gripe with this game is it demands perfection but allows no practise as simply trying over and over, wastes cumulative hours killing / avoiding no challenge small fry, and the 15-30 seconds you get before the boss / miniboss kills you is not enough for me to learn.

So I found some free trainer and when I hit a brick wall, i turn it on and spend 30 or so mins actually practising and learning the routines and move sets.

Once i feel more comfortable and grounded, i homeward bone it, turn off the trainer and have a go at doing it properly.


It's kinda like putting a great big "safety sphere" on a BMX and have someone who can't even ride a bike try and pull off a load of tricks, but no worries when they flop around the course like a meteor because the orb is the ultimate safety wheel.


It allows someone of my mentality to actually enjoy the game and the end result is I actually manage the content without cheats.

What part of the experience do you think i'm ruining by taking this path?
________________________________________________________________

(Post-post Edit:- So, I changed my own mind, after about a dozen hours of invincibly fighting bosses and minibosses until I knew their movesets, then beating them normally, but then struggling just the same with the next boss / miniboss, something clicked.

I used SAM to remove all current achievements I had got and started again with a completely clean slate.

While there is no doubt that my familiarity with the game mechanics was risen considerably while using a trainer, my ability to learn was blatantly impaired and very little was being retained.

With the foundation in place of knowing how the game works, my frustration with failures was significantly reduced and I could properly analyse what was going on in real time and now my actual failures are lessened.

My heart rate actually goes up to an extent that I can feel it and when that happens, i start learning things and retaining information in seconds / minutes rather than the hours it was taking me using the trainer.

It's rather unusual as that does not happen when I play games and is counter intuitive when you think you play games to relax, but the thing that clicked for me is that not all games are for that, some games are a drain on your mental resources, in a good way, they are "an activity" and not purely a thing you do to pass time like watching a show.

My main genre of game are turn based RPG's and grinding in MMO's, so coming to such a realisation at 28 years old is probably some sign of retardation, but now i'm playing Sekiro with a different mindset, I have other games I play to wind down from what Sekiro does to you and progressing & enjoying Sekiro more.


It really brings to light how Dark Souls allows you to turn off and work only on reflexes for dodge rolls and that "turning off" is what I thought games were for, I put a lot of hours into the souls series too and never came to this same conclusion.)

[TekksTV]

Very Strange! I mean i play hard games to be challenged and pushed to my limits as a gamer and when i hit a wall i try try try again till i get it right! i mean yes i could use a trainer or cheat codes in a game but WHY?! I mean isnt the point of playing a game that is HARD is to be challenged and forced to frustraited and angry at times. and you know its gonna be hard! So you already knew before coming into the game you were gonna use a trainer! I mean you can do whatever you want but i mean if ur gonna buy a game like this knowing its gonna be hard and without even attempting to give it a go atleast 1 playthrough before cheating! What is the point of even playing games at all?!

[Arndell]

Originally posted by TekksTV:

Very Strange! I mean i play hard games to be challenged and pushed to my limits as a gamer and when i hit a wall i try try try again till i get it right! i mean yes i could use a trainer or cheat codes in a game but WHY?! I mean isnt the point of playing a game that is HARD is to be challenged and forced to frustraited and angry at times. and you know its gonna be hard! So you already knew before coming into the game you were gonna use a trainer! I mean you can do whatever you want but i mean if ur gonna buy a game like this knowing its gonna be hard and without even attempting to give it a go atleast 1 playthrough before cheating! What is the point of even playing games at all?!

Rather extreme view, I explained what my use of the trainer is, it's not staying on so i can one shot and invincibly kill all enemies.

The game design is such that it demands near perfect performance, which requires practise however, you can't get very much practise in because you die in either 1 or 2 hits on every miniboss or main boss.

After a few prayer beads you can probably survive 2-4 hits, but it also gets more difficult and things get stronger.

Rather than practise for 3-12 hours with lots of running back to a location for 30 seconds of boss time, I use the trainer to stay at that boss and properly look at it's movements and attacks to be wary of for as long as it takes, once I have practised enough, I then reset to the statue and do it without cheats.

I play games for fun and some challenge, but the 3 hours I spent running back to the same miniboss, most of which was spend clearing mobs was neither challenging nor fun, it just felt like a waste of time as 9/10 times, i'm inevitably going to fail, as per game design and that journey running to the boss is not helping me progress in the slightest.

[fgevans]

can you let me know the trainer you used and what you are doing is what i want to do as well. I want to learn the boss patterns in safety as i can fight the NPC trainer flawlessly but cant then put those same tools into practice

[Arndell]

Originally posted by fgevans:

can you let me know the trainer you used and what you are doing is what i want to do as well. I want to learn the boss patterns in safety as i can fight the NPC trainer flawlessly but cant then put those same tools into practice

https://megagames.com/trainers/sekiro-shadows-die-twice-v102-18-trainer-fling

This one, seems very easy to use, it automatically finds the sekiro.exe when you open it then it's automatically bound to the numpad that toggles the cheats instantly, never made me crash or has had any odd effects.

[fgevans]

cheers

[Justinyl]

Originally posted by Arndell:

Originally posted by fgevans:

can you let me know the trainer you used and what you are doing is what i want to do as well. I want to learn the boss patterns in safety as i can fight the NPC trainer flawlessly but cant then put those same tools into practice

https://megagames.com/trainers/sekiro-shadows-die-twice-v102-18-trainer-fling

This one, seems very easy to use, it automatically finds the sekiro.exe when you open it then it's automatically bound to the numpad that toggles the cheats instantly, never made me crash or has had any odd effects.

That version is outdated. the latest is this:

http://gtrainers.com/load/categories/trainers/sekiro_shadows_die_twice_trainer_22_v1_02_fling/28-1-0-7022

[@Ixxmantisxxl]

Originally posted by Arndell:

Originally posted by Shard of Manus:

Meanwhile you probably never run out of Emblems, never use Consumables until the final attempt and have a breeze. There's no sacrifice involved, everything becomes way too easy.

You play a hard game, then go "This is hard, I'll bypass that." At least you're not using infinite health or anything for actually killing the bosses, but ... it's not right. You should play as intended.

As intended just means i spend time grinding for emblems and vising vendors for pellets.

That use of time one shotting enemies that don't even help me get any better just got too far for me, so I now skip the useless grind and focus more on the target i wanna pass.

You can Purchase Emblems from the Sculptor Idols. Btw.

[Arndell]

Originally posted by 🆅🅰🅻🆅🅴Apoc:

Originally posted by Arndell:

As intended just means i spend time grinding for emblems and vising vendors for pellets.

That use of time one shotting enemies that don't even help me get any better just got too far for me, so I now skip the useless grind and focus more on the target i wanna pass.

You can Purchase Emblems from the Sculptor Idols. Btw.

ofc, but for money you get grinding mobs :P it's not much ofc.
My reasoning for practising with the trainer is not about me having any issues with resource grinding, it's just because I want more time with a boss to learn things, I can't pick it up in short intervals xD, I tried for 3 hours straight to bear the Seven Spears miniboss and made little progress. But I trained on him for a while, and now it seems like all those basic general enemies are a lot easier to read, sword or spear, in short I made progress I could actually feel, rather than subliminal progress that was happening, but so slowly i never noticed.

I don't have the initial reflexes fast enough to learn on the fly at any kind of enjoyable rate, but I can develop the muscle memory and "plan to react" enough to play the game.

[Engels78]

You know that in Dark Souls games it is NORMAL that even simple mobs can 2-3 hits kill you? Of course there are more tank builds but I played medium weight...

[cronic0_0]

Originally posted by Shard of Manus:

You're not ruining anything, but it does mean you'll have plenty of Gold/Skills, there'll be no risk involved or fear of death, and it kind of defeats the purpose.

Is it really that rewarding?

Really is that your argument ?
what I do for skill and gold is pick a level with lots of mobs clear reset clearing again reset until I get all the skills and gold I need. You can literally max out your whole entire skill tree at the beginning of the game... well the first two skill trees you get anyway.

All you need is time and being highly intoxicated helps

[Alex]

All ive done is to use FOV change so its not so cramped and claustrophobic. Not gonna cheat personally as i find it removes the value of the product. Hey, everyone can do what they want and i dont judge. Whatever makes you happy - go for it. I will probably rather give up if it gets too hard than cheat because i love challenge. Its the only reason i play games. If it was a cakewalk i wouldnt like it, but, we're all different and we should be happy for that. :)

[cronic0_0]

Originally posted by Alex72:

All ive done is to use FOV change so its not so cramped and claustrophobic. Not gonna cheat personally as i find it removes the value of the product. Hey, everyone can do what they want and i dont judge. Whatever makes you happy - go for it. I will probably rather give up if it gets too hard than cheat because i love challenge. Its the only reason i play games. If it was a cakewalk i wouldnt like it, but, we're all different and we should be happy for that. :)

Well to be fair the trainer they give you in the game is kind of crappy what I wish they would do is he can mimic any fight that you choose. Say for example you're struggling against the seven Spears. but since you encountered him and lost a few times you unlock a new training option with the trainer you go to the trainer and select 7 Spears and he will mimic The 7 Spears guy

[cronic0_0]

Originally posted by Arndell:

Originally posted by Shard of Manus:

You're not ruining anything, but it does mean you'll have plenty of Gold/Skills, there'll be no risk involved or fear of death, and it kind of defeats the purpose.

Is it really that rewarding?

I don't think i'll have that much gold, i would say probably less.

The repeated deaths when you grind on a boss for hours will mean you have 0 money and xp for a long time.

However, with the method i'm using, I won't be grinding out thousands of small enemies with hundreds of trips to the same location.

So I may lose half my stuff a lot less, but i'm getting so much less income it probably tips the balance in me having less xp without grinding

Not true you can Farm all the gold and experience you need from mods reset clear reset clear... just pick a stage with lots of mods clear reset and clear you get the idea all it takes is some time and being highly intoxicated helps it's called farming

[Unrighteous]

I cheat in single player Dark Souls for souls after my first run, in order to have fun using anything I want (sorcery, pyromancy, miracles, whatever). However, immortality cheats defeat the tension and in my opinion lessen the experience. If you're going to beat them legit eventually, why sour the experience with cheats?

[Dances_with_Zombies]

Stupid question: What is a trainer, some kind of software? How does it work? Never heard of it before.