Campaign difficulty

[Sperziemone]

Has anything regarding campaign difficulty changed in the past few months? I haven't been following any updates, but I am a casual player wanting to enjoy the campaign (again after so many years) in the easiest AI difficulty, but even 'Standard' mode was too hard for me. Same goes for my dad who also wanted to replay the campaign casually.

So we gave up and now I am curious if there were any updates changing the AI difficulty in standard mode :)

(And yes, we kinda suck, but still I think there should be a mode for casual players like us, right?)

[Elriadon]

Which campaigns did you play?

[Resident NATO Freedom Enjoyer]

I've noticed that there is an increase in the difficulty on the new expansion AI, but I haven't played any of the others for a while. But yeah, I usually play on the middle difficulty and it was significantly more difficult than I was used to. I mean I've beat every campaign mission on hard by now but tend to play easier difficulties to just mess around with the AI or something. But yeah, as far as I know, the AI has been updated in the background to be a bit more smart.

[joaosantos92]

I've tried the 5th Genghis Khan scenario on hard difficulty (now there's a 50 min timer before the Bohemian army comes) and, other than the time constraint, the scenario didn't feel harder at all (the other two enemies were very easy to defeat with Mangudai+Trebuchets). So I don't think anything changed in old campaigns. On the other hand...

Originally posted by Constantine XI:

I've noticed that there is an increase in the difficulty on the new expansion AI, but I haven't played any of the others for a while. But yeah, I usually play on the middle difficulty and it was significantly more difficult than I was used to. I mean I've beat every campaign mission on hard by now but tend to play easier difficulties to just mess around with the AI or something. But yeah, as far as I know, the AI has been updated in the background to be a bit more smart.

I've also noticed the new campaigns to be quite hard. I've done them all on standard and, with few exceptions, most scenarios weren't easy at all (now I'm doing them on moderate). The Algirdas and Kestutis is rated one-sword but on moderate difficulty the enemies build Trebuchets on literally every scenario and then they even seem to combine the attacks against you as if it were a "defend against a siege" scenario. Jadwiga and Jan Zizka seem more balanced, some easier scenarios, some harder scenarios. A&K's one-sword reminds me of Tariq's one-sword.
With Lords of the West, Edward Longshanks (also rated one-sword) only brought a real challenge to me on scenarios 2 and 4 on hard difficulty, but even then I managed to win them. Hautevilles (rated three-swords) is at most a two-sword and Grand Dukes (rated two-swords) seems balanced to me.
However, this is just my personal opinion and in no way a universal experience.

[Cuy Magico De Ciber]

there should be a different ai for campaign, lets call it, legacy ai

[Sperziemone]

From what I gathered (also when Googling) the AI is significantly harder in the campaigns than in the original game.

And while I understand it's fun to have smarter AI, it's not when it just gets unplayable for rookie/casual players. In Starcraft I kinda know which units are good against which, a good building order, not taking too long, etc.

But I am clueless in AoE. Back in the days I just tried stuff and it worked out. Now it feels like I should be super quick and know exactly what units and building to make in the best order. It feels like I should look up strategies cause I can't win on my own. That's no fun for casual players. Sometimes that doesn't matter, especially for later/harder levels. I think it also happened in the early levels of the Joan of Arc campaign, but I can't quite remember.

I remember trying the Pachacuti or something, the Inca campagin, but I think I already got stuck in the 2nd level.

But I understand it didn't get any easier in spite of feedback everywhere that the AI in campaign is too hard :( I just wish there was an easier setting than Standard.

[Agarillobob]

Originally posted by Sperziemone:

From what I gathered (also when Googling) the AI is significantly harder in the campaigns than in the original game.

And while I understand it's fun to have smarter AI, it's not when it just gets unplayable for rookie/casual players. In Starcraft I kinda know which units are good against which, a good building order, not taking too long, etc.

But I am clueless in AoE. Back in the days I just tried stuff and it worked out. Now it feels like I should be super quick and know exactly what units and building to make in the best order. It feels like I should look up strategies cause I can't win on my own. That's no fun for casual players. Sometimes that doesn't matter, especially for later/harder levels. I think it also happened in the early levels of the Joan of Arc campaign, but I can't quite remember.

I remember trying the Pachacuti or something, the Inca campagin, but I think I already got stuck in the 2nd level.

But I understand it didn't get any easier in spite of feedback everywhere that the AI in campaign is too hard :( I just wish there was an easier setting than Standard.

you can just set it on standard and pick the old AI, its really not hard tho

[Sperziemone]

Originally posted by Agarillobob:

you can just set it on standard and pick the old AI, its really not hard tho

How can I pick the old AI? :) I would LOVE that! When I want to set the Game Mod (right next to the difficulty setting) there is just one option, which is de Definitive Edition. No option to select the old AI.

[Quintem]

My recommendation is to get better at the game. This is not some flippant remark either. You're probably making some fundamental mistakes while playing.

My friend was playing through Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm campaign and he decided to play it on hard instead of normal. He was starting to struggle a bit towards the middle. I asked him to stream so I could watch him play. Within minutes of watching I was able to spot his main issue, not enough workers. I told him what steps to take and I said you should try to do this if possible on most missions. I watched him finish the level without further issue. He went on to steamroll the rest of the campaign after that. He even commented later on how such a small thing made such a massive difference.

So go play through the Art of War tutorials, you should at least be able to beat them on bronze but silver is doable as well. (Gold requires a bit more effort and focus kind of sets you up for online play more so than anything). As it is a common mistake are you producing enough villagers? 50-60% of your population space should be villagers.

RTS is not an easy genre but don't get discouraged, with patient, time and a little effort you can beat the missions.

[Agarillobob]

Originally posted by Sperziemone:

Originally posted by Agarillobob:

you can just set it on standard and pick the old AI, its really not hard tho

How can I pick the old AI? :) I would LOVE that! When I want to set the Game Mod (right next to the difficulty setting) there is just one option, which is de Definitive Edition. No option to select the old AI.

you need to download the old campaign AI

[SpoOkyMagician]

IIRC, one of the patch notes recently said something along the lines of...

Updated the AI for all difficulties. Awaiting players input/thoughts on the changes.

As well as the general AI updates too. However, I am unsure if the normal/new AI files are used in campaigns. Most likely, they are completely customized per scenario.

On a related note: I recently 100% (bronze) all the standard difficulty campaigns. (minus the DLC campaigns. I don't have those.) I will admit, some of them are still too difficult for me and some are very easy. (I am a casual player as well. I even helped test the campaigns during development. I won't go into details though. I said my thoughts on this in some other topic.)

Anyway, if I can 100% standard, I am sure anyone can. (Maybe with a few exceptions for the difficult scenarios that I mentioned.) If any of them seem too difficult, you can always cheat/skip that one and try the next one. (Although, you may have issues getting achievements if you do. If that doesn't matter to you, just skip as needed.)

[gluefingers]

I agree with the OP. I just returned to this game after years away. Never was that good but Campaigns are definitely harder in standard. I am 71, love playing but the Timer ones...? forget it. after a dozen trys, I am all stressed by watching the timers and attacks every 30 seconds, than just enjoying the game. Too bad as I love the game, but eyes & reflexes I cannot do the speed thing that is required in all games now. I just like to do strategy, go slow & have fun. Anyone out there a REAL Noob, not someone looking to gloat after winning FAST? As an aside I am looking for the "Black Forest" scenario I see on you tube all the time. Where can I get that?

[Quintem]

Originally posted by gluefingers:

I agree with the OP. I just returned to this game after years away. Never was that good but Campaigns are definitely harder in standard. I am 71, love playing but the Timer ones...? forget it. after a dozen trys, I am all stressed by watching the timers and attacks every 30 seconds, than just enjoying the game. Too bad as I love the game, but eyes & reflexes I cannot do the speed thing that is required in all games now. I just like to do strategy, go slow & have fun. Anyone out there a REAL Noob, not someone looking to gloat after winning FAST? As an aside I am looking for the "Black Forest" scenario I see on you tube all the time. Where can I get that?

Go to Single player, go on skirmish, fourth option down (red button) select that, you should see Black Forest near the top. You may tweak other settings as you desire.

You can also play Black Forest via multiplayer but if you're struggling with campaigns on standard you'll struggle vs most players. There indeed newbies/less skilled players. Though generally its more popular with players that enjoy slow games.

[blauden97]

Originally posted by joaosantos92:

I've tried the 5th Genghis Khan scenario on hard difficulty (now there's a 50 min timer before the Bohemian army comes) and, other than the time constraint, the scenario didn't feel harder at all (the other two enemies were very easy to defeat with Mangudai+Trebuchets). So I don't think anything changed in old campaigns. On the other hand...

Originally posted by Constantine XI:

I've noticed that there is an increase in the difficulty on the new expansion AI, but I haven't played any of the others for a while. But yeah, I usually play on the middle difficulty and it was significantly more difficult than I was used to. I mean I've beat every campaign mission on hard by now but tend to play easier difficulties to just mess around with the AI or something. But yeah, as far as I know, the AI has been updated in the background to be a bit more smart.

I've also noticed the new campaigns to be quite hard. I've done them all on standard and, with few exceptions, most scenarios weren't easy at all (now I'm doing them on moderate). The Algirdas and Kestutis is rated one-sword but on moderate difficulty the enemies build Trebuchets on literally every scenario and then they even seem to combine the attacks against you as if it were a "defend against a siege" scenario. Jadwiga and Jan Zizka seem more balanced, some easier scenarios, some harder scenarios. A&K's one-sword reminds me of Tariq's one-sword.
With Lords of the West, Edward Longshanks (also rated one-sword) only brought a real challenge to me on scenarios 2 and 4 on hard difficulty, but even then I managed to win them. Hautevilles (rated three-swords) is at most a two-sword and Grand Dukes (rated two-swords) seems balanced to me.
However, this is just my personal opinion and in no way a universal experience.

Agree. I have finished the Hautevilles campaign (three-swords) under the hard difficulty but now I am stuck at the Jadwiga campaign (two-swords).
One of the reasons may be that the Hautevilles campaign has a more "alternative" gameplay rather than the traditional "build and destroy" mode. For example, you just need to kill the leader(s) of your enemy in the 2nd and 4th scenario, and the last scenario can be completed by building and defending the wonder. Subsequently, there are some tricky methods to win the game even under the hard difficulty.

PS: thanks for the update of the Genghis Khan campaign.

[Fetito Fazzito]

Are the devs aware that the difficulty changes affects the legacy gameplay?

[gluefingers]

Originally posted by Quintem:

Originally posted by gluefingers:

I agree with the OP. I just returned to this game after years away. Never was that good but Campaigns are definitely harder in standard. I am 71, love playing but the Timer ones...? forget it. after a dozen trys, I am all stressed by watching the timers and attacks every 30 seconds, than just enjoying the game. Too bad as I love the game, but eyes & reflexes I cannot do the speed thing that is required in all games now. I just like to do strategy, go slow & have fun. Anyone out there a REAL Noob, not someone looking to gloat after winning FAST? As an aside I am looking for the "Black Forest" scenario I see on you tube all the time. Where can I get that?

Go to Single player, go on skirmish, fourth option down (red button) select that, you should see Black Forest near the top. You may tweak other settings as you desire.

You can also play Black Forest via multiplayer but if you're struggling with campaigns on standard you'll struggle vs most players. There indeed newbies/less skilled players. Though generally its more popular with players that enjoy slow games.

Thanks for that. Just playing the BF tonite with no real attacks, I could work on order of build, couple of hot keys. It has helped immensely (Iguess) won't know until I venture against real people