One Year Discord Nitro or $100 Steam gift card for Help with a Problem

[DMg Halt]

I have a problem, and I will gift anyone Discord Nitro or $100 Steam Gift card to whoever can help me figure out what's going on. All relevant contents regarding this issue such as the data mod, scenario, several .txt out-of-sync logs where this problem occurred, as well as an example of a recorded game demonstration can be found on this google drive link: https://drive.google.com/drive/u/0/folders/1qw4zWc48djnHvNI6bLSHHG9RGiS5oK5h

The Problem - I've developed a scenario (CTD ZigZag v2.aoe2scenario) to be used with the data mod "Tower Defense (Citadel)" and the scenario continuously goes out of sync. I want to know what's causing this, and how it can be fixed.

Things I've determined so far or ruled out:

- There is no common point in time that the desync occurs.
- The desync occurs regardless of whether I am the one hosting the game
- The desync occurs even when I am not participating in the game
- The game does not desync in Single Player mode
- The game desyncs every game, but at different points in time
- It occurs no matter how many players are in the game, or if the slots are filled with AI.
- The game does not desync if I launch the game, but do absolutely nothing once the game begins. (I figured this out by blocking the lanes and letting the game run)

There are two other Tower Defense maps (but different layouts) that can be played using the same data mod, but no out of sync issues occur when playing those scenarios.

The google drive link contains the out of sync logs that are produced as a result of the desync. I am looking for what specific action that triggers the out of sync since I am unfortunately unable to interpret the logs and I am unable to tell which player caused it. Any help is appreciated and will be rewarded. Find me in steam or discord 'Halt#0839' for any questions or requests for more information.

You can experience the desync for yourself and produce your own error log by playing a multiplayer game with the "Tower Defense (Citadel)" data mod, and playing the scenario included in the link.

[-Dare Devil/x/]

-I remember there was a bug like this on one of the official maps where a unit was moving onto a broken tile/broken trigger/some weird thing like that. And it was "never at the same time" because it was a unit that would path/aggro/etc and it would change the amount of time it would take to get onto that tile.

-If you play the scenario by itself without the data mod, does it go out of sync?

-If you play the data mod without the scenario (like on stock arabia), does it go out of sync?

[DMg Halt]

- Playing the scenario by itself, without the data mod, will result in an insta-crash. Basically a frozen screen immediately after the game launches, then puts you back to your desktop. This also happens for the other Tower Defense maps that utilize the data mod, so it is not unique to this scenario.

- No, the game doesn't desync when using the data mod without the scenario.

[Valarante]

Try to enable v-sync.

[DMg Halt]

Originally posted by Cloud:

Try to enable v-sync.

The game desyncs even when I'm not one of the participants, so I don't think it has anything to do with V-sync. But nevertheless, I have played the scenario with V-sync enabled and disabled and it will still go out of sync.

[mmmcheesywaffles]

For some weird issues it can help to keep a Browser page open despite the drain on resources that represents. If you try it and it works then your issue is with your ISP and/or Router.

The reason I was given for this tip working is that some ISP's use algorithms that prioritise say... Google over other data streams. That having a Browser page open retains your priority in the ISP's listing of who gets what bandwidth. When I have Steam issues I sometimes try it and it does appear to work. First I try the bare browser; next a data search and finally if that all fails I try a YouTube vid to run in my background. Even with inconsistent results there does appear to be SOME validity to the tip.

[DMg Halt]

That does make sense as a trouble shooting tool, but I frequently play with the chrome browser open and the scenario continues to desync, so no dice there :(

[DMg Halt]

Originally posted by -Dare Devil/x/:

-I remember there was a bug like this on one of the official maps where a unit was moving onto a broken tile/broken trigger/some weird thing like that. And it was "never at the same time" because it was a unit that would path/aggro/etc and it would change the amount of time it would take to get onto that tile.

-If you play the scenario by itself without the data mod, does it go out of sync?

-If you play the data mod without the scenario (like on stock arabia), does it go out of sync?

The error logs provide map coordinates but it's never the same each game

[mmmcheesywaffles]

Originally posted by DMg Halt:

That does make sense as a trouble shooting tool, but I frequently play with the chrome browser open and the scenario continues to desync, so no dice there :(

In desperation I have tried closing an open browser and opening another. It appeared to work, so might be worth a try if you have not done so already.

The key trigger with the ISP algorithms appears to be changes to your browsing habits. Once they think they know us we can get banded into a poorer group requiring less attentive monitoring and reduced bandwidth. One ISP Engineer recommended that we all completely reset our Routers at least once a week and enable streaming on all our devices while the algorithm 'decides' what we should get. As I'm way too lazy for that these days I still often get loading lag on streams, and usually only follow his advice when I get grumpy enough to take action.

At most I only have Steam loaded whilst my wife watches Netflix on a TV. With a decent Fibre connection I just should not be getting such lag.

I'm long past my over curious youth when I would troubleshoot such issues with tenacity. Now I just want to watch a vid or play a game without hassle. Though occasionally I will try helping others to troubleshoot. At least that way I don't have the stress and bother of all those tweaks.

Although I share this I must stress it was all tips from a guy that was troubleshooting my lack of connection when I first subscribed to my current ISP. He claimed some degree of seniority in his his company and after I made a few suggestions on their customer service protocols he paid me in kind with several months free service. They did adopt much of what I suggested, so I just presume what he said was true. However, I have never heard of the structure of those algorithms from anyone but him, credible witnesses or not. Plausible does not equate to True hard fact. So I offer the advice as something to try while you wait for a definitive solution.

EDIT I forgot to mention how such a issue might arise.... If the game code offers a timing loop that is marginally too short an external lag might trip the code. Too many ifs and mights for real advice :{

[DMg Halt]

That's good information to know, and thank you for sharing. I think we can rule out anything having to do with my internet connection since this out of sync issue occurs for others even when I'm not one of the games' participants. Plus my bandwidth is 1 Gbps, and router is top notch with DMZ enabled.

[mmmcheesywaffles]

Originally posted by DMg Halt:

That's good information to know, and thank you for sharing. I think we can rule out anything having to do with my internet connection since this out of sync issue occurs for others even when I'm not one of the games' participants. Plus my bandwidth is 1 Gbps, and router is top notch with DMZ enabled.

That certainly makes it unlikely, but ISP algorithms can influence any connection at any time. The advertised rate of bandwidth is rarely provided 100% of the time with most ISPs. However, you might be getting 100%, 100% of the time.... so much depends upon local conditions.

Some years ago I was getting the full advertised rate from the ISP at my former address. After a year or two I noticed a decline and decided to search out what other 'competition' I might be having. In those days only about 20% of my neighbours had broadband so it wasn't hard to see who was with what ISP from the SSIDs. Sure enough I discovered that several neighbours were now using my ISP and more importantly as the service was copper wire the local junction box was now providing 4 customers instead of just my connection.

Ofc with optical fibre there should be no issue. However, if any part of your local link is heavily used and outside the Fibre link ie through a sat link it may still bottleneck and have algorithm controls sharing the bandwidth.

Others may also suffer local bandwidth issues in the same manner.
Unless you have anything concrete to explain the issue please don't feel any need to reply to this post. I offer it only as more background.

[DMg Halt]

Thx, but I think if it had anything to do with bandwidth, it would happen when playing other matches/scenarios as well. I think we can rule it out using Occam's Razor.

[DMg Halt]

Thank you all for your feed back, I am now going to submit this to ageofempires.com using their support link.