Cold storage >>> grocery store

[Boogey]

Hi,

So - for some reason my cold storage to grocery factory connection doesn't seem to move the meat forward. Is it supposed to work?

[StarPhantom]

Hi, are you trying to connect the cold storage to a factory / store directly? or are you trying to export meat via a connection?
If exporting, you can only export meat via refrigeration trucks, use them to transfer meat from cold storage to the desired store.
I'm not sure you can export cold meat with direct connections, hope this helps

[TheAmishStig]

Material doesn't push forward; the only times materials move are on Create Material [such as a mine generating coal ore], Consume material [such as a Bricks Factory using Coal as part of Creating bricks], Load [put materials onto a vehicle], and Unload [take materials off a vehicle] actions.

Thankfully there's an "Area of Effect" of 1 connection from any given action, so it's not gonna make much difference to your store in the end. When the store runs out [because its meat storage is tagged 'import'; that changes when outside storage is affected by the 'consume' action], it'll start pulling from the Cold Storage [1 connection away] without a care in the world.

There is also a "load balancing" mechanic. If your trucks deliver to either building, they will try their hardest to make sure that the Store [again, 1 connection away] and the Cold Storage have the same level of fullness. It's measured as a percentage, so if the Store is 10% full and Storage is 50% full, the delivery will try to make them 50-50 and then keep increasing evenly.

Where it has the potential to get messy is chains of buildings that are too far away from an 'action'. Slaughterhouse -> Cold Store -> Grocery Store will work...but the Grocery Store will never get material directly, it will always have to pull from the Cold Store [and likewise, the Slaughterhouse's storage will fill up and then never be touched]. Slaughterhouse -> Cold Store #1 -> Cold Store #2 -> Grocery Story won't work at all....the Slaughterhouse and the Grocery Store are the ones taking actions, which when combined with the area of effect means that the Slaughterhouse can't interact with Cold Store #2, and the Grocery Store can't interact with Cold Store #1, so material can never go from Slaughterhouse to Grocery Store.

[Boogey]

It's a very good explanation TheAmishStig, but it doesn't work.

I have a (refrigeration) truck loaded cold storage next to the grocery, connected with the factory connection. When the truck comes to fill the cold storage it doesn't load balance. Also, when the grocery runs empty, it doesn't get it from the cold storage.

StarPhantom, that really makes no sense, as from the slaughterhouse you CAN export meat with factory connection. Why wouldn't that work with the storage (which makes sense to connect to the grocery)..

[archiver213]

instead of cold storage direct to grocery, have a warehouse direct connection to grocery, then on second factory connection have cold storage connected to the warehouse. Then have the refrigeration truck deliver meat to the cold storage which should allow the grocery store to pull it from the warehouse as needed. ?

[MG83]

Originally posted by archiver213:

instead of cold storage direct to grocery, have a warehouse direct connection to grocery, then on second factory connection have cold storage connected to the warehouse. Then have the refrigeration truck deliver meat to the cold storage which should allow the grocery store to pull it from the warehouse as needed. ?

this does not work. warehouse does not transport to cold storage.


if you are delivering to cold storage from cargo bay then have a designated extra turck that pics from the cold storage and drops to same coldstorage again. This will push the resource to next destination.

[StarPhantom]

Originally posted by Boogey:

StarPhantom, that really makes no sense, as from the slaughterhouse you CAN export meat with factory connection. Why wouldn't that work with the storage (which makes sense to connect to the grocery)..

Sorry, i think i've misunderstood what you were going for, i always assumed that the only export options from a cold storage was via Refrigeration Trucks

My mistake

[TheAmishStig]

Originally posted by Boogey:

It's a very good explanation TheAmishStig, but it doesn't work.

I have a (refrigeration) truck loaded cold storage next to the grocery, connected with the factory connection. When the truck comes to fill the cold storage it doesn't load balance. Also, when the grocery runs empty, it doesn't get it from the cold storage.

StarPhantom, that really makes no sense, as from the slaughterhouse you CAN export meat with factory connection. Why wouldn't that work with the storage (which makes sense to connect to the grocery)..

It most certainly does, screenshots attached. It's not going to refill [that's not how the cargo system works], but it will take from the Cold Store whenever a customer is buying meat and its internal stocks go below 0.25 tons.

Keep in mind that the load balancing is on percentages, not tonnage. When both storage and store are empty, the cold storage will get 7.85 tons [10.5%] and the store will get 0.15 [15%], as it appears the minimum transfer to or from a vehicle is 50kg.

Everything at zero, Truck in motion:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1888621218

Delivery in progress:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1888621274

Delivery complete:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1888621319

Truck sent to depot after first delivery; Time passes. Cold Storage is now less than 7.85 due to people buying from the shop.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1888621365

[MG83]

Originally posted by TheAmishStig:

Originally posted by Boogey:

It's a very good explanation TheAmishStig, but it doesn't work.

I have a (refrigeration) truck loaded cold storage next to the grocery, connected with the factory connection. When the truck comes to fill the cold storage it doesn't load balance. Also, when the grocery runs empty, it doesn't get it from the cold storage.

StarPhantom, that really makes no sense, as from the slaughterhouse you CAN export meat with factory connection. Why wouldn't that work with the storage (which makes sense to connect to the grocery)..

It most certainly does, screenshots attached. It's not going to refill [that's not how the cargo system works], but it will take from the Cold Store whenever a customer is buying meat and its internal stocks go below 0.25 tons.

Keep in mind that the load balancing is on percentages, not tonnage. When both storage and store are empty, the cold storage will get 7.85 tons [10.5%] and the store will get 0.15 [15%], as it appears the minimum transfer to or from a vehicle is 50kg.

Everything at zero, Truck in motion:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1888621218

Delivery in progress:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1888621274

Delivery complete:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1888621319

Truck sent to depot after first delivery; Time passes. Cold Storage is now less than 7.85 due to people buying from the shop.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1888621365

This method has a flaw. It will cause the shop to get zero which will causes some customers to be not able to buy and leave shop. Put a truck that picks from that cold store and drops to same store . check until full and until empty. this will try to equalise the amount in cold store to the shop. as result as long as cold store has more meat than shop it will push meats to shop.

[TheAmishStig]

Originally posted by MG83:

This method has a flaw. It will cause the shop to get zero which will causes some customers to be not able to buy and leave shop. Put a truck that picks from that cold store and drops to same store . check until full and until empty. this will try to equalise the amount in cold store to the shop. as result as long as cold store has more meat than shop it will push meats to shop.

On the "unload" side, the only difference between a truck pump and a regular delivery is how often it happens...but I assure you dude, in a "no truck pump" configuration, the store will not run out and people will not leave empty-handed as long as there is meat in the cold storage. I promise you on the grave of my grandmother that in 7.9.14 it will not happen. As soon as a customer makes an attempt to take the store below 250kg, the "I am almost out, check external storage" condition will fire, and a tick's worth of material (250-500kg) will be brought in from storage.

This is a situation where the truck pump will be a hindrance, not a help...if the total amount of material (storage and shop combined) drops below the capacity of the truck, the truck will empty both buildings...and in "wait until full" mode will hoard the meat for itself until the next delivery arrives. If people are leaving your stores without meat because you're relying on external storage...it's the truck pump, not the storage, causing the problem.

The reason it does that is because the shop is not tagged as "import" storage, so it's fair game for the truck pump's "load" action. The "Import" and "Export" tags mark those storage areas as one-way for external connections; you cannot take from Import, and aren't supposed to be able to add to Export (it's bugged currently), through a pipe, conveyor, or industry path...only by parking a vehicle at the building itself [which is considered an internal connection].

Additionally...because the shop is not "import" storage, if the shop is ever more full than the cold storage, meat will be pumped _out_ of the shop and placed into storage. You can test it yourself by running a truck pump at low levels and manually purchasing more meat for the shop.

The "truck pump" is a very cool trick and I'm glad the community discovered it (it's a nice stop-gap for source -> storage -> storage -> destination chains until Forklifts arrive), but it's not a good fit for this situation. Trust me on this one, dude...I've put at least as much time into understanding the cargo system as Otto has the Semaphore system or you have the Electricity system.

[Boogey]

I have to say, this just doesn't happen with me. Once grocery reaches 0 the meat storage amount doesn't go down. Very randomly I could see a small drop, dunno why, but it doesn't compare at all to the sales of meat when warehoused in the store. (1 tn in aobut 45-60 seconds, while meat storage goes about 0.20 tons in 2-3 minutes)

I gave up on the problem. I created a modded grocery with bigger meat storage, made it import -tagged (works with same randomness) just in case and rebuilt the problem stores. Seems silly I needed to.

[TheAmishStig]

Originally posted by Boogey:

I have to say, this just doesn't happen with me. Once grocery reaches 0 the meat storage amount doesn't go down. Very randomly I could see a small drop, dunno why, but it doesn't compare at all to the sales of meat when warehoused in the store. (1 tn in aobut 45-60 seconds, while meat storage goes about 0.20 tons in 2-3 minutes)

I gave up on the problem. I created a modded grocery with bigger meat storage, made it import -tagged (works with same randomness) just in case and rebuilt the problem stores. Seems silly I needed to.

Can you send me a picture of your setup? Either your save is bugged or there's some X factor we're not aware of.

[MG83]

Originally posted by TheAmishStig:

I promise you on the grave of my grandmother that in 7.9.14 it will not happen.

This is a situation where the truck pump will be a hindrance, not a help...if the total amount of material (storage and shop combined) drops below the capacity of the truck, the truck will empty both buildings...and in "wait until full" mode will hoard the meat for itself until the next delivery arrives. If people are leaving your stores without meat because you're relying on external storage...it's the truck pump, not the storage, causing the problem.

.

Dont mix your grandma on the issue brah.:)

i experienced that issue on big shopping centre's that is why i satated.

yes the 2.situation you state is possible. However you have to design your infastructure that you can supply constant flow to the cold store that will surpass the amount of truck capacity minimally ten fold. . stores works as buffer not to let the structure to get dry due to transportation time.

[tivaber]

Originally posted by Boogey:

I gave up on the problem.

I have a meat storage connected via a factory connection to a small shopping center and this works ok as it should.

[Boogey]

Originally posted by tivaber:

Originally posted by Boogey:

I gave up on the problem.

I have a meat storage connected via a factory connection to a small shopping center and this works ok as it should.

Interesting. It works so that the small shopping center keeps storage itself? Or is it at 0 and sell from the meat storage? If the latter, have you tried if your sales is on same numbers when you keep it in the shopping centre?

Small shopping center uses the same "$STORAGE_DEMAND_BASIC RESOURCE_TRANSPORT_COOLER X" as the grocery store where it certainly didn't work for me. I got it working then I changed the tag to _IMPORT. Have to try the shopping center..

[Erazor]

Just to throw my 2 cents in -> It works for me just fine and as expected.

I have a small shopping mall with attached cold storage. Delivery is via a 8t truck to the cold storage and the goods flow just fine..

Maybe you forgot to turn off the "min auto-buy" at the shopping mall? So instead of pushing your product forward, it just auto buys? If you have storage attached to any infastructure, always have the auto-buy at the storage, not at the point of usage.