Truly Terrible Battlemechs

[Bovril Brigadier]

So time for an episode of RantWarrior discussing Battlemechs that are simply awful. They might not be entirely unusable but you can't help wondering what the designers were thinking? Please note all opinions are equally worthless though appropriate mockery will be accepted and encouraged.

Catapult CPLT-A1

Sure it got a bunch of upgrade slots but that does not count for much when its a fire support Mech left completely defenceless in the event some cheeky Davion wants to give you an autocannon enema which in game is all the time. Maybe you could switch one of those launchers out for an SRM or maybe both but that leaves a lot of wasted tonnage.

Charger CGR-1A1

Everyones favourite over engine'd Assault Mech that sacrifices firepower and protection in attempt for a little more speed. Its a trap for the new player and not the fun kind, though we haven't had a good thread complaining about it in a long time.

Cicada CDA-2A

Part of the over engine'd club. At least it is properly fast this time but when you have no guns and virtually no armour to speak of there is no reason to use this unless truly desperate. Basically you look at this Mech if you go "I want a Locust but more expensive!"

Cicada CDA-2B

See Cicada CDA-2A.

Grasshopper GHR-5J

On this list as its supposed to be an "upgrade" but in reality is almost a complete downgrade in everyway to the regular Grasshopper. Since who in their right minds would trade a good deal of firepower just for an AMS system, especially in a game where Missile Boats are not altogether that common?

Griffin GRF-AR Ares

May be surprised to see this one here. On the face of it seems like a regular Griffin except it trades a Jump Jet for a Small Laser and more upgrade slots. What was revealed however after looking in game files is that it has worse stats than the Griffin GRF-1N in almost every way, especially in regards to arm and torso twist. Thus why it appears on this list.

Spider SDR-5D

Another of the over engine'd club but doesn't have it as bad. You can make this thing work but its going to be relatively anaemic on firepower. Just don't expect miracles on it.

Spider SDR-5K

See Spider SDR-5D

Spider SDR-5V

See Spider SDR-5D

[ParrotFace]

My cicada cda-2a is most certainly over engineered checking out at just over 6mil matching cost with my annihilator. Could be the YAML and my poor taste, but get me some c-bills and a cicada and it’s like strapping mgs on a muscle car. It’s actually what I take when I run into high enemy count missions. I need to paint “kneecapper” on that side of that thing. Just stack mech corpses. Fun read cheers!

[Radiac]

In my experience playing Dungeons and Dragons, there are spells that are in that game that are better as spells for the villains to use against the players than visa versa. Like Cloudkill, for example. You cast it, it creates a poison cloud that deals a ton of damage, which only effect the living, breathing creatures that are susceptible to poison damage and is totally harmless to golems, undead, oozes, elementals, etc. So for the party wizard to use that spell is pretty difficult, because you might damage party members with it, and it won't actually damage a lot of things you might be trying to target.

The bad mechs, in my opinion, have to exist, but are mostly there for you to shoot at and destroy as enemies, sort of like a reverse Cloudkill situation. It makes the game easier whenever Kurita throws a Charger at you, because it's taking up tonnage and is about the worst waste of resources they could use, so advantage: mercs. You certainly don't want to use a stock Charger for most purposes. You could maybe load one up with flamethrowers and do a Demo mission with it, that's about it.

[Valen]

Warhammer 40K

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-istquWjZ8M

[MechaCrash]

When talking about bad mechs, I think some ground rules need to be established. The main one being "how much modifying can you do and of what type?" The Charger is held up as an example of a bad mech, and in its stock configuration I agree, because it's one of the few mechs that's bad because it's meant to be bad, as opposed to others that are bad because "mech design was not a solved science and weapon balance is a joke."

But the Charger is bad stock because it has a ton of engine and only five small lasers, which is a pittance. In theory, you can give it better guns, because it actually has a large energy in the right arm and the other hardpoints are medium energy, but so what? The engine is so huge that you can't actually use any good guns without making its armor even worse, and in vanilla there is no way to fix this. It can make an okay laser boat if you're using YAML or something, though, because you can install weight saving technologies like Endo-Steel, or give it an XL engine, or do what the Charger 1A5 did and put in a reasonably sized engine.

[MrLuckless]

The Charger may get a new lease on life when someone is able to slap a melee weapon on it and turn it into a dumbfire missile that bashes other mechs to death. Otherwise, in a different way compared to the other guy mentioned, the Charger is a terrible mech because it was designed to fulfill a role no one asked for. Because who the hell designs an assault class scouting mech? Someone looking to get an easy payday thanks to the military industrial complex, that's who.

[wardenwolf]

The problem is that a melee weapon for an 80-ton 'mech will weigh more than the lasers it already carries. Upgrades to the Charger 1A1 fix its problems; it's only the base Charger that's "bad".

[MechaCrash]

This all assumes that you can stick a sword on the 1A1. There may be a "melee weapon slot," like how there's a "motive slot" for Superchargers and MASC that render them nigh worthless because you can only stick them in a small selection of mechs of dubious quality.

Or, heck, the melee weapon could be a fixed part of the machine. We'll have to see.

[Zloth]

Originally posted by 76561198027877576:

Because who the hell designs an assault class scouting mech?

[Clever Name]

Regarding the 'assault scout' concept, even though no assault needs to go faster than ~50 KPH, I do approve of putting jump jets on assaults. While 6 tons is a huge sacrifice, the mobility potential against other assaults that lack jets is worth it, I believe.

As for mechs I hate, the first that comes to mind is pretty much any version of the Panther. Putting a PPC on a light chassis is pointless if said light doesn't have average mobility for its class.

The 10K is particularly inferior, since even with Lostech, it's a weak design. Firing the ER PPC without moving an inch will still overheat the mech. Jumping 120m plus firing will leave the mech at +6 heat. Garbage.

Then wasting valuable weight on giving the SRM an Artemis system plus CASE for the ammo; again, all horrible decisions.

Could instead give it a medium pulse laser for its secondary weapon, save 2.5 tons, and have the same average damage output as an SRM4. That free tonnage could be used to add two more sinks.

Or, you know, just give the effing mech double sinks.

Still wouldn't fix the fact that a 35t mech moves as fast as an average 75 ton mech.

If we're going to rag on heavy/assault designs that move too quickly for their weight, we should remember all the horrible light/mediums that do the reverse.

The Hunchback and the Centurion can't even jump.

Basically the only reason to design a slow light/medium mech is to make it more affordable. It allows impoverished loser mechwarriors to put big guns on a cheap frame. Tiny engines save both weight and expense, without the need to upgrade to XL.

But it's also, generally, a really poor compromise.

[Clever Name]

Originally posted by Strayed:

Spider SDR-5D

Another of the over engine'd club but doesn't have it as bad. You can make this thing work but its going to be relatively anaemic on firepower. Just don't expect miracles on it.

Spider SDR-5K

See Spider SDR-5D

Spider SDR-5V

See Spider SDR-5D

The Spider wouldn't be a bad mech if MW5 actually had a use for scouting. Pure scouting should be worth something if the game was designed that way, but since it's focused entirely on combat, then yeah, a pure scout mech like the Spider is almost entirely useless.

The Cicada is a bad idea in any game setting, but the thing that really stands out to me: giving the -3M an Ultra AC/5.

Insanely wasteful. But wait, there's more! It also has double sinks. Double sinks despite the fact that it can't possibly generate enough heat to need 20.

Even if double firing the UAC generates a tiny bit of heat, don't worry; it only carries enough ammo for 10 double shots.

Would make a lot more sense to give the 3M an ER PPC, if it's going to have double sinks anyway.

[Clever Name]

Oh god... going through the 3050 TRO right now.... so many bad designs...

The Vindicator -3L carries 15 double sinks. It can generate, what, 25 heat at most?

The Hunchback -5M carries 13 double sinks, even though it can't reach 20 heat no matter what it does.

Wasting 2-3 tons of unnecessary sinks on small designs like these is deplorable.

[pete]

Originally posted by Clever Name:

Originally posted by Strayed:

Spider SDR-5D

Another of the over engine'd club but doesn't have it as bad. You can make this thing work but its going to be relatively anaemic on firepower. Just don't expect miracles on it.

Spider SDR-5K

See Spider SDR-5D

Spider SDR-5V

See Spider SDR-5D

The Spider wouldn't be a bad mech if MW5 actually had a use for scouting. Pure scouting should be worth something if the game was designed that way, but since it's focused entirely on combat, then yeah, a pure scout mech like the Spider is almost entirely useless.

The Cicada is a bad idea in any game setting, but the thing that really stands out to me: giving the -3M an Ultra AC/5.

Insanely wasteful. But wait, there's more! It also has double sinks. Double sinks despite the fact that it can't possibly generate enough heat to need 20.

Even if double firing the UAC generates a tiny bit of heat, don't worry; it only carries enough ammo for 10 double shots.

Would make a lot more sense to give the 3M an ER PPC, if it's going to have double sinks anyway.

No it just awful - even if there was a need for a 'scout'

[Bovril Brigadier]

Originally posted by MechaCrash:

This all assumes that you can stick a sword on the 1A1. There may be a "melee weapon slot," like how there's a "motive slot" for Superchargers and MASC that render them nigh worthless because you can only stick them in a small selection of mechs of dubious quality.

Or, heck, the melee weapon could be a fixed part of the machine. We'll have to see.

Yeah there is a lot of assumptions that the 1A1 can use melee weapons. From what I have seen all indications is that its a 1A5 variant?

Originally posted by Clever Name:

Oh god... going through the 3050 TRO right now.... so many bad designs...

Kept things in context of the MW5 game. Otherwise if you want to discuss every bad design from the 3050 TRO we'd be here a while. Thankfully you haven't looked at the 3055 TRO otherwise you'd have kittens when you look at the Lights.

[Cursed Hawkins]

Originally posted by Clever Name:

Regarding the 'assault scout' concept, even though no assault needs to go faster than ~50 KPH, I do approve of putting jump jets on assaults. While 6 tons is a huge sacrifice, the mobility potential against other assaults that lack jets is worth it, I believe.

Except the Charger even in that department isn't great unless YAML is fully applied to it, because you have Assault mechs like the Victor which has Jump Jets and offers firepower to boot.

[pete]

Originally posted by Cursed Hawkins:

Originally posted by Clever Name:

Regarding the 'assault scout' concept, even though no assault needs to go faster than ~50 KPH, I do approve of putting jump jets on assaults. While 6 tons is a huge sacrifice, the mobility potential against other assaults that lack jets is worth it, I believe.

Except the Charger even in that department isn't great unless YAML is fully applied to it, because you have Assault mechs like the Victor which has Jump Jets and offers firepower to boot.

Again with the YAML?? - You do realise that some of us choose not to use it.