Clan Mechs When?

[Pinhead Larry]

Mostly because in my career mode save time has advanced beyond the point of the clan invasion, heh.

But for real though you sell me a MechWarrior game and no Timber Wolf/Madcat? Literally John MechWarrior himself? The last time I ever played a MW game that had a playable Timber Wolf was... MW3. Why is everyone so afraid of advancing beyond the Clan Invasion point in the timeline with these games? Last time I played MWO they were still pre-clan too.

[Nobody]

Автор сообщения: mar

Автор сообщения: Strayed

To be fair IS Mech doctrine for fighting Clans aside from fighting dirty and with intelligence post 3055 was "You get a gauss rifle and you get a gauss rifle, and you also get a gauss rifle!"

Comstar dusted out "Clabuster" variants filled with Lostech, bring some best IS units, fought with combined arms and used every dirty trick in the book, and still got very phyrric victory.

Yup. Because all that lostech was still outright inferior to the clantech.

IS XL? 3 slots in each side
Clan XL? 2 slots

IS Endo/Ferro? 12 slots
Clan Endo/Ferro? 6 slots

IS DHS? 3 Slots
Clan DHS? 2 Slots

Yeah clantech runs hotter.... but when you have more tonnage and crits for more DHS?
ANY advantage the IS can get.... Clantech can get better.

ONLY Advantage the IS had over the clans was the clans fighting style...

And in all seriousness?
No real way to enforce that in a videogame

[Bovril Brigadier]

Автор сообщения: mar

Comstar dusted out "Clabuster" variants filled with Lostech, bring some best IS units, fought with combined arms and used every dirty trick in the book, and still got very phyrric victory.

"Real" Clanners would roll over several ragtag 'Merc unit without big troubles, while making bets on who can take less tonnage.

Do people just ignore what is being fielded post 3052 or something?

[Shadow]

Автор сообщения: Just Some Dude

Автор сообщения: hghwolf

Good luck getting close.

Or kicking it, especially in this game.

He should try doing it without being given abstract, inexplicable quirks and bonuses by a video game balance mechanic. I'll even give him lostech internals... The Clan equivalent is universally better (structure, armor, engines)...

But not undefeatable if you haven't missed my points. :-)

[Nobody]

Автор сообщения: Strayed

Do people just ignore what is being fielded post 3052 or something?

No.
But correct me if I am wrong?
But it isn't until Dark Ages or thereabout that the IS tech actually starts matching the Clan stats I quoted above.

Which still gives a pure and undeniable advantage to Clans

[charliedrex]

Автор сообщения: Strayed

Автор сообщения: mar

Comstar dusted out "Clabuster" variants filled with Lostech, bring some best IS units, fought with combined arms and used every dirty trick in the book, and still got very phyrric victory.

"Real" Clanners would roll over several ragtag 'Merc unit without big troubles, while making bets on who can take less tonnage.

Do people just ignore what is being fielded post 3052 or something?

We're talking (well, thought we were) about a gradual introduction to the invasion in line with the game's calendar, such that the theoretical DLC we're talking about (remember? Thread topic?) has chronological progression you can "continue into" from your game.

And if there was a new set of campaign missions available from 3050... Yeah, all the reverse-engineered stuff doesn't exist.

[letir]

Автор сообщения: Shadow

Good luck with that. PPC's are slow and LRM's are not an issue. Are you trying to implify that i am a stationary target and the terrain is flat? Your missing some major points here. Clans have good stuff but that's not a setting of just comparing numbers. Everything has it's weeknesses. C-LRM's basicly do no damage under 180m and are no cruise missles. It's not like a Clan Mech is a one hit kill weapon.

I love the Timberwolf and i always stuck to Jade Falcon as my nick name suggests but i've also beaten Clan Mechs with IS Mechs.

Clan LRM don't have minimal range. They do full damage at any range. They have no weakness.
Same going for PPC, which are Clan ERPPC and have both range and projectile speed, without minimum distance.

I'm implying that Clantech is better, and Clan pilots also better, lore-wise. So you cannot use brain-dead AI of MW5 or nerfed into the ground Clantech of MWO. In the "real" fight geneticly engineered warrior would pick your lancemates one by one with insane precision, while dancing around slower adversaries and evading your shots on the full speed.

[Shadow]

Автор сообщения: Nobody

Автор сообщения: Strayed

Do people just ignore what is being fielded post 3052 or something?

No.
But correct me if I am wrong?
But it isn't until Dark Ages or thereabout that the IS tech actually starts matching the Clan stats I quoted above.

Which still gives a pure and undeniable advantage to Clans

IS had Omni Mechs bevor that and even used Clan Tech. So it's not that the IS only used it's original tech all the way. We can't compare just A against B constantly on their starting points. It's a moving and living universe.

[Nobody]

On topic, I would assume we would eventually, since the game rather implies your father was a clanner.

When?
Dunno.

[Nobody]

Автор сообщения: Shadow

....even used Clan Tech...

IS omnis at that era were outright inferior to the clan ones, no?
If wrong? Which ones?

And what I left of your quote...
Rather only works to support what I was saying? No?

Or are you arguing that we should obsolete 99% of what is in game once we hit 3050?

[Shadow]

Автор сообщения: mar

Автор сообщения: Shadow

Good luck with that. PPC's are slow and LRM's are not an issue. Are you trying to implify that i am a stationary target and the terrain is flat? Your missing some major points here. Clans have good stuff but that's not a setting of just comparing numbers. Everything has it's weeknesses. C-LRM's basicly do no damage under 180m and are no cruise missles. It's not like a Clan Mech is a one hit kill weapon.

I love the Timberwolf and i always stuck to Jade Falcon as my nick name suggests but i've also beaten Clan Mechs with IS Mechs.

Clan LRM don't have minimal range. They do full damage at any range. They have no weakness.
Same going for PPC, which are Clan ERPPC and have both range and projectile speed, without minimum distance.

I'm implying that Clantech is better, and Clan pilots also better, lore-wise. So you cannot use brain-dead AI of MW5 or nerfed into the ground Clantech of MWO. In the "real" fight geneticly engineered warrior would pick your lancemates one by one with insane precision, while dancing around slower adversaries and evading your shots on the full speed.

Absolutly wrong about the LRM's. I never said that they had a minimal range but they basicly do nothing under 180m. That is a big difference.
Minimal Range = you cannot fire below a certain range. What you are mixing up is maybe effective range.

Are we comparing the mechs or also the pilots of the IS and Clans from the books vs. the game? I assumed we would be talking about normal humans or even the AI in either mechs but not the lore itself because this is another kond of discussion

[Nobody]

Автор сообщения: Shadow

Absolutly wrong about the LRM's. I never said that they had a minimal range but they basicly do nothing under 180m. That is a big difference.
Minimal Range = you cannot fire below a certain range. What you are mixing up is maybe effective range.

And other than saving you ammo?
WTF is the difference between "Cannot fire" and "Does nothing"?

...
...
And do you have ANY evidence that Clan LRM have an equivalent to the minimum range?
Every manual I own on the subject says they work just as well within 180meters as they do outside.

MWO is the only game Ive played that gave them ANY weakness within that range?

[Bovril Brigadier]

Автор сообщения: Nobody

No.
But correct me if I am wrong?
But it isn't until Dark Ages or thereabout that the IS tech actually starts matching the Clan stats I quoted above.

Which still gives a pure and undeniable advantage to Clans

Actually happens round about FedCom Civil War.
Problem is everyone seems hell bent in making the IS fight Ton for Ton not Cost for Cost. When you factor in that Clanners start ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ bricks considering the IS designs that can be fielded for the Clanner equivalent. When your average IS Lance compared to the cost of a Clan Star can field 2x more Gauss than their Mechs then the picture turns different.

And that's even if the Clans can achieve air superiority with how much heads and shoulders IS Aero is.

[charliedrex]

Okay, this has apparently turned into some weird RP of clans vs IS and I'm not sure why.

Back to the point: assuming it were integrated in a way that could continue from the campaign, and weren't a new isolated campaign/career (which to be fair, is entirely possible)... Yeah, for a very specific year or two of time, it would be a roflstomp.

Then again I keep waffling on about the timeline thing, when you can just keep doing random refits to your mechs and waiting, and next thing you know it's 3124, there's nothing FORCING you to engage with the content...

I don't know, I just frankly would personally enjoy being able to either play as IS, desperately outgunned and having to survive mechs that outspec you in every way, or as Clanners, and they like have you in a Star of mediums taking down an IS lance or two of stock, non-lostech heavies, just to show the disparity.

I just want the DLC to be more substantial than "lol here's more toys to play with have fun" is all.

[Nobody]

Автор сообщения: Strayed

Actually happens round about FedCom Civil War.

The start of IS having that KIND of tech in any meaningful ammount?
Yes.
The fact that it was still outright inferior to Clantech?
Any evidence of to support your argument there?......
IN GAME? Cost doesn't mean much after all in a single player game...

Автор сообщения: Strayed

Problem is everyone seems hell bent in making the IS fight Ton for Ton not Cost for Cost.

As a big fan of the Urbie in my TT matches.... LOLNO
And as a mechanic in the videogame....?
Once you buy that TBR, and can outrun AND outrange your opponents?
Cost is rather irrelevant beyond how long you have to save up to do that, no?

Автор сообщения: Strayed

When you factor in that Clanners start ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ bricks considering the IS designs that can be fielded for the Clanner equivalent. When your average IS Lance compared to the cost of a Clan Star can field 2x more Gauss than their Mechs then the picture turns different.

Which is.... again... almost completely based on how they chose to act.
Got a way to keep the players from doing the same thing with clantech?
Remember, this is a single player game (or coop if you want to get petty)
Once you buy that TBR, and can outrun AND outrange your opponents?
Cost is rather irrelevant beyond how long you have to save up to do that, no?

If you REALLY REALLY REALLY want to try and use the COST of the stuff to balance stuff...
Does that not make the Urbie one of the machines that is top of the list?
Hard to get more cost-efficient than that, no?
...
OH WAIT!
WE CAN JUST OUTRUN/OUTRANGE IT!

JUST LIKE CLAN TECH LETS YA DO!
EVEN BETTER BECAUSE IT HAS BETTER STATS!

You accuse us of ignoring your points....
But you have yet to actually counter ANY of ours!
You have yet to even ACKNOWLEDGE that ours have ANY value!
Just because IS tech is cheaper?
WOW U SEW SMURT!

[hghwolf]

Автор сообщения: Shadow

IS had Omni Mechs bevor that and even used Clan Tech. So it's not that the IS only used it's original tech all the way. We can't compare just A against B constantly on their starting points. It's a moving and living universe.

The IS doesn't produce any kind of Omnimech until after Tukkayid, which is when the Cappies introduce the Raptor, and that's still just a 25 tonner.

During the actual Clan Invasion the only real advance the IS had was the reintroduction of the Gauss Rifle and mechs built to carry it like the Hollander or your generic 'Assault that replaces whatever AC it used to have with a Gauss Rifle'.

EDIT : The reason IS LRMs have a minimum range is that they need a ballistic trajectory to get their 'long' range of 'less than a kilometer'. Clan LRMs are direct fire.

You CAN direct fire IS LRMs but that tends to make them very susceptible to exploding in the launcher.