What's wrong with Victors?

[Jivebot]

Ever since Battletech i've been steadily growing more and more interested in the Mechwarrior setting. Exploring the lore, reading various forums, etc.

I'm noticing a trend where alot of people are constantly putting down Victors. Why do people dislike them so much?

[Maddermax]

The basic Victor is just very under gunned for an assault. SRM4, 2 med lasers, and an AC20. The AC 20 also arm mounted, which isn’t necessarily a deal breaker, but as it’s your main damage dealer, losing that somewhat vulnerable arm means you have fewer weapons than a locust. It’s also reasonably low mounted, so it doesn’t take much in the way to block your shots.

It’s just very mediocre. The other standard variants aren’t a lot better either. The Hero Vixtor Basilisk is nice though, with a serious SRM battery in the shoulder and an ECM.

[Sterling Archer]

"Whats wrong with victors"

Nothing




I wouldnt worry too much about it, youll notice trends....

People hate lights, then they love them.....

People think certain assaults are op, then they go crazy for them...

One week a certain mech is a pariah....then another week its all the rage.

Avoid trends, its all BS. Especially here


If YOU like/can make use of a certain mech in a positive way, does it really matter what mupjoebigears3523 on a forum says?

I doubt it, but some people perpetually need the validation of others to form or grow their opinions.... Its a wierd side effect of a certain type of person on the internet. And the internet is awash with opinionated "experts"

[TwinChops]

Originally posted by Sterling Archer:

I wouldnt worry too much about it, youll notice trends....

People hate lights, then they love them.....

People think certain assaults are op, then they go crazy for them...

One week a certain mech is a pariah....then another week its all the rage.

Avoid trends, its all BS. Especially here

While i agree to that, Maddermax is also 100% right, simply because a freaking Dragon is better then the Victor, (still has the same problems but atleast has a lrm10) heck a cent even has better armament lol

[Rodrigo]

Originally posted by Maddermax:

The basic Victor is just very under gunned for an assault. SRM4, 2 med lasers, and an AC20. The AC 20 also arm mounted, which isn’t necessarily a deal breaker, but as it’s your main damage dealer, losing that somewhat vulnerable arm means you have fewer weapons than a locust. It’s also reasonably low mounted, so it doesn’t take much in the way to block your shots.

It’s just very mediocre. The other standard variants aren’t a lot better either. The Hero Vixtor Basilisk is nice though, with a serious SRM battery in the shoulder and an ECM.

I don't get it why people are so picky about arm weapons, it gives a much better response and angles, and torsos can be destroyed too you know... they may have less armor, sure, but mechs have 8 targeting points soo... it's not like arms always go first.

[Fendelphi]

Originally posted by Captein:

Originally posted by Maddermax:

The basic Victor is just very under gunned for an assault. SRM4, 2 med lasers, and an AC20. The AC 20 also arm mounted, which isn’t necessarily a deal breaker, but as it’s your main damage dealer, losing that somewhat vulnerable arm means you have fewer weapons than a locust. It’s also reasonably low mounted, so it doesn’t take much in the way to block your shots.

It’s just very mediocre. The other standard variants aren’t a lot better either. The Hero Vixtor Basilisk is nice though, with a serious SRM battery in the shoulder and an ECM.

I don't get it why people are so picky about arm weapons, it gives a much better response and angles, and torsos can be destroyed too you know... they may have less armor, sure, but mechs have 8 targeting points soo... it's not like arms always go first.

Arms have less armor, less structure and will very often get hit from the side. And while arms do not always go first, they do it often enough that it is a factor to consider.
All that being said, the Victor does ok, if you use it well.

[Maddermax]

Originally posted by Captein:

I don't get it why people are so picky about arm weapons, it gives a much better response and angles, and torsos can be destroyed too you know... they may have less armor, sure, but mechs have 8 targeting points soo... it's not like arms always go first.

Often they do though, and once again, it’s not just because arm mount, which as I said has some advantages, it’s that it’s a huge part of of your otherwise negligible damage output. I like the basilisk, and have two arm Heavy Rifles or LBX, but if the arm (or that torso) get damaged, it still is a great mech with significant firepower.

The fact is there are a lot of better mechs in the tonnage range, from Orion’s and Black Knights to the Charger 1A5 to stalkers and battle masters, with arm mounted weapons or not, with significantly better firepower.

The Victor isn’t useless certainly, and if you pick one up early while you’re just getting up to assault mechs, it’s fine. If you have options though, it’s pretty low down on the list of things you’d choose.

[cyäegha]

they probably get a worse rep than they deserve simply because of hardpoint starvation; in MWO the less-restrictive mechlab meant you could do everything from reasonably meta builds (3x LB10) to meme travesty builds (3x AC20)

unfortunately the restrictions of the vanilla MW5 chassis' make almost every variant of victor objectively underwhelming... though i'd be loath to call it worse than a bloody dragon, not a snowball's chance in hell
only a filthy kuritan could claim, with a straight face, that the dragon is better than anything at all

[Maddermax]

Originally posted by cyäegha:

they probably get a worse rep than they deserve simply because of hardpoint starvation; in MWO the less-restrictive mechlab meant you could do everything from reasonably meta builds (3x LB10) to meme travesty builds (3x AC20)

unfortunately the restrictions of the vanilla MW5 chassis' make almost every variant of victor objectively underwhelming... though i'd be loath to call it worse than a bloody dragon, not a snowball's chance in hell
only a filthy kuritan could claim, with a straight face, that the dragon is better than anything at all

Before making sweeping statements about the Dragon, please remember that the Stock Cicada and Charger 1A1 exist ;)

[Bovril Brigadier]

Jump Jets
That's basically your answer. Victor is heavily reliant on being able to jump over enemies and give them an AC/20 enema. That's not very easy to do in this.

[Cobalt60]

I'm with Sterling Archer on this one: "Nothing."
It's all about your perspective on 'What makes a good (weight class here) mech?'
This perspective is formed in the player's mind by that players skills on the Mechwarrior
(insert franchise number here) battlefield.
Bottom line: I can take a Victor,hero or not,and jump-jet all-over my unfortunate foes.
Yes,I even do specifically targeted shots against enemy while I'm airborne and often
while facing opposite of my forward momentum in-jump(that's called a pirouette,mid-air).
I really love Phoenix Hawks. Take one into a raid mission by myself(200+ tons underweight)
and get 'er done.
A Victor,to me,is the best example of a well-balanced assault-class mech with jump
capability. Hehe. But...I'm an old Mechwarrior. >:)

[Sterling Archer]

Originally posted by Cobalt60:

I'm with Sterling Archer on this one: "Nothing."
It's all about your perspective on 'What makes a good (weight class here) mech?'
This perspective is formed in the player's mind by that players skills on the Mechwarrior
(insert franchise number here) battlefield.
Bottom line: I can take a Victor,hero or not,and jump-jet all-over my unfortunate foes.
Yes,I even do specifically targeted shots against enemy while I'm airborne and often
while facing opposite of my forward momentum in-jump(that's called a pirouette,mid-air).
I really love Phoenix Hawks. Take one into a raid mission by myself(200+ tons underweight)
and get 'er done.
A Victor,to me,is the best example of a well-balanced assault-class mech with jump
capability. Hehe. But...I'm an old Mechwarrior. :havocsuit: >:)

With you on the phoenix hawks bud, i currently main either kuroi kiri (finally found it) or the version with ecm i forget the designation, in 400t missions sometimes.

Ive always had a soft spot for the PH.... Im an old mechwarrior myself

[Bovril Brigadier]

Originally posted by Sterling Archer:

With you on the phoenix hawks bud, i currently main either kuroi kiri (finally found it) or the version with ecm i forget the designation, in 400t missions sometimes.

PXH-1b or PXH-2?
Also Phoenix Hawk is like a super Spider in this. Seems to tank shots rather well for its weight.

[Sterling Archer]

Originally posted by Strayed:

Originally posted by Sterling Archer:

With you on the phoenix hawks bud, i currently main either kuroi kiri (finally found it) or the version with ecm i forget the designation, in 400t missions sometimes.

PXH-1b or PXH-2?
Also Phoenix Hawk is like a super Spider in this. Seems to tank shots rather well for its weight.

Yeah thats it, the 1b. I prefer the weapon spread on that one, atleast for my play style

[pete]

Originally posted by Strayed:

Jump Jets
That's basically your answer. Victor is heavily reliant on being able to jump over enemies and give them an AC/20 enema. That's not very easy to do in this.

& Poor armour

[Jivebot]

It seemed like I was seeing people be dismissive of Victors even outside of video games. I thought maybe there's some negativity from the table top game spilling over that I was unaware of.

Mounting three AC-20's on a Victor does sound pretty beast mode. Is that something you can only do in the online version or does Tabletop allow that too? I'm considering getting into that in an online forum perhaps

I notice there seems to be a second Hero Victor in the game besides the BSK but cant find anything online about it. Can anyone tell me what it is and where to find it?