Doom 2016 vs Doom Eternal

[Sally the Wendigo]

I know this is very cliche to go on about this topic, but i just wanted to share some of my thoughts. In my opinion Doom 2016 is better than Doom Eternal due to a few things. Even though Doom 2016 has way more bugs than Eternal, like falling through the map and going through walls, you will rarely, if ever come across them unless you're looking for them, Eternal, on the other hand, has way too many bugs that make the experience worse in my opinion, and are very common, like clicking "G" right in front of an enemy just to get the "no target" message over and over, or right clicking with the super shotgun while staring at the enemy, with meathook basically ignoring you. And there are a lot more, and it just feels unfair when you die (or loose UN like me ;-;) due to the game not responding to your inputs. Plus let's talk about the marauder, yes "boo! boo!" i know, everyone and their mother had an opinion on them, but mine is more than just "good enemy" or "bad enemy", even though I find marauders fun to fight, and like an amazing enemy concept, their ai, at least for me, is uh, not working like 70% of the time. Most of the time they would just stand still and not move, at all, just putting up shield and summoning dogs when shot at. And other times he would run to you, looking like he's about to do his melee attack, only for him to super shotgun/shield in your face. Over all I love both these games, but the amount of weird and downright annoying bugs and glitches in Eternal bring it down for me.

anyway uh, I am interested to hear your opinion on either games, and maybe some bugs you've seen in both. uh, thanks for reading, and have a great day!

[Dexter in the Dark]

can't say i have had the same experience, in my time in i don't think i have run into any bugs, not to say i have not i just do not remember any.
as for controls i cant say anything about mouse and key board as i am one of those weirdos who uses a game pad, but for me it response time was rock solid.

[Erwin_Von_Braun]

DOOM 2016 is great.
DOOM Eternal is merely 2016 in a pretty dress.

[Sar]

I tried replaying 2016 recently after playing a ton of Eternal, and the opening is brutal, and I really enjoyed the first half and thought to myself “I was really harsh about it, it’s not as good as Eternal but it has its merits”.

But then I stopped halfway through and just played more Eternal. It just doesn’t hold my attention the way DE does.

[Grampire]

The marauder "bugs" you mentioned make him more interesting to fight IMO - otherwise he's extremely predictable and easy.

I've never lost a UN run due to a bug. I stopped playing Eternal following my 6th successful UN clear (was working on 7th). There are bugs but they're not really that big of a deal.

IMO I wouldn't rank these games based on niche technical issues which aren't hugely prevalent in either.

If those are your only criticisms of Eternal then I'm not really impressed with your analysis. I think my personal criticisms of Eternal are more substantial but think it's simultaneously a much better game than 2016, which while a great game in its own right is a much more passive and slow experience.

[chester]

I somewhat agree about the marauder's AI. I don't think it's an issue in the base campaign or DLCs because of how he's used, but playing some of the Master Levels and modded content made me realize how bad it can get. Trying to set up a marauder to do his green light attack just for a mecha zombie projectile to interrupt him gets tiring after it happens for the fifth time in a row, and it more often than not leads to me skipping the green light attack altogether with lock on burst or spamming explosives on the ground.

As Grampire said, he'd be extremely easy to fight if they patched him, but I feel like they could tune his AI to compensate. Make him more aggressive, and make him summon his wolf on random intervals. Hell, maybe even make his shield deflect projectiles, or make his axe explode like the playable version of him. There's a lot you could do to make him more interesting to fight.

[SuperFly]

In the end, D16 proved to be the better title with the greater longevity and replayability.
The worst part of that game experience is the same damn Mick Gordon glory kill musical riff -- repeated incessantly, with no variation -- becomes so annoying that it can cripple enjoyment.

Sadly, you'd have to mod the game to remove or change it up.
The worst part of the Marauder, for me, was the tonally-bankrupt (and also-unskippable) tweetie-birds and goofy-ass cartoon stars on his head -- which was only added later to further sour the overall experience.

[Sar]

og boy here we go again

Originally posted by SuperFly:

In the end, D16 proved to be the better title with the greater longevity and replayability.
The worst part of that game experience is the same damn Mick Gordon glory kill musical riff -- repeated incessantly, with no variation -- becomes so annoying that it can cripple enjoyment.

Sadly, you'd have to mod the game to remove or change it up.
The worst part of the Marauder, for me, was the tonally-bankrupt (and also-unskippable) tweetie-birds and goofy-ass cartoon stars on his head -- which was only added later to further sour the overall experience.

33.2% of Doom 2016 players completed the campaign on any difficulty.
33.5% of Doom Eternal players completed the campaign on any difficulty.

That's in spite of DE selling like 3 times more than D2016 (at least at launch) and D2016 having a 4 years head start, in spite of DE being a harder game past first two levels. It still can't catch up to relative numbers, not even talking about absolute numbers here.

Originally posted by SuperNerd:

but muh DLCs

No ♥♥♥♥ less people bought and completed the DLCs, this is true for pretty much every single player game ever.

[Ace]

Originally posted by SuperFly:

In the end, D16 proved to be the better title with the greater longevity and replayability.
The worst part of that game experience is the same damn Mick Gordon glory kill musical riff -- repeated incessantly, with no variation -- becomes so annoying that it can cripple enjoyment.

Sadly, you'd have to mod the game to remove or change it up.
The worst part of the Marauder, for me, was the tonally-bankrupt (and also-unskippable) tweetie-birds and goofy-ass cartoon stars on his head -- which was only added later to further sour the overall experience.

How in anyway does 2016 have more replayability than eternal? eternal has more to do so this is utter nonsense, but lets makes a list.

2016:

Single player:
Multiplayer:
Arcade mode:
Mods:

------

Doom eternal:

Singleplayer:
Multiplayer:
Master levels:
Classic mode:
Horde mode:
Extra life mode:
Cheat codes:
Mods:

Yeah.

[Sar]

How cute of you to pretend you never heard of review-bombing, particularly of two campaigns DE got - first for including Denuvo, second for the Mick Gordon controversy.

Steam reviews are not an objective metric. Reminds me of an epic moment from the past, when Call of Duty MW2 was announced to have no dedicated servers. Call of Duty community raged tirelessly and created Steam groups with titles like "Boycott MW2". On release day, you could enter one of those groups and sure enough, almost every member was enjoying their fresh copy of said Call of Duty, surely bought by their parents or their lunch money.

If people like Doom 2016 more than DE, why did less people finish Doom 2016? Could it be that it's... boring?

[Ace]

Originally posted by Sar:

How cute of you to pretend you never heard of review-bombing, particularly of two campaigns DE got - first for including Denuvo, second for the Mick Gordon controversy.

Steam reviews are not an objective metric. Reminds me of an epic moment from the past, when Call of Duty MW2 was announced to have no dedicated servers. Call of Duty community raged tirelessly and created Steam groups with titles like "Boycott MW2". On release day, you could enter one of those groups and sure enough, almost every member was enjoying their fresh copy of said Call of Duty, surely bought by their parents or their lunch money.

If people like Doom 2016 more than DE, why did less people finish Doom 2016? Could it be that it's... boring?

Very true.

[chester]

I was hoping to start a good conversation about the Marauder. Guess it was naive of me to think that would happen on a post titled "Doom 2016 vs Doom Eternal"

[SuperFly]

Originally posted by chester:

I somewhat agree about the marauder's AI. I don't think it's an issue in the base campaign or DLCs because of how he's used, but playing some of the Master Levels and modded content made me realize how bad it can get. Trying to set up a marauder to do his green light attack just for a mecha zombie projectile to interrupt him gets tiring after it happens for the fifth time in a row, and it more often than not leads to me skipping the green light attack altogether with lock on burst or spamming explosives on the ground.

As Grampire said, he'd be extremely easy to fight if they patched him, but I feel like they could tune his AI to compensate. Make him more aggressive, and make him summon his wolf on random intervals. Hell, maybe even make his shield deflect projectiles, or make his axe explode like the playable version of him. There's a lot you could do to make him more interesting to fight.

He would be made moreinteresting to engage if they allowed the user to turn off the tweetie sound effects and swirly star handicaps.
Those were retroactively inserted, and ruined a decent enemy for a great many players, myself included. Hugo Martin spoke of it in an interview, and only focused on how people were more successful after the additions, by charts/numbers, instead of critical/fan reception.

The devs were too busy trying hard by-the-numbers to focus on making a good entry in the franchise. This shows in everything from their analysis of the Marauder, to D:E's by-the-beats/cadence/timer-cooldown gameplay.

[Sar]

The birdies should've been a toggle, but I understand why Hugo inserted it. One time too many watching people shooting Marauder once and then running away while he's stunned.

[SuperFly]

Originally posted by SuperFly:

...
Doom 1993 - 96%
Doom 2016 - 95%
Doom II - 94%
Doom 64 - 94%
Doom Eternal - 91%
Doom 3 - 85%

Y'all remember to stay in school, where they might teach you how to interpret data..
Take the "L" Sars, you've earned it. "SuperNerd" was also a nice touch to your tomfoolerly.

Originally posted by Sar:

How cute of you to pretend you never heard of review-bombing, particularly of two campaigns DE got - first for including Denuvo, second for the Mick Gordon controversy....

Steam invalidates periods of Review Bombing for overall stats, and even locks them when anomalies are detected.
The DLC (which are both failures) don't enter into the main game's score, either.

Can you even read the data you're trying to grandstand on? Clearly, not.

Originally posted by SuperFly:

(The Marauder) would be made more interesting to engage if they allowed the user to turn off the tweetie sound effects and swirly star handicaps.
Those were retroactively inserted, and ruined a decent enemy for a great many players, myself included. Hugo Martin spoke of it in an interview, and only focused on how people were more successful after the additions, by charts/numbers, instead of critical/fan reception.
...

Originally posted by Sar:

The birdies should've been a toggle, but I understand why Hugo inserted it. One time too many watching people shooting Marauder once and then running away while he's stunned.

As we've seen with your ability to interpret data -- your understanding amounts to very little.

[Sar]

And yet more people bought DE by any metric made public, and more people completed DE by any metric made public. Curious.