Why Doom Eternal has less freedom than Doom 2016

[Sar]

This is a common complaint on those forums, and I don't want to say that anyone who feels that way is wrong. However, I'd like to explain why, in my opinion, Doom Eternal gives you less freedom than Doom 2016, and why, for some people, it's a good thing.

Both DE and D2016 are not traditional shooters. They have multiple progression systems and a bunch of additional mechanics, or gimmicks, as a more critical person would call them. Glory Kills, multiple thrown Equipment types, non-damaging alt-fires for weapons, Chainsaw for magic ammo. Eternal reduces the amount of equipment to just two Grenades, but adds Dash, Blood Punch and armor-generating Flamethrower. That’s a lot of cognitive load for a first time player, and those systems are built on top of the core of the genre – dodging enemy projectiles and hitting your own shots.

With this in mind, imagine two kinds of players. Let’s call them Alex and Bob. Their movement and aim are similarly adequate. The difference is, Alex doesn’t care about those additional mechanics. Maybe he’ll chainsaw a big demon once in a while, maybe he’ll toss a grenade at a group of zombies and watch chunks fly, maybe he’ll Glory Kill a big demon in the end of a fight for a cool moment, but he’s mostly here for shooting demons with guns, and he has a good idea which guns he wants to use and which ones he doesn’t. Bob is different. Bob wants to learn those mechanics and incorporate them into his playstyle, he thinks that would be a fun thing to do.

The problem is, you can’t balance the game, especially at the higher difficulties, for both of those players. If you make Nightmare tough, but doable for Alex, Bob will steamroll all over it once he learns to utilize those additional mechanics. Steamrolling is fun for some people, at least once, but not for everyone. If you balance the game for Bob, Alex will just get frustrated. He’s not some scrub, he’s good at FPS and can probably whoop your ass at Quake. But his freedom is reduced; he is forced to engage with those abominable gimmicks if he wants to be on equal footing with Bob.

See what I’m talking about? Doom 2016 is balanced for Alex. Eternal is balanced for Bob. Unless you make some kind of “purist mode” which disables those additional mechanics and rebalances the game accordingly – adding more pickups, reducing enemy damage etc. – you can’t achieve a compromise. Unless you completely neuter those additional mechanics, making them completely inconsequential. But I don’t think that’s good design.

Makes me wonder, who, of those two, The Dark Ages is going to be aimed at.

[Zapmaster]

If Alex is too lazy to learn to use all the gameplay tools designed to make the game easier and more fun to play that's not flawed design. That's refusing to learn to play the game and expecting it cater to you, which is unreasonable and stupid. The freedom thing is subjective as well. Is it more fun for a lazy player who wants to just use 2 weapons and not learn hot keys to play thorough Doom '16 then Eternal, absolutely. But once someone masters Eternal, there are more complex and effective high skill ways to play the game then there are in Doom '16.

[Kyller92 AKA Cinos]

This is something I'll probably keep repeating this until the end of times, but what those that prefer 2016's gameplay actually like isn't the freedom of choice, what they like is the lack of consequences.

[Grampire]

It's good to spell it out, but this is really just stating that 2016's design works as a generic shooter more than Eternal's.

Alex might have more fun in 2016, but Bob is bored because the mechanics create a massive imbalance that breaks the game. Thinks like weapon swapping, runes and mods in 2016 are hilariously broken in that game, trivializing it when you play like Eternal.

In both scenarios Alex is working harder than Bob because he's refusing to accept mechanics. He likes 2016 more, but it's still not designed with him in mind.

[Bob]

Something something Why China has less freedom than USA??? Liberal owned.

[Sar]

Originally posted by Grampire:

In both scenarios Alex is working harder than Bob because he's refusing to accept mechanics. He likes 2016 more, but it's still not designed with him in mind.

Well, games aren’t about putting in the least effort. In my scenario, both Alex and Bob want to be challenged. If Bob didn’t want to be challenged, he would be delighted by being able to bend Doom 2016 to his will. Like clock we, that YouTuber who made cool D2016 gameplay videos where he quickswapped demons so hard they didn’t even have a chance to get a shot on him, and despised Eternal because they made quick swapping “mandatory”, meaning other plebs had to get on his level.

And I don’t think 2016 was designed to challenge Bob. If it was, it was a pretty epic failure of game design!

[Slap]

maybe instead of the game giving you freedom, you need to free your mind.

[Zapmaster]

Originally posted by Sar:

Originally posted by Grampire:

In both scenarios Alex is working harder than Bob because he's refusing to accept mechanics. He likes 2016 more, but it's still not designed with him in mind.

Well, games aren’t about putting in the least effort. In my scenario, both Alex and Bob want to be challenged. If Bob didn’t want to be challenged, he would be delighted by being able to bend Doom 2016 to his will. Like clock we, that YouTuber who made cool D2016 gameplay videos where he quickswapped demons so hard they didn’t even have a chance to get a shot on him, and despised Eternal because they made quick swapping “mandatory”, meaning other plebs had to get on his level.

And I don’t think 2016 was designed to challenge Bob. If it was, it was a pretty epic failure of game design!

Quick swapping isn't mandatory in Eternal at all. Anything Ultra Violence and bellow is clearly designed to be playable without doing it. In fact quickswapping well on those difficulties makes the game too easy.

[momoi_gaming]

Originally posted by Slap:

maybe instead of the game giving you freedom, you need to free your mind.

this

[Get Out]

Why can't I play football using my hands, shooting the defenders with a glock and launch the ball to the net with a rocket launcher? Goofy ahh argument. Every game have rules Doom Eternal is no exception. Case closed.

[momoi_gaming]

Originally posted by Sar:

And I don’t think 2016 was designed to challenge Bob. If it was, it was a pretty epic failure of game design!

so is 16 kirby then?

[momoi_gaming]

Originally posted by ☣ N\A ☣:

Why can't I play football using my hands, shooting the defenders with a glock and launch the ball to the net with a rocket launcher? Goofy ahh argument. Every game have rules Doom Eternal is no exception. Case closed.

people complain about eternal for having more rules to follow i think

[Professor Toothy]

For me it’s not really a battle of “freedom”. It’s more so that Eternal wants you to play a very specific way. If you don’t find that type of playstyle fun, then the game feels oppressive and tedious. It’s equal parts resource management and target prioritization, with less emphasis on raw aim and berserker combat.

I can understand why people didn’t resonate with Eternal, but I did enjoy my time with it. It’s very much an experimental type game that was kind of rushed out the door at launch. I did like 2016 more, but that’s probably nostalgia talking since that game is almost a decade old now.

[Sar]

Originally posted by Enron+:

For me it’s not really a battle of “freedom”. It’s more so that Eternal wants you to play a very specific way. If you don’t find that type of playstyle fun, then the game feels oppressive and tedious. It’s equal parts resource management and target prioritization, with less emphasis on raw aim and berserker combat.

I can understand why people didn’t resonate with Eternal, but I did enjoy my time with it. It’s very much an experimental type game that was kind of rushed out the door at launch. I did like 2016 more, but that’s probably nostalgia talking since that game is almost a decade old now.

Target prioritization is a part of any FPS that has multiple enemy types. How are you not prioritizing targets in Doom 2016? Are you going to shoot at an Imp across the room or at a Hell Knight about to smash you?

Also, how does Eternal have less emphasis on aim? It even adds weakpoints for you to aim at, if you wish. In 2016 I mostly used Siege Mode, which is a ridiculously wide hitscan beam and trivial to aim with, or SSG, which is typically used at very close range.

[momoi_gaming]

Yeah, in eternal these factors like the enemie priorization are hard to ignore, because the enemies really want to kill you.

You should to play in the same way in 16. But game is not going to punish you that hard if you not play in that way.

Eternal will, game just demads more from you