not a fan of the map design in eternal

[RanCorX2]

i can't be the only one who upon reaching the end of the game thought doom 2016 maps were much better?

things i liked

the uac based areas

the weapons

the demon details

level details


things i didn't like;

swinging from the monkey beams

wall climbing

boosting through the air to reach a platform, wall or ledge

buff demons

the chainsaw (again)

urdak

the bosses


hated all the swinging and climbing crap that runed the flow of action...was like playing jedi fallen order which i vowed to not do a 2nd playthrough once finished due to the sh*t level design.

why couldn't id just kept it climbing ledges and leave it as that? the best things about classic fps games is the flow of action, you just blitz through and feel great.......but in eternal it's shoot, shoot, do some circus stuff and then shoot shoot. annoying as f.

[rambley enjoyer 73]

Eh, I found the platforming in Eternal to be a good way of keeping the player engaged in downtime between fights. 2016 had an issue where once the fight was over, you would do nothing but walk around to find the next one or some extremely basic puzzle solving. Eternal’s platforming also allows for more variation in height without excessive use of elevators or things you have to wait for.

[HighLanderPony]

I liked it and prefer it to 2016. That was all super cereal and gloomy, this is more light-hearted, arcadey, with more stuff to do. Things are also better conveyed and the player is better funneled the right way. Secrets were more fun to find and I found myself wondering around for a long time a lot less. The pacing was tighter and the action was kept up more. The added mobility is really fun as well.

[RanCorX2]

i don't know, feel free to change my mind though. The whole point of killing everything was to then move to the next area though, having to do all the acrobat stuff just adds frustration imo.

in a shooter i just want to run around and shoot on foot with the occasional jump to a platform or ledge to reach a button or secret.

in eternal it's like they just added stuff from various other games just for the sake of it, like how ubi added all the rpg crap in breakpoint because they thought that's what everyone wants.

[Umrite]

Yeah i find eternal's campaign a dissapointment.

[HighLanderPony]

Originally posted by RanCorX2:

i don't know, feel free to change my mind though. The whole point of killing everything was to then move to the next area though, having to do all the acrobat stuff just adds frustration imo.

in a shooter i just want to run around and shoot on foot with the occasional jump to a platform or ledge to reach a button or secret.

in eternal it's like they just added stuff from various other games just for the sake of it, like how ubi added all the rpg crap in breakpoint because they thought that's what everyone wants.

It isn't just about running and shooting any more. Even Quake never was that simple. Movement is important which this game puts more emphasis on than 2016.

[RanCorX2]

quake was nothing like doom eternal though, yes movement has always been important in fps games but when they add what they did in eternal it just doesn't feel right. maybe i'm just in a small minority now, because everyone seems to lap up games no matter the quality these days.

and when you try and voice your opinion everyone just says the it's better this way.

but saying that makes it sound like all the old games are garbage, when they aren't.

it seems one can't complain about anything anymore....don't know why i bothered because my opinions are obviously worth jack.

[HighLanderPony]

Originally posted by RanCorX2:

quake was nothing like doom eternal though, yes movement has always been important in fps games but when they add what they did in eternal it just doesn't feel right. maybe i'm just in a small minority now, because everyone seems to lap up games no matter the quality these days.

and when you try and voice your opinion everyone just says the it's better this way.

but saying that makes it sound like all the old games are garbage, when they aren't.

it seems one can't complain about anything anymore....don't know why i bothered because my opinions are obviously worth jack.

Not like DE is a bad game...

Yes, people can disagree with your opinion, just like how you can voice your opinion, they can voice theirs. That's how it works, nothing malicious about it.

Of course not all the old games are garbage. DE is so good because it has some of that old school feel to it and some of that design.

You can complain, others can agree or disagree, that's how discussion works.

[Salamand3r-]

Originally posted by RanCorX2:

quake was nothing like doom eternal though, yes movement has always been important in fps games but when they add what they did in eternal it just doesn't feel right. maybe i'm just in a small minority now, because everyone seems to lap up games no matter the quality these days.

and when you try and voice your opinion everyone just says the it's better this way.

but saying that makes it sound like all the old games are garbage, when they aren't.

it seems one can't complain about anything anymore....don't know why i bothered because my opinions are obviously worth jack.

Not better, but evolutionary.

The key to top-level play in Quake and to an extent in Quake 2 was strafejumping, rocket/nade jumping, and other advanced movement mechanics. And yes, even in single player, and not just for speedruns.

I agree totally that it's different, and that some won't like it, but it's a clear evolution and not really a departure.

And let's not forget platformin (without a jump, instead relying on janky momentum physics) existed in classic Doom. If anyone wants an easy example to refresh their memory, just replay the original Icon of Sin fight in Doom 2.

[Kyller92 AKA Cinos]

I loved Doom 2016, but the level design is, in my opinion, the weakest point of the game. It started great though, Foundry and Argent Facility are my favorite level of the game and probably among my favorites in the Doom games. But it's thanks to their non-linear structure and good use of the backtracking. After those levels however, the maps become more and more linear, and just arena after arena.
And this is where I disagree. 2016 become really repetitive near the end. The environnements are the same, the combat loop is the same, the musics are the same, and even several arenas are the same. Eternal, even if not everyone like what Id did, at least tried to shake things up, add some gimmicks, add more environnements.

Incidentally, several things you said aren't related to the map design. I think you're just among those who didn't like platforming in Eternal. Also, explain more what do you mean here :

Originally posted by RanCorX2:

the best things about classic fps games is the flow of action, you just blitz through and feel great.......but in eternal it's shoot, shoot, do some circus stuff and then shoot shoot. annoying as f.

If I understand this correctly, I think you have some misconceptions about classic FPS games, but again, I'm not sure about what you tried to say.

[GrimRJak]

As huge set pieces they look awsome though with being so big come with it's downsides,mainly you can barely explore them with being so linear blocked by invisable walls;Wide ocean,little depth.

If only Doom Eternal had level design like a metroid game.

[lk]

The boss fights were a step down from 2016. The Icon of Sin I thought was a tedious fight.

[Salamand3r-]

Originally posted by lk:

The boss fights were a step down from 2016. The Icon of Sin I thought was a tedious fight.

I have no opinion tbh - both have their ups and downs.

What's funny is that for the past four years I've been watching people complain how trash the bossfights in D16 are.

It just goes to show...some psychological concept or other :D

[TMAC Blade]

I thought the bosses were better than the original. It's a hell of a lot better than the old shoot it until it dies concept. Yeah I know it's fun to just have a simple boss like the cyber demon but I fee like the game needed to get past what it already had done in 2016. Why make a sequal if it's going to be a rehash of the last game.

[Eze]

Doom 2016 maps are superior in cohesion and ambience, Doom eternal sacrificed all that for the sake of flow of combat in Arenas. I can understand what you don't like, but such things had a purpose in this game design.

[IMMORPOSETHING]

Like I get it, more gameplay, only caring about gameplay...
So theyve focused on it harder then anything else...
cause relatively speaking:
details-doesnt matter
Pacing-doesnt matter
Half believable art style-doesnt matter
Story-matter?? What??

I mean it gets to the point demon killing isnt as matter as it was.
Its not a power fantasy anymore, it doesnt matter if youre good at the game or not, its just a game.
And whats the motivation to play the game? Well I dont find them in the game.