Flop of the year ?

[adam west]

i don't normally say bad things about games i don't like what I'm currently seeing and wait for release and stuff, but after the HDR fiasco from previous game,the completely unoptimized geothermal valley (that has no reason to be processing heavy) we have the new fiasco from RTX performance (wich i don't care, didn't look all that great and early adopters pave the way)

but now this demo :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnNIS5C4t7E&lc=z22mg3qwrpnishhbk04t1aokgtfs4rlsykba2rwvizmprk0h00410.1535250187076478

look at the water "physics", she flies in the water (no hair dynamic as well) and when she dives she suddenly stops as if she was in jello (while i believe this to be the camera work at fault) still......original tomb raider from DOS did this better on the "huge" 3 mb demo at the time. this was almost 20 ago !

does anyone think they will fix this in a few weeks or that they would bring to games-con a demo that doesn't have basic interaction ? i guess RTX pressured on team made them prioritize it to release but, its not like this is a new thing !

even the fan made remake of tomb raider 2 demo does this better and the guy worked on it ALONE !

i was going to wait and see, but now im skipping this game completely specially if i don't hear she uses the pistols by the end and i mean USE it, not just get it, we already got them in the 2013 reboot.

PS: i hope the next game, if this one doesn't tank the franchise is made by someone else then CD , we need new ideas and in a new engine, the interactions on this engine feel to gamey mechanic,like you magnetic connect to things, i recommend anyone who never tried the classics to play the demo from the very first TR, after you get used to tank camera control, see how fluid lara interact with environments on leaps, grabs etc.

i'm tired of CD "fragile" lara, first it was all where is muh muuuuuuhhm,now its where is ma daaaaaad, you are an adult for crying out loud !
also stop explaining everything, the fun thing about the original TR is that we were given glimpses of lara backstory (because at the time game story telling didn't matter much, true) but because of this people filled in the gaps, so lara was different to everyone,full of theories were discussed online etc.
bring this back,make her backstory sprinkled through titles instead of trying to tell it all in a single game, background environmental story telling especially in a exploration game is great, just look at skyrim,dead souls and even the new god of war.

[15543641354361]

amen

[dodge_flor]

no

[adam west]

Originally posted by YEFF:

no

Great opinion,thank you for sharing with the rest of us.

[adam west]

Originally posted by AC:

https://youtu.be/JZfYC3VoaV8 list:
#15 - Late embargo
#14 - No review copies
#13 - Bad reaction to announcement ✓
#12 - Little pre-release coverage
#11 - Low key announcement ✓
#10 - Not clear about content ✓
#09 - Pre-release footage not showing gameplay
#08 - Multiple delays
#07 - Franchise fatigue ✓
#06 - New direction for series ✓
#05 - New developers ✓
#04 - Licensed game
#03 - Free-to-play mechanics in paid games ✓
#02 - Bad targeting ✓
#01 - Forced gimmicks

i would excuse them on 11, i prefer they invest less in marketing and more in the game that way the game doesnt need to sell as much copies to make a profit, we dont want tomb raider underworld to repeat itself, where the game was market as hell (with paid money from microsoft), and enix went nuts with market i even saw a bus with lara, then complained it had low sales because it didnt met its goal.

[adam west]

Originally posted by AC:

Originally posted by adam west:

i would excuse them on 11, i prefer they invest less in marketing and more in the game that way the game doesnt need to sell as much copies to make a profit, we dont want tomb raider underworld to repeat itself, where the game was market as hell (with paid money from microsoft), and enix went nuts with market i even saw a bus with lara, then complained it had low sales because it didnt met its goal.

but the thing is, they didn't invest less in marketing...

"In an interview with GamesIndustry.biz, Eidos Montreal boss David Anfossi said Shadow of the Tomb Raider cost $75 to $100m to develop, but that's just production. Slap another $35m on top of that for promotion. So, in total, Square Enix is looking at splashing out up to $135m on the new Tomb Raider."

source: https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2018-05-12-shadow-of-the-tomb-raider-costs-usd75-usd100m-to-make

if those numbers are true this is the last tomb raider, underworld had fan loyalty,hype and even newcomers to the series made 1.5 million sales more then any TR game being on 3 plataforms and underperformed.

i doubt this game sell as much.

[koji]

think i'll pass on this one it was a fun time the last 2 TR's but im just not feeling it for this one

[adam west]

Originally posted by AC:

I can already see them with "the game sold poorly because of Spider-Man" excuse like they did in Rise release. Some still believe that Rise sold poorly because Fallout 4. That's not true, the game sold poorly because it wasn't really that good.
Another excuse was the Microsoft deal, being console exclusive isn't an excuse either, look at successful games like Uncharted, Horizon or any other console exclusive. Rise of the Tomb Raider had poor sales because is was a mediocre game. Simple as that.

it also doesn't help that enix keep pushing lara as a big game against stronger competitors, they should do like Hollywood is doing, previously months that were considered for garbage movies dump because of no competition are now being used to big tent poles because......no competition.....games typically releases during kids school vacation and holidays,release them without competition,people don't just buy on vacation or breaks.

[dmitry07]

Originally posted by adam west:

it also doesn't help that enix keep pushing lara as a big game against stronger competitors

Apparently, the SE has a distorted perception of reality.

[_MaZ_TeR_]

Originally posted by AC:

I can allready see them with "the game sold poorly because of Spider-Man" excuse like they did in Rise release. Some still believe that Rise sold poorly because Fallout 4. That's not true, the game sold poorly because it wasn't really that good.
Another excuse was the Microsoft deal, being console exclusive isn't an excuse either, look at sucessfull games like Uncharted, Horizon or any other console exclusive. Rise of the Tomb Raider had poor sales because it was a mediocre game. Simple as that.

Wrong. Rise sold poorly because they had the game available only on Xbox One the first 5 or 6 months, until the PC version was released at the beginning of 2016 and later that year, on PS4 with the 20YO Anniversary Edition.

This game will be on Xbox, PS and PC launching all at the same time.

[_MaZ_TeR_]

Originally posted by AC:

Originally posted by _MaZ_TeR_:

Wrong. Rise sold poorly because they had the game available only on Xbox One the first 5 or 6 months, until the PC version was released at the beginning of 2016 and later that year, on PS4 with the 20YO Anniversary Edition.

This game will be on Xbox, PS and PC launching all at the same time.

!? did you even read my post?

You said that it didn't so well because it "wasn't that good". That is wrong. The only and ONLY reason it sold so poorly was because of the Xbox deal. The game's literally a carbon copy of Uncharted. I've never heard of anything like this with that franchise and the fourth game sold just well

[J4MESOX4D]

I absolutely loved Rise of the Tomb Raider but I'm just not excited by this one. Not even the glitzy Nvidia presentation can interest me. This may be a similar situation for Square Enix like they had with Deus Ex Mankind Divided. The game does look quite mediocre especially compared to Spiderman and Red Dead Redemption and it wouldn't surprise me if we're talking 50% off in the Steam winter sale due to poor sales on all systems.

[Michel Michel (aka Teen-H)]

Originally posted by AC:

Originally posted by _MaZ_TeR_:

You said that it didn't so well because it "wasn't that good". That is wrong. The only and ONLY reason it sold so poorly was because of the Xbox deal. The game's literally a carbon copy of Uncharted. I've never heard of anything like this with that franchise and the fourth game sold just well

but... isn't that what I just said in my post? the fact that Rise was exclusive for consoles isn't an excuse to the poor sales, because exclusive games, like Uncharted, sell well on a single console. Rise sold poorly because it isn't that good.

And side note, before you come up with the argument that PS4 sold more than Xbox One, Rise was a cross platform game, it was released on Xbox 360 and Xbox One at the same time, and still didn't sell well.

If Ubisoft releases a game only on the Xbox, it wouldn't sell that well. It would be the same situation for every third party developper. The deal with Microsoft was stupid. Also, PS4 exclusives are on another level. No game comes close to the level of quality of a game like God Of War, Horizon or Uncharted. Sony's first party studios are above the competition.

[miKi]

Originally posted by AC:

Originally posted by _MaZ_TeR_:

You said that it didn't so well because it "wasn't that good". That is wrong. The only and ONLY reason it sold so poorly was because of the Xbox deal. The game's literally a carbon copy of Uncharted. I've never heard of anything like this with that franchise and the fourth game sold just well

but... isn't that what I just said in my post? the fact that Rise was exclusive for consoles isn't an excuse to the poor sales, because exclusive games, like Uncharted, sell well on a single console. Rise sold poorly because it isn't that good.

And side note, before you come up with the argument that PS4 sold more than Xbox One, Rise was a cross platform game, it was released on Xbox 360 and Xbox One at the same time, and still didn't sell well.

Can we take into account than that the Xbox has less systems sold than the PS4 by a large margin so that actually makes sense that less people bought it on xbox? Cause the sales spiked the moment ps4 and PC got their copy released. They already said they weren't worried about spiderman mainly because yes its being released on all three systems at once, while spiderman has a single platform.

the only time it could suffer from this is everyone waiting to play spiderman, however, it has the pc and the xbox to bolster that a little bit, it also releases a week after. Will it get the titan fall treatment? maybe, maybe not. Wont really matter either way because this is the end to the origin story. So all in all, the game will sell well and we will probably see the next game with a new chapter for lara, or it will sell not so well but we will still enjoy it anyways.

[_MaZ_TeR_]

Originally posted by AC:

Originally posted by _MaZ_TeR_:

You said that it didn't so well because it "wasn't that good". That is wrong. The only and ONLY reason it sold so poorly was because of the Xbox deal. The game's literally a carbon copy of Uncharted. I've never heard of anything like this with that franchise and the fourth game sold just well

but... isn't that what I just said in my post? the fact that Rise was exclusive for consoles isn't an excuse to the poor sales, because exclusive games, like Uncharted, sell well on a single console. Rise sold poorly because it isn't that good.

And side note, before you come up with the argument that PS4 sold more than Xbox One, Rise was a cross platform game, it was released on Xbox 360 and Xbox One at the same time, and still didn't sell well.

No it wasn't what you said exactly. You said it was mainly because the game wasn't that good. Which is incorrect.

Of course 360 didn't help the sales because I guarantee nobody wants a game like that spesifically made for current gen consoles on some old toaster which probably looks like something out of the PS2 era. Also, it had been 3 years since Xbox One/PS4 were released back then, most had switched from 360 to current gen by that time when buying non-multiplayer games.

The fact is that unfortunatly Xbox doesn't have as big of a playerbase to support any exclusives which do not have a backbone built around its old installments, such as Halo, which is for a lot of people the one and only reason to even buy an Xbox, let alone Xbone. If they want to buy anything like Tomb Raider, they'll get it for PS4, even if it's for them to wait a year.

I don't wonder why the reason is, Microsoft were clueless with their products the last few years until this year when they announced Halo: Infinite and bunch of other exclusives and studios.

Maybe once Xbox: Scarlett releases, perhaps then the next Tomb Raider game following this one could easily meet its sales expectations, even as a limited time exclusive.

[Mike Pence But Even Gayer]

Yeah, this series has done horribly.
Oh wait, the reboot thus far is sitting at around 15 million units sold, putting it right in-line with the original series, which was one of the most popular of the generation.