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doubt you guys actually legit did the challenge, not the x24 one, for sure. there's really no skill involved in this caper, devs just put up "custom difficulty", coming up with this idea of "what if someone could do a game with all them fancy sliders we added to our game cranked up to the max, and also with all objectives and ghost photo, would be diabolical innit m8s?" and slapped a CHALLENGE sticker on it, (with trophies coming along i guess). they really did not think much about balancing (or even the possibility of this, imo), they didn't even try to make it more reasonable to be deemed as a challenge, because the state of this thing is very raw. there's not enough mechanics in this game to create "the most challenging difficulty" that would be more reliant on skill than luck. Zero evidence is a cool challenge, yeah, i like this idea. zero evidence + 0 sanity? hmm yeah doable, why not, even cooler. zero evidence + 0 sanity + 150% ghost speed? ummmm maybe? if the cards fall right. the above and 25% player speed? no, thanks, that's just a noise of difficulty sliders adding up, creating a mess of a difficulty in my opinion. see, theres not much you can do with those sliders to create a proper difficulty setting that is not over the top. its like the game starts to fall apart at some point. again, thats just my opinion anyway because maybe someone does like this craziness, hope you get my point. i did the x24 myself twice just to make it clear, i got lucky with revenant the first time. also whats this "the way it was envisioned by devs"/"the way it was meant to be played" mean? a rhetorical question i guess...
by saying playing it the way it was meant to is just me saying stop loading and resetting until you get the objectives you want. Load into the game and play it. Pretty sure the devs weren't thinking about loading and quitting until you get what you want for objectives. Also if you can just enter in and find the ghost room while surviving the hunts and getting say the crucifix objective that isn't luck in my mind that is skill and knowing how to play the game
I hate this dumb mechanic of "waiting" for the ghost to do something, it's pointless and it just inflates the game's length by making you wait more, I hope they change that...
They could do it like other games were it doesn't take THAT long for the ghost to do something if you place stuff in its room. Why make the players wait if the player already knows the ghost room is there? it's dumb!
Might be worth to take a look into YT-content creators tries on that. Skill is definitely what you need here to open up the possibilities to win the game and even though they still die multiple times, they can beat the challenge somewhat consistently.
Though it might also be helpful for you to evaluate, how worth the trophy would be to you. If you don't think, that the grind would be worth the effort, then simply just don't grind for it for longer than your psyche can handle. No matter what you think, but others are less impressed by the golden trophy than you might think as of now.
If you don't want to wait for the ghost to do something, then it might be time for you to get active yourself. Revenants are one of the easiest ghosts to identify through a hunt, so next time, while waiting for the evidences, also consider other measures to detect the ghost type.
And i hope, that they don't change the evidence-gathering mechanic too much. Obviously bringing some more consistency into the book and getting rid of orb bugs would be great, but beyond that it feels quite right as of now. It takes long enough, that it rewards people who use ghost behavior as secondary evidence, but not so long, that it's impossible for beginners to find some stuff (obviously expecting beginners to play game modes without changing ghost rooms, but whoever overestimates their abilities and starts to play professional without being able to verify ghost room changes properly should be penalized with harder to gather evidence)
This is the closest to the kind advice I was looking for, so it's appreciated, though I was already studying Insym's successful runs of x24 on SM. It would be lengthy to deconstruct his runs here, but the short story is that he did get lucky AND it required a lot of performative skill on his part. I think where people get hung up is on the fact that the player skill will matter eventually, but not before a lot of things beyond your control fall into place. Insym even reset when he got the crucifix objective, saying he needed objectives that were possible, but he also needed a ghost type that could be identified at x24 difficulty, and a ghost room close enough to hear its hunting footsteps in order to have a successful run.
Which addresses this. While this is true for normal difficulties, and probably still true for most small/medium maps, it can become impossible at x24 difficulty on Sunny Meadows depending on factors you can't control.
-For an Onryo, the only test involves getting a candle and a crucifix into the ghost room. For x24 difficulty, I imagine you'd need both, since after the third blow out the Onryo will hunt, and without a crucifix you'd instantly die due to the missing grace period. Depending on where the ghost room is, it could be impossible to get there alive at 50% speed even with two smudge sticks, much less with a candle or crucifix in your hand. And you need enough smudge sticks to escape back to the van as well.
-For Goryo, you would need a ghost room close enough to a hiding space where you could reliably hear whether or not it roams, but what could sound like a Goryo might be a ghost that just didn't happen to roam much, or perhaps roamed out of audible range, so it's down to a blind guess. And again, making a guess relies on having a favorable ghost room, otherwise it's impossible to witness its behavior.
-To do a Shade test, you'd ultimately have no option but to guess, since being sure while staying safe would be impossible. If you're lucky enough to have accessible hiding close enough to the ghost room to experience ghost events, you could possibly see a higher frequency of shadow-type events, but it's both extremely unlikely to have that privilege, and also not fool-proof. If you have accessible hiding close enough to the ghost room that you can hear a lower frequency of interactions, then you could be given a hint that way, but the ghost could have just roamed out of audible range, or it might be a ghost that decides not to interact often, or its room may have little to interact with. And again, it needs a ghost room that you can hear from hiding, meaning it's still chance-dependent either way. The only surefire way to do a Shade test is to stand inside the ghost room and see if it stops hunting, which is effectively the same as just guessing Shade and leaving in the van, since if it isn't a Shade, you're guaranteed to die during the test due to the 0 grace period.
-For Mare, there's almost nothing you can observe. Mares will roam from a room with lights on (impossible with a broken breaker) and have altered hunting sanity thresholds when lights are on or off (impossible without lights and impossible when at 0% sanity, both of which are forced at x24 difficulty). They'll also do more light-breaking ghost events, but having hiding so close to the ghost room that you'll be able to witness any ghost event at all is absurdly unlikely, and more to the point, not within the player's control.
-With a Jinn, there is no observable behavior, since the breaker cannot be turned on. It can't use its ability, and it can't speed up when far from the player. It's a blank ghost.
-For Yurei, you'd need hiding where you can see a door, and also that door needs to be close enough to the ghost room that it's inside its interaction range, which is already very unlikely. If it's TOO close to the ghost room, though, you may need to smudge every time it hunts while you wait for the Yurei to use its ability, and you only get 4 smudges before you're forced to abandon the test.
-And for Obake, you need to get lucky and witness it transform during a hunt. I was lucky enough to find a place where the ghost would get stuck trying to kill me, meaning I could lure it over with electronics and watch for its transformation ability during nearly the entirety of its hunting period, but if you were to do this "as developers intended", you'd need to get lucky and see the ghost transform during one of the four approximately 6 second intervals of invulnerability you get by smudging during a hunt. You may get more time to watch if you can see it come down a hall towards you, but that's only 1-2 extra seconds of a 60 second hunt total. And again, that's assuming that the ghost room is actually close enough to accessible hiding that it can reach you during a hunt while still leaving you the ability to escape.
If I'm wrong about any of those ghost behaviors, or if I've forgotten any, I'd like to know. As far as I understand, though, those are ghost types that either require lucky starting RNG to get hints at, or which are just impossible to confirm with 100% certainty altogether.
I still don't understand this. As far as I was aware, doing it the way I was is necessary for the trophy, which would mean that it is the way the developers intended. Was I doing something that wasn't required?
And finally, as far as I could tell, "=THB= DewRitozz" had the most accurate and comprehensive responses, but I worry people dismissed those messages because of the flippant and derogatory tone.
It also requires you to pretty much know every single tiny detail and hidden mechanic of how the game works.
As it stands now, every ghost and every objective are completable in the apocalypse challenge, but it requires you to pretty much never be in a position that puts you at risk without a guaranteed escape and that over potentially pretty long periods of time and is especially difficult given for a lot of things you need to be in close-ish proximity to the ghost.
And I guess there's still like 20% randomness involved, but that's not much different from regular phasmo, it's just that doing the apocalypse challenge you have nearly no way to react to and escape a bad situation, your only option is to preemtively avoid them entirely.
I do think despite everything it is possible for the x24 apocalypse challenge to be completed somewhat consistently, but only if you have completely and fully mastered the game and all the unique scenarios this challenge brings.
Well, success may not be totally completely hinging on pure randomness in theory, but in practice the requirements for a player to be able to successfully mitigate and work around the randomness are absolutely ridiculous and can not reasonably be expected for a person to be willing to put up with.
Completing this challenge either requires full mastery of every skill there is in the game, or getting lucky on multiple fronts at once. Honestly I find this a rather good state for a challenge because either alternative would be much worse. If it really only took luck this challenge would be impossible to get good at, but if it was only completable by fully mastering the game there would be absolutely no hope of ever being able to complete it for a gigantic portion of the playerbase.
And on top of it, reducing the difficulty requirements would just make the trophy pretty much worthless. Obviously the challenge expects you to die over and over again, until you've refined your knowledge about the mode so good, that you get better at detecting specific things and avoiding some other bad decisions. After all it's a challenge, not a meaningless collectible^^
without reseting or dying. The Apocalypse difficulty however is very unlikely that you can keep beating it even if you are skilled without reseting or dying or even getting the guess for the ghost wrong.
And unless someone shows me someone starting up phasmo beating Apocalypse then hopping right back into another round right after and pulling it off again and again multiple times, you can't convince me that skill is more important than luck.