Rethinking the Phasmopobia gameloop

[Rex Bellator]

Right now Phasmophobia has a very predictable gameplay loop, even after this recent patch: you buy equipment, you scope the house out, you collect evidence until either a) you die b) you identify the ghost; rinse repeat.

IMHO I think the gameplay loop needs to be rethought. This will naturally be controversial for those who believe that the gameplay loop IS Phasmophoba and all I can say is: that is the surefire way to make sure Phasmophobia never grows or becomes more interesting.

Now with two new ghosts, buying/re-buying new equipment is really becoming redundant especially because identifying ghosts now requires these pieces of equipment and if you don't have them you're effectively locked out of identifying them (assuming they work in the first place... looking at you DOTS projector).

Moreover, the game has a systems that aren't really being fully utilized. The whole voice recognition aspect is only used (to my knowledge) for the spirit box/Ouija board and ghosts recognizing their name. But once you get any kind of voice on the spirit box that's it, you're done. What if there were more?

Anyway, I think Phasmophobia needs two big rethinks:

All equipment should be free, yes free. Every truck should come with all the equipment necessary to detect ghosts (with the possible exception of the wearable headsets). It doesn't make sense that ghost hunters, amateur or otherwise, would forgo the very equipment necessary to detect the thing they're after.

Instead make dying the penalty based on difficulty. If you die on Amateur you lose 200 dollars; if you die on Intermediate it's $500; if you die on Professional it's $1500. (these numbers could be placeholders, and can be adjusted based on balance).

This will disincentivize hosts paying all the equipment upfront while making sure people who join games have a stake in not dying. Right now, being a team member with no equipment basically means you get to take chances and if you die no biggie.

This death penalty should coincide then with a new evidence-based system that gives you rewards for each type of evidence collected with a new expanded list of evidence you can collect, like say, ectoplasm, gaseous emanations, electrical discharges, and any other type of ghostly phenomenon that have been encountered irl.

And finally instead of this binary "GHOST ANGRY" mode that we have now, where the ghost is either docile or a murderous fiend, the idea is as a team you're trying to EXCITE the ghost into a certain range of excited-ness and this can vary from ghost to ghost as a form of identification; don't excite the ghost enough and they remain dormant; excite them too much and they get violent.

The idea is you're trying to excite them JUST enough to get the evidence you're tryng to collect. This way it becomes a team-based balancing act, where everyone is involved trying to get the ghost to manifest without being violent.

Coincide this with a new tool: the PK Meter. Since psycho-kinetic energy is fictional we'll just assume it uses something like a range of 1000-10,000 PKE. A Ghost like a spirit might be a low-PK ghost, say 1500 PKE.

And you excite the ghost by using the spirit box or ouija board. Asking different questions can get different reactions. Each ghost can have a "profile" - a revenant for example may be a murder victim or - asking them how they died will cause a bigger reaction than a more docile ghost.

But you don't want to overdo it, if you push a low-energy ghost from, say a sweet spot of PKE 1500 into 3000 it becomes violent, therefore you now need to use equipment like smudge sticks, salt, etc.. to calm it down to a lower PK state.

Suddenly now you have this gameplay tension that would make for an interesting ghost hunting game.

Of course this is all theorycrafting and I don't pretend this behavior would be easy to implement programming-wise but I hope the developer takes this into consideration to make the game more varied in the future.

[hansmolleman33]

You're over thinking....almost every games has a ''gameloop''.

[Abcsam]

This game is fun for all of 30 mins then its done.

[Deejudanne]

i find it weird how we never do anything about the ghost, just figure out what kind of ghost it is and yeet even if it kills our teammates

[Rex Bellator]

Originally posted by hansmolleman33:

You're over thinking....almost every games has a ''gameloop''.

and you're underthinking lol and your whole point about gameloops is a non sequitur, because I never claimed otherwise.

[Jimmy Hunter]

Originally posted by Deejudanne:

i find it weird how we never do anything about the ghost, just figure out what kind of ghost it is and yeet even if it kills our teammates

Store page clearly states we're the team that's hired to determine what the ghost is so a proper team goes in to remove the ghost.

This game is designed around the idea of simulating a ghost investigation that isn't chasing dust like all those crappy reality TV shows.

[Rex Bellator]

Originally posted by Jimmy Hunter:

Originally posted by Deejudanne:

i find it weird how we never do anything about the ghost, just figure out what kind of ghost it is and yeet even if it kills our teammates

Store page clearly states we're the team that's hired to determine what the ghost is so a proper team goes in to remove the ghost.

This game is designed around the idea of simulating a ghost investigation that isn't chasing dust like all those crappy reality TV shows.

That's a distinction without a difference. Ghost hunting in this game is based on those crappy shows. Considering you already do look for/find evidence like the bone/ouija/voodoo doll, you're refuting your own point.

[Something Hank]

I actually really agree with the free equipment thing. Like, after a certain skill level, money is just redundant; Add All, if you die, buy them back. It's just a nothing system.

Load the truck up with ALL the equipment, and find something -else- to do with money/just get rid of it and incentivize objectives some other way.

[Emily Mewens]

I dont think it needs to be rethought or rebuilt. I think it needs to be expanded upon. As it is right now, its bare bones. The loop itself is perfectly fine. But games that rely solely on their gameplay loop are doomed to fail. There needs to be more meat.

As ive said before, and i'll bloody say it again. Its damn silly that we go in to piss ghosts off just to identify them. There needs to be more of a reason to do what we're doing. Ghost Hunters Corp's answer to this was exorcising the ghost. I think Phasmophobia would benifit from something similar.

Otherwise though, KISS principle is king.

[Emily Mewens]

Originally posted by Something Hank:

I actually really agree with the free equipment thing. Like, after a certain skill level, money is just redundant; Add All, if you die, buy them back. It's just a nothing system.

Load the truck up with ALL the equipment, and find something -else- to do with money/just get rid of it and incentivize objectives some other way.

I can counter this really easily.
My two team-mates cant do feck all without dying atleast twice during our sessions. That means that Im the one that takes up the responsibility of bringing just about everything we need in.

Now, its all fine and doodly. I dont die, and havent died since i first started playing, and we play strictly pro. Hell i even play solo on occasion and have yet to die.
But when im bringing in upwards of around 1k worth of goods, and only have 6k sitting in the bank. Dying is still a very big deal, especially on pro when all of that is literally gone.

Sure i can buy it all back, but if i have a particularly bad session where i just die repeatedly, i'll be totally wiped out within 6 deaths. And its that thought that keeps me incredibly cautious and on edge.

[Boogie]

So, if everything is free, what purpose would the money serve? Losing $1000? Who cares, everything is free. Losing money would be meaningless.

There already is a balance. The threat would be exactly the same, a hunt. Creating this balance really would not change much at all. Maybe just hunting less frequently? That's not really a rework of anything. You can make it through games without the ghost hunting as it is, depending on the ghost and your behaviour. This just seems like a lot of words, that won't really have any impact on the game.

I don't, and have never liked the idea of exorcising the ghost. Thankfully the team doesn't either. There are games that offer that, Phasmo doesn't need to follow suit.

I think the story and background needs to be built up more about each ghost, and how they died etc. I think the base game is great and there will only be new things added and expanded upon and I think they are going in the right direction.

[Something Hank]

Originally posted by Emily Mewens:

I can counter this really easily.
My two team-mates cant do feck all without dying atleast twice during our sessions. That means that Im the one that takes up the responsibility of bringing just about everything we need in.

Now, its all fine and doodly. I dont die, and havent died since i first started playing, and we play strictly pro. Hell i even play solo on occasion and have yet to die.
But when im bringing in upwards of around 1k worth of goods, and only have 6k sitting in the bank. Dying is still a very big deal, especially on pro when all of that is literally gone.

Sure i can buy it all back, but if i have a particularly bad session where i just die repeatedly, i'll be totally wiped out within 6 deaths. And its that thought that keeps me incredibly cautious and on edge.

If that threat alone is enough to keep your edge up, then I suppose that's a nice thing. But I still am gonna say that the money system needs to be completely retooled/balanced, or just gotten rid of. It's not like people need some kind of progression system to play Phasmophobia. Hell, the game doesn't even have a win condition.

[LeL'Rathlor]

Randomizing mission objectives and having house rooms shift to new locations connected to the house would help

[Rex Bellator]

Originally posted by Emily Mewens:

I dont think it needs to be rethought or rebuilt. I think it needs to be expanded upon. As it is right now, its bare bones. The loop itself is perfectly fine. But games that rely solely on their gameplay loop are doomed to fail. There needs to be more meat.

As ive said before, and i'll bloody say it again. Its damn silly that we go in to piss ghosts off just to identify them. There needs to be more of a reason to do what we're doing. Ghost Hunters Corp's answer to this was exorcising the ghost. I think Phasmophobia would benifit from something similar.

Otherwise though, KISS principle is king.

Rebuilt or expanded upon is really semantics. I think we agree more than we disagree. I absolutely agree angering ghosts for the sake of identifying them is silly, but that's why I offered my idea of having to excite the ghost to a certain level for detection but doing so risks pushing it over the edge.

I would absolutely welcome an exorcism mechanic in Phasmo for sure though.

[Myth Alric]

You get all the equipment needed to identify the ghost for free already. Everything you buy is either extras or tools to help.

[Abcsam]

What is there to think about you go find X then you run back in forth to put stuff around x then you solve for x. this game is so predictable its lame. THere is no lets get good its alll about te jump scares.