SIEGE = MOST UNBALANCED MAP EVER

[nelnel]

Seriously. WHAT, THE FRACK WAS VALVE THINKING.

Start as T = insta win

[Panhead]

they didn't make it.

[DClocked]

op is not very constructive. i vote for a ban. he's fanning flames.

[kN0SPE]

nah it s fine

[nelnel]

I didn't saying that Valve made it, point is. Why did Valve add it?

[Panhead]

It was a highly rated community map. blame the community.

[kN0SPE]

Цитата допису Panhead360:

It was a highly rated community map. blame the community.

right blame thousands of players. just because you had a bad game on this map.

[Maverik770]

For those who are uneducated in CS history: Cs_siege was the very first map EVER created for Counter-Strike back in the very, very first Alpha version. Counter-Strike was made as a mod by a single Half-Life player named Gooseman. When he first released the very first Counter-Strike Alpha version, the ONLY map was cs_siege, it used normal Half-Life character models and had ONLY 2 guns: The M4A1 (Not Silenced) & AK-47, nothing else.

At this point in time a mod called "Action half-Life" was the most popular mod for Half-Life and outnumbered CS servers 20 to 1. I kid you not. We literally would go onto Action Half-Life servers and beg people to come check out this new mod called "Counter-Strike", claiming to them it was the best mod/game ever and that it was going to take over. People in the Action Half-Life servers would ♥♥♥♥♥ us out and tell us Counter-Strike sucked and that no one would ever play it. Gee look at what happened after that... The rest is history.

But back on point. Cs_Siege has ALWAYS been a T sided map ever since this very first incarnation of it. In fact, the new community made version (Which you are now playing in Bravo pack) is very faithfully designed according to the original map design. Cs_siege continued as the ONLY CS map pretty far into Beta development before other classics such as cs_assault and cs_mansion were added. Shortly after those maps came the bomb defusal mode and with it the first "de_" map which was de_dust.

The thing is that with the way Competitive Ranked matches work now in GO, it does NOT matter how 1 sided a map is. Each team gets to play an equal number of rounds on each side: Terrorist and Counter-Terrorist. There is NO disadvantage to playing as CT or T first on ANY of the maps. So what if the map is T sided? You will get the exact same turn as Terrorists as your opponents did.

You want a perfect example? We played a cs_siege match last night and started out as Terrorists. We won 14 out of the 15 matches and the Half ended with us up 14-1. We then switched to CT and proceeded to get rolled for 15 straight rounds! The match ended with us losing 15-14!

So yes, the map is horribly unbalanced in Terrorist's favor. But does that really matter in Competitive Mode? NO! Not at all. Competitive mode is completely fair. It does not matter which side you play first! Both teams will get the same opportunities and have the same chances. If you start as CT first you just need to be patient. And if you can't be patient through 15 tough rounds then play a different game!

To answer your original question of why did Valve add Siege? As I said, it's the ORIGINAL CS map. They added it to do a fan service to long term fans of the game.

[Racuch Zawodowiec]

I personally think that Siege is one of the most beautiful and deatiled maps i have ever seen in GO. It's not like you have to play all matches alias CT and also keep in mind that you have plenty of ways to get to hostages and you need to grab ONLY one of them. i remember siege in 1.6..of course it was way different but having to escort those dumb hostages in here was so much of a challenge that I only seen this map only few times in my life xd

[kN0SPE]

Цитата допису OsRMaverik770:

Both teams will get the same opportunities and have the same chances. If you start as CT first you just need to be patient. And if you cant be patient rhough 15 tough rounds then play a different gam

yea you re right. but there is no no knive round yet where the winner can choose the t side.
so there is a disadvantage when you have to start as ct over and over again.
in the worst case you get totally destroyed as ct - 15 : 0 and one loose as t will be the end of the game.

[Maverik770]

Цитата допису A W N. # MFZB was los ?!:

yea you re right. but there is no no knive round yet where the winner can choose the t side.
so there is a disadvantage when you have to start as ct over and over again.
in the worst case you get totally destroyed as ct - 15 : 0 and one loose as t will be the end of the game. :csgoct:

I see what you're getting at but that does not matter or make it unbalanced. You can start 20 matches as CT and never as T and your odds do not change. If your opponent rolls you 15-0 at the half, there is absolutely no reason your team can't come right back after the side switch and roll them for 15 rounds straight too. Sure it's unlikely you guys will win 15 straight rounds but it was JUST as unlikely that your opponent would do the same thing in the first half. But they did. The fact that they accomplished such a feat is exactly why they only need 1 more round to seal the match for them. It didn't make it any easier for them to win 15 rounds in a row by being T first.

As soon as you switch sides and start the 2nd half as T you have the EXACT same opportunity they did. Sure you have pressure bearing down on you for 15 rounds but that doesn't make the actual game any more or less fair. ;)

[僕の名前 (仮)]

Stop playing casual and play competitive instead. Even Valve hinting you in medal.

Game is not balanced for 10v10 and extra money for everyone.

We just played cs_siege competitive and won most of CT rounds, and then finished game with 16:8

[Big Dank]

Цитата допису OsRMaverik770:

For those who are uneducated in CS history: Cs_siege was the very first map EVER created for Counter-Strike back in the very, very first Alpha version. Counter-Strike was made as a mod by a single Half-Life player named Gooseman. When he first released the very first Counter-Strike Alpha version, the ONLY map was cs_siege, it used normal Half-Life character models and had ONLY 2 guns: The M4A1 (Not Silenced) & AK-47, nothing else.

At this point in time a mod called "Action half-Life" was the most popular mod for Half-Life and outnumbered CS servers 20 to 1. I kid you not. We literally would go onto Action Half-Life servers and beg people to come check out this new mod called "Counter-Strike", claiming to them it was the best mod/game ever and that it was going to take over. People in the Action Half-Life servers would ♥♥♥♥♥ us out and tell us Counter-Strike sucked and that no one would ever play it. Gee look at what happened after that... The rest is history.

But back on point. Cs_Siege has ALWAYS been a T sided map ever since this very first incarnation of it. In fact, the new community made version (Which you are now playing in Bravo pack) is very faithfully designed according to the original map design. Cs_siege continued as the ONLY CS map pretty far into Beta development before other classics such as cs_assault and cs_mansion were added. Shortly after those maps came the bomb defusal mode and with it the first "de_" map which was de_dust.

The thing is that with the way Competitive Ranked matches work now in GO, it does NOT matter how 1 sided a map is. Each team gets to play an equal number of rounds on each side: Terrorist and Counter-Terrorist. There is NO disadvantage to playing as CT or T first on ANY of the maps. So what if the map is T sided? You will get the exact same turn as Terrorists as your opponents did.

You want a perfect example? We played a cs_siege match last night and started out as Terrorists. We won 14 out of the 15 matches and the Half ended with us up 14-1. We then switched to CT and proceeded to get rolled for 15 straight rounds! The match ended with us losing 15-14!

So yes, the map is horribly unbalanced in Terrorist's favor. But does that really matter in Competitive Mode? NO! Not at all. Competitive mode is completely fair. It does not matter which side you play first! Both teams will get the same opportunities and have the same chances. If you start as CT first you just need to be patient. And if you can't be patient through 15 tough rounds then play a different game!

To answer your original question of why did Valve add Siege? As I said, it's the ORIGINAL CS map. They added it to do a fan service to long term fans of the game.

+1

[DAHDii]

Цитата допису OsRMaverik770:

For those who are uneducated in CS history: Cs_siege was the very first map EVER created for Counter-Strike back in the very, very first Alpha version. Counter-Strike was made as a mod by a single Half-Life player named Gooseman. When he first released the very first Counter-Strike Alpha version, the ONLY map was cs_siege, it used normal Half-Life character models and had ONLY 2 guns: The M4A1 (Not Silenced) & AK-47, nothing else.

At this point in time a mod called "Action half-Life" was the most popular mod for Half-Life and outnumbered CS servers 20 to 1. I kid you not. We literally would go onto Action Half-Life servers and beg people to come check out this new mod called "Counter-Strike", claiming to them it was the best mod/game ever and that it was going to take over. People in the Action Half-Life servers would ♥♥♥♥♥ us out and tell us Counter-Strike sucked and that no one would ever play it. Gee look at what happened after that... The rest is history.

But back on point. Cs_Siege has ALWAYS been a T sided map ever since this very first incarnation of it. In fact, the new community made version (Which you are now playing in Bravo pack) is very faithfully designed according to the original map design. Cs_siege continued as the ONLY CS map pretty far into Beta development before other classics such as cs_assault and cs_mansion were added. Shortly after those maps came the bomb defusal mode and with it the first "de_" map which was de_dust.

The thing is that with the way Competitive Ranked matches work now in GO, it does NOT matter how 1 sided a map is. Each team gets to play an equal number of rounds on each side: Terrorist and Counter-Terrorist. There is NO disadvantage to playing as CT or T first on ANY of the maps. So what if the map is T sided? You will get the exact same turn as Terrorists as your opponents did.

You want a perfect example? We played a cs_siege match last night and started out as Terrorists. We won 14 out of the 15 matches and the Half ended with us up 14-1. We then switched to CT and proceeded to get rolled for 15 straight rounds! The match ended with us losing 15-14!

So yes, the map is horribly unbalanced in Terrorist's favor. But does that really matter in Competitive Mode? NO! Not at all. Competitive mode is completely fair. It does not matter which side you play first! Both teams will get the same opportunities and have the same chances. If you start as CT first you just need to be patient. And if you can't be patient through 15 tough rounds then play a different game!

To answer your original question of why did Valve add Siege? As I said, it's the ORIGINAL CS map. They added it to do a fan service to long term fans of the game.

Where is a medal for this guy right here?!?!?!!

[nelnel]

I played Counter-Strike since '99, and I KNOW that Siege is an old map, but it doesn't change the fact that it is unbalanced and that I don't like it the way it is :P

[僕の名前 (仮)]

So what exactly unbalanced in it? Auto sniper spam? Ever heard of smoke grenades?