The purpose of casual?

[skrald]

I was bored the other day and joined a valve casual where I usually would turn brutals community servers.

While there I had an interesting conversation with a guy who was angry that I didn't really do much and when proceeded to explain that I was not there to stomp new players and that I believed casual was pretty useless for learning csgo he strongly disagreed with my sentiments.

Those who know my stance to smurfing will say that a high rank player in valve casual is somewhat equal and that I'm a hypocrite for joining such a server and yes you are right, hence why I did not do much more than the bare minimum. This is not interesting for the topic though.

What is however, is if people find casual useful?
My opinion is that casual promotes this cluster playing mentality which is really harmful for when people are introduced to 5 vs 5 matchmaking. While playing d2 in casual it's similar to watching (and I'm sorry if I offend new players here) 10 blind mice run the entire map in circles 2 -3 times until they meet something to shoot at, or 7-8 people sitting in spawn with awps or scar20.
As everyone slightly more routined knows these are not playstyles which contributes much in a match so isn't casual just "helping" new players develop bad habits which they need to unlearn once introduced to 5 vs 5?

If we look at the positive side, one could argue that casual swarming mode does teach new players the choking points of a map. Sadly however they will never learn much more than dust2 and the occasional mirage as things are right now. I imagine you could also say that casual provides aiming practice but aren't deathmatches far better suited for that, with its fast pace and its need for constant awareness?

I'd love to hear the opinion of new players here. Do you use casual mode because you're afraid joining competitive? You really shouldn't since the competitive tag is to be taken very lightly when we speak of 64 tick servers. Competitive is really just lower round timers and 5 vs 5 rather than 10 vs10.

How about an unranked 5 vs 5 only available for people under a certain amount of hours played? I don't imagine neither smurfs nor cheaters would bother since there's no visible prestige at stake, but it would provide new players with a setup to learn choke points, understand roles and the all important team work which even mid-high ranked players often seem to neglect in their struggle become top fraggers by baiting their team mates, often resulting in lost matches.

[owns u & all]

Its nice to practice your dank 360°F scout noscopes.

[C0d3rX3c0s]

Casual is for the scrubs that have rq cooldowns. Also for testing random angles and doing missions. What I think casual needs though:

1. A 5v5 mode. Preferably with competitive rules. Just without mm ranking system so it doesn't get serious.
2. Option to choose the map. Just to get something besides dust2. It already works with missions that require a specific map, why not make it always possible?
3. More negevs.

[JustATextBox]

I'd say casual is great for silvers - low novas. You're still going to improve your aim, map awareness etc. The only thing you aren't learning is the competitive-specific mechanics, which might seem like a big deal, but it really means nothing in the low ranks. Through aim alone you can reach nova 3-4+, even if you don't know the maps or any of the mechanics at all.

Playing casual can help you improve enough that you're able to carry yourself to a decent rank, at which point you can start learning the harder mechanics.

I basically did this myself, though I did it through demolition rather than casual. I was originally playing with friends, having essentially no CS experience (I've played CZ on xbox, and CS/CSS on PC but with less than 50 hours on PC) - I ended up getting Silver Elite as my starting rank. Played a few with friends and got to SEM.

Friends stopped playing and I didn't really feel comfortable playing comp by myself, so I spent a good ~250+ hours in demolition. Went back to competitive and was nova 4 after a couple of games. Took another break to play demolition, and another ~200 hours later, I played a couple more competitives and hit MG2. I still have a lot to learn about competitive, but in terms of aiming and general map awareness, I'm pretty sure I could just about hit DMG currently.

So I've gone from SE to MG2, with about ~35 games of competitive. The rest was spent in demolition.

[C0d3rX3c0s]

Eh, casual as it is, doesn't teach anything to anyone. My first 100 hours I played only casual so I wouldn't suck at competitive so hard. Went for the mm after, and got the magnificent legendary rank of silver 1. A real scrub like no other.

[skrald]

Originally posted by Signild:

I'd say casual is great for silvers - low novas. You're still going to improve your aim, map awareness etc. The only thing you aren't learning is the competitive-specific mechanics, which might seem like a big deal, but it really means nothing in the low ranks. Through aim alone you can reach nova 3-4+, even if you don't know the maps or any of the mechanics at all.

Playing casual can help you improve enough that you're able to carry yourself to a decent rank, at which point you can start learning the harder mechanics.

I basically did this myself, though I did it through demolition rather than casual. I was originally playing with friends, having essentially no CS experience (I've played CZ on xbox, and CS/CSS on PC but with less than 50 hours on PC) - I ended up getting Silver Elite as my starting rank. Played a few with friends and got to SEM.

Friends stopped playing and I didn't really feel comfortable playing comp by myself, so I spent a good ~250+ hours in demolition. Went back to competitive and was nova 4 after a couple of games. Took another break to play demolition, and another ~200 hours later, I played a couple more competitives and hit MG2. I still have a lot to learn about competitive, but in terms of aiming and general map awareness, I'm pretty sure I could just about hit DMG currently.

So I've gone from SE to MG2, with about ~35 games of competitive. The rest was spent in demolition.

I'm afraid there's not much map awareness playing dust2 for 400 hours straight :D

You have valid points, I just think that a 5 vs 5 mode would serve similar purpose while also teaching new players that the run and gun approach will be punished severely.
The most valuable lesson from 5 vs 5 in my mind is adapting to your enemies play styles and reading the game. This is just not doable when there's 8 people rushing in head first spraying left and right.

Obviously I agree with you that aiming alone is the only thing important until around MG but if even lower ranked players would have the chance to put more emphasis on tactics I really think it would contribute later on. Even at DMG-LE I've seen players who barely know the basic smokes and flashes for clearing sites on maps in the competitive map pool which I find odd.

[TATUŚ Tokio]

Yes

[bruh]

they need casual so they can push cheaters and smurfs into it

[Judge Justified]

Practice, practice, practice... Casual play is the place for new players to work on their reflexes, aim, strafe, map knowledge, and indeed choking points. Besides, there actually are quite a lot of players who ONLY play casual, they have no desire to seek the thrill -or stress- of competitive matches and only play for the smurf experience.

[Blegh]

I think casual is good for learning the map and aim practice, although dm is probably better for that. But for new players who need to learn the maps and routes, dm is very unuseful.

If you plan however on playing comp then casual becomes less useful I think because it's a totally different game. Just the fact that in comp, suddenly you must buy armor for example.

I think it's better to learn, or get ready, for comp when playing comp rules. I think the casual-with-comp-rules but without the ranking is something that a lot of players will embrace.

If you are a fanatic, serious player then yeah, casual can be pretty awful. I'm not however and I can have a lot of fun in casual.
If only there was just the simple option to not be able to vote the map you're on.... I have 800+ hours now, mostly playing casual, and I have never, literally never, been able to play overpass on casual >_<

[Uocjat]

it's all in the name really
it's for people who doesn't feel the need to dedicate every second of free time they have to trying to be better than everyone else but would rather just jump in every now and then to have some fun shooting things in a virtual enviroment

atleast that's how i use it, sure there's arms race/demo and what not which are fun but it's nice to have the option to play the original game mode aswell from time to time

also i'd say that the community/player base around here can very easiely give the impression especially to new players that competetive is full of hardcore elitests prats who will harass you back to the stone age at even the tiniest slip up - and noone wants that

basically not everyone who plays CS:GO play it for the end goal of being the best - it is a game after all and some people just wanna have some fun without too much grief

[Piston Smashed™]

Kinda interesting the replies of you lot, you can tell those who've played CS for a long time and those who haven't. Those you haven't played for long just say casual is for scrubs/n00bs etc which isn't actually true but they don't klnow any better seeing as they've never trully played CS.

[Smoket]

I agree they don't even have a practice comp mode to join with your friends, you would think casual would be a practice 5v5 but no its a 32 player awp war server... demolition is the closest thing and they only run a few maps.

[Blegh]

Originally posted by Piston Smashed™:

Kinda interesting the replies of you lot, you can tell those who've played CS for a long time and those who haven't. Those you haven't played for long just say casual is for scrubs/n00bs etc which isn't actually true but they don't klnow any better seeing as they've never trully played CS. :spazwinky:

I'm used to bigger teams ever scince I started playing cs 15+ years ago. More heads to pwn right >_<

[Celestial ♎]

casual is actually useful for training ur reflexes, cuz u get attacked from practically every side , its kinda like DM with objectives.

[skrald]

Originally posted by Piston Smashed™:

Kinda interesting the replies of you lot, you can tell those who've played CS for a long time and those who haven't. Those you haven't played for long just say casual is for scrubs/n00bs etc which isn't actually true but they don't klnow any better seeing as they've never trully played CS. :spazwinky:

That's a bold assumption and also quite false. Personally I have been in the scene of counter strike since before it was officially released as a mod for half life, heck I even beta tested half life.

I'm not saying casual mode is for anyone in particular but playing a match clearly reveals that majority are new players and I think this mode promotes a playing style which is unhealthy for those who wish to enter the competitive 5 vs 5 mode, simply because of the size of teams and the repetitive selection of maps.