Gonna f*up my first characters, ain't I?! :-D

[Swimfan]

Started the game to bridge the time until BG3 arrives and so far I'm loving it (rather new to tactical RPG gameplay and only played DOS2/BG3 EA before).

The only thing that always irks me about these games (and what is arguably one big fun factor) is customzing heroes/units. So my 2 characters just leveled up (chose the brawler and the sniper girl to get a feeling for both fighting styles) and what can I say?! :-D
What is this game even telling me? Spend 3 points WHERE? So my brawler has Strength and "Big Weapons" says "recommended stats Strength ..." but also names 2 other attributes - so can I pick that trait? I'm so confused :-P I don't wanna melee with him all the time but he doesn't seem good with any other weapon type it seems!?

So I wonder: Maybe the game wants me to screw the first characters up? ^^

[Meowella]

Probably.

I began as sniper/brawler starters as well, so twinsies! I also used the first plays to get down how to split my skills up on chars.

Each char has 7 attributes, the CLASSIC system:

Coordination = more action points = more attacking things. Each char gets 6 AP to spend on movement and/or weapon/item uses; they get 1 bonus AP per 2 points in Coordination (so at 10 Coord they have 11 AP)

Luck is just that, a % chance to get a lucky crit, turn a crit into a MEGA (triple crit damage) crit, dodge etc. The best thing is a % chance to refund all the AP you spend on doing something. (If your melee char moves AND attacks, spending 10 ap to do this, as a single go... it can be fully refunded so you moved that far and hit AND now get to hit 3-10 extra times mwuhahaha).

Awareness/Strength: these offer a straight damage buff to either ranged or melee attacks. Strength is for brawling/melee weapons only, not for Big Guns.

Speed. You start with a 1.4 base speed, aka you move 1.4 squares per 1 ap. Speed 1 adds 0.1 to this (so you essentially have 1.5 cos you always get 1 speed) but can be increased to like 4-5 speed through items and skills (aka 5 squares per 1 ap). Only useful for your melee chars, but they will get plenty of move from items, dont put points into speed.

Intelligence. the BEST damage ability. Increases crit chance AND crit multiplier. Also adds skill points. 100% strongest stat.

Charisma. Each attack fills a strike meter. full strike meters give you a 95% hit chance AND a special attack (sniper rifles can do headshots, a big gun gets a HUGE conal attack etc)

You get 21 points to spend on attributes, plus 1 per level beyond 2nd (so you have 19+level from 3rd onwards). At level 25, which is about where you'll end the game, you'll have 44 points - which means you can have 10/10/10/10/2/1/1 aka 4 attributes to 10.

With regards to skills, everybody can max 3 skills. There are ways to get more points but as you're starting, assume 3 skills maxed. That'll be 1 weapon skill and 2 other skills from the 16 available (16 non-weapon, 6 weapon for a total of 22 skills).

Melee weapons are always bad, always. Brawling is so much better. The other weapons are all good depending on your playstyle, but don't use melee weapons, they're awful.

As for skills, you get 3 skill points per level plus 1 per point in Intelligence.
Skills go up to rank 10, costing 1/2/3/5/7/10/13/17/22/28 total to level (1-3 = 1 point each, 4-5 are 2 each, 6-7 3 each then 8 = 4, 9 = 5, 10 = 6).
Some skill ranks unlock the option to buy a perk. Not every perk is good for you, but it's up to you to decide which ones you want.

It's also important you read which skills are good together. Like, Sneaky Stuff adds damage to attacks before combat. This is good for either your Sniper, or your Explosives person (nothing like firing a huge nuke before combat begins hehe).

Finally, you can pay Sergei Greatski to respec chars. It starts cheap but gets too expensive so don't think you can do this too many times!

Overall, if you haven't reached level 5, just re-start as many times as you feel like you wanna.

[Cursed Life]

"Finally, you can pay Sergei Greatski to respec chars. It starts cheap but gets too expensive so don't think you can do this too many times!"

Ive done it with all the reclutable characters.

[Heau]

1. Don't be overly concerned about messing up, you can respec later. There's an increasing fee with each respect so wait a little until you feel you've figured it out a bit before respeccing.

2. The game is fairly forgiving difficulty wise. This is not xcom, the focus is more on the RPG than on the tactical combat layer. So unless min/maxing (or failure to) really grinds your gear, you will be able to succeed even if you've thrown a few points in the wrong places

3. The game does not really support mixed weapon specialities. If you play a brawler, you are always brawling. Well more or less. My brawlers typically chuck grenades early game until brawling(10) for AP cost reduction. But you generally prefer not to commit points into more than one of the 6 primary weapon proficiencies. And you need sufficient proficiency to use the weapon anyway.

4. You can never go wrong with strength(melee) or awareness(ranged) and coordination(both). All other stats you can frankly just go based on how you feel it might help your play as you experience the game. Hell in my blind SJ playthrough I stopped at like 4 coordination on my sniper after seeing 7 AP weapons and it was perfectly fine.

5. Secondary skills, you can expect to max 3 skills, including weapon proficiency, to 10/10 by the end game, and have some spare points to get a 4th skill a few points in (more or less depending on if you have the DLC content or not). For RP, you generally want to avoid overlapping secondary skills between your units as it will allow you to meet more dialogue skill checks. But honestly in vanilla people were playing with 6 animal whisperers for pet tanking and it was just fine too.

tl;dr, game's forgiving and allows plenty of flexibility in builds. I ran the game with 5 brawler and a melee once and it went completely fine.

[Swimfan]

Thank you all :-) Read through your tips and now I feel more confident.

Originally posted by Heau:

1. Don't be overly concerned about messing up, you can respec later. There's an increasing fee with each respect so wait a little until you feel you've figured it out a bit before respeccing.

2. The game is fairly forgiving difficulty wise. This is not xcom, the focus is more on the RPG than on the tactical combat layer. So unless min/maxing (or failure to) really grinds your gear, you will be able to succeed even if you've thrown a few points in the wrong places

3. The game does not really support mixed weapon specialities. If you play a brawler, you are always brawling. Well more or less. My brawlers typically chuck grenades early game until brawling(10) for AP cost reduction. But you generally prefer not to commit points into more than one of the 6 primary weapon proficiencies. And you need sufficient proficiency to use the weapon anyway.

4. You can never go wrong with strength(melee) or awareness(ranged) and coordination(both). All other stats you can frankly just go based on how you feel it might help your play as you experience the game. Hell in my blind SJ playthrough I stopped at like 4 coordination on my sniper after seeing 7 AP weapons and it was perfectly fine.

5. Secondary skills, you can expect to max 3 skills, including weapon proficiency, to 10/10 by the end game, and have some spare points to get a 4th skill a few points in (more or less depending on if you have the DLC content or not). For RP, you generally want to avoid overlapping secondary skills between your units as it will allow you to meet more dialogue skill checks. But honestly in vanilla people were playing with 6 animal whisperers for pet tanking and it was just fine too.

tl;dr, game's forgiving and allows plenty of flexibility in builds. I ran the game with 5 brawler and a melee once and it went completely fine.

That is nice to hear, thanks :-)

Then I feel really "clever" because I actually chose grenades for my brawler (because there weren't any other weapon types that seemed to fit) and spend the rest of those points on their main weapons. It's awesome that higher ranks give AP reduction then!? Because sniper rifles costing 6AP is VERY costly ... that poor girl can either save points from last round and walk 3 and shoot or shoot and just walk 1 ^^"
I really like how that reflects how stationary a sniper rifle user has to be.

Yeah, I really hoped that this game would be a better ... "introduction" to the scene than XCOM2 because I find that game very frustrating (maybe I'll try again sometimes in the future).

[Heau]

It's a lvl 10 brawling perk that gives a -1 AP reduction to brawling melee attacks only. There aren't equivalent for other weapon classes. Automatic weapons get one perk that gives you a free shot if you move at least 4 tiles which can be gamed to trade 1-3 AP for the value of a 4 AP shot but its not remotely as night and day as cutting brawling cost from 2 to 1.

For other weapon specs, You increase your number of shots by increasing your AP through coordination, leadership, and possibly if you fancy a foam finger character (I usually play a dedicated medic leader with no weapon proficiency rocking a foam finger).

[3quarks]

I FEEL SOOO CONFOOOSED ^^
sigh

[Swimfan]

Originally posted by 3quarks:

I FEEL SOOO CONFOOOSED ^^
sigh

You do what? :-P

[3quarks]

Originally posted by Swimfan:

Originally posted by 3quarks:

I FEEL SOOO CONFOOOSED ^^
sigh

You do what? :-P

jog on boy
go play CoD

[Swimfan]

Originally posted by 3quarks:

Originally posted by Swimfan:

You do what? :-P

jog on boy
go play CoD

What are you even saying? :-D Do you have no brain cells left, playing CoD all day?

[Oakshield]

You may take a look at this and get some idea's about what to do:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2243127548


Thorin :)

[red255]

I mean you can probably manage with a sub optimal team, on normal difficulty.

be more fun that way.

[Radiac]

Here's my personal team lineup, and this is just an example, not some optimized build necessarily (also, I finished the game four times before the Steeltown DLC came out, so if this is not good for that part of the game, I wouldn't know it):

Ok to begin, you make two custom rangers

First guy, Hicks, the "Leader", takes Automatic Weapons and starts with an Assault Rifle. His starting C.L.A.S.S.I.C. numbers are 4.1.1.1.1.3.10 That's right, 10 in Charisma, 4 in Coordination, 3 in Intelligence, and 1 in everything else, to start. We start him with one rank in each of Automatic Weapons, Lock Picking, Mechanics, First Aid, and Leadership. In fact you can skip Leadership at creation and put an extra point in Lock Picking if you want to. This guy will eventually level up to 10 in Automatics, Lockpicking, and Leadership and put a few points, but not fully max out Mechanics and First Aid. He will eventually get to 10 in Coordination, Awareness, Intelligence and Charisma.

Second guy, Hudson, the "Sniper", takes Sniper Rifle and has C.L.A.S.S.I.C. numbers 4.1.2.1.1.2.10 to start. Again, 10 Charisma to begin play. I do this on both starting guys for two reasons. It causes them to level up faster (and they can power-level the others that way) and it causes their Strike abilities to build charge faster. Sniper guy puts one skill point into each of Sniper Rifle, Sneaky ♥♥♥♥, Hard Ass and First Aid. He will eventually also take the super secret hidden skill, Combat Shooting, but that's spoilers. He will always have just the one rank in First Aid, just to be able to use First Aid kits on himself and others. I do this with every member of the squad, though the others will have some more spare points to spend on this. This guy will eventually level up Sniper, Sneaky, and Hard Ass to ten, but getting there involves Utility Items and Armor pieces for Hard Ass. All of his spare skill points go into Combat Shooting when he gets it. His Attribute scores will eventually go to 10 in Coordination, Awareness, Intelligence, and Charisma, and after that, if you do get any more levels, it really doesn't matter what you put the other Attribute points into.

Then you get to your new home and can make two more customs. I do this with the thought in mind that I'll eventually be using Jodie Bell and Lucia Wesson as my two NPC companions, and that I will use them more or less as they are, without any drastic respecs. Before Jodie becomes available, I use Kwon as my 6th man.

Third guy, Drake, the "Big Gunner" C.L.A.S.S.I.C. is 6.1.2.5.1.2.4. He takes Big Guns, Nerd Stuff, Weird Science, all of which he will eventually max, and at creation I give him a rank in First Aid, he might get a few more after he's all finished, and after I've maxxed his main skills, I have points left over to give him a few ranks in Leadership, just for fun (Rally and Demoralize). He eventually Maxes out Coordination, Awareness, and Strength, and ends up with like 5-6 in Intelligence and Charisma.

Fourth guy, Frost, the "Miscellaneous guy" takes whatever jobs are left, which in this case means Automatic Weapons, Explosives, and Kiss Ass. He maxxes those skills, takes one rank in First Aid at creation, and eventually gets some more First Aid later. His C.L.A.S.S.I.C. is 8.1.4.2.1.3.2. to start and he ultimately gets to 10 in Coordination, Awareness and Intelligence, goes to 8 in Charisma (for faster Torrent Strike charge with his SMG), and gets to like 2-4 in Speed and Strength, respectively.

Jodie Bell fully levels up Sniper, First Aid, and Mechanics, and then if you care about Animal Whisperer you can level her up in that. She maxxes out Coordination, Awareness and whatever else you like.

Lucia Wesson eventually gets to 10 in Small arms, Barter, and Survival, I get her to like 6-7 in Weapon Modding for the Powder Packer Perk, and give her 1 rank in Brawling for the Foam Finger, and get her to like 7 in First Aid, eventually.

I also make a seventh man (Bishop) who stays at the HQ most of the time and does all my crafting and Modding. He levels up Armor Modding, Weapon Modding, and Toaster Repair. I take him out to fix toasters once or twice after I've cleared the maps with the serious team first. None of the toaster items are of any immediate usefulness or urgency. They're all, at best, stuff you can use later or collect pieces of over time.

[3quarks]

Originally posted by red255:

you can probably manage with a sub optimal team

you can manage w/suboptimal team on SJ, been there done that. WHen I realized that playing w/companions rather than w/customized mercs from uncle Sergei is the way to go (for flavor, the game started to grow boring on me), I've played most of the Steeltown with Cordite and Scotchmo (in place of my custom chars) the way they come by default until I saved up enough buck to rebalance the whole squad.