What's the point of using assault rifles ??

[The Matrix has you!]

For example with basic attributes and skills (lvl 3 weapon):

basic AR (Army rifle) 7-8x3 for 4AP with 85% chance to hit. = 19.125 dam for 4 AP or 4.78 / 1AP

basic HMG (Bunker buster) 7-10x9 for 6AP with 60% CtH = 45.9 dam for 6 AP or 7.65 / 1AP

Both have same range (15), HMG have more penetration 6 vs 4 and as result HMG 60% more damge...

You can easy create (or up after few levels) soldier with 12 potential AP (for example 8 coordination + serial killer quirk) and you'll have 2 HMG bursts every turn.


So, the question is, what a reason to use assault rifles?? Yes it use less ammo, but it is VERY stupid reason, anything else?

[[JdG] Pejman]

sniper + 100% crit + serial ambush + Huge Mag

pew pew pew pew

[BigRockWall]

引用自 JdG Pejman：

sniper + 100% crit + serial ambush + Huge Mag

pew pew pew pew

Eliminator + -1ap load mag + 100% crit + draw + 2 pump chump

Pew x12 over 3 turns, if it even lasts that long

I like to add the big mag to the ray tracer to do the serial ambushing with

[deadsanta]

To the OP, there's very little reason to use ARs in this game, but you kind of get them for "free" with automatic weapons, and they are decent finishers at range when your SMG just can't reach. They also good for another ammo type, and conserving ammo. Auto weapons does have the benefit of a precise shot with ARs and Cone AOE With SMGs, so I guess you get a bit of versatility there too.

[Iso Koala]

Assault rifles are kinda bad, but not useless. They get the job down as finishers for weak enemies. They have decent range, penetrarion and AP cost. SMG:s have short range and penetration, snipers have high AP cost. When others shoot an enemy and he is left at 10% hp, assault rifle is the best way to kill him if your pistol person is too far away.

[Iso Koala]

Meat Grinder harpoon gun also is good, you get it after Bizarre at early game, and with mods my harpoonist has base dmg of 300 with it and range and accuracy of a high end sniper rifle with cost of 4AP. Works through the entire game.

[Deformerad Dallarydsbo]

引用自 Iso Koala：

Meat Grinder harpoon gun also is good, you get it after Bizarre at early game, and with mods my harpoonist has base dmg of 300 with it and range and accuracy of a high end sniper rifle with cost of 4AP. Works through the entire game.

Where do you get arrow bolts for it?

[SeriousCCIE]

The arrow bolts are sold as regular ammo and found in ammo chests and such--I used the same weapon for the same reasons the other person mentioned.

There are two of those bolt weapons (that use bolts--a plasma bolter is available later, but it uses energy cells).

I added the electric mod to the exploding bolt one found prior to the meat grinder, and used it to handle robots until I found better automatic weapons to do that, but the meat grinder was useful up a few missions prior to the last couple major missions.

[Bastila Shan]

I think AR are the least powerful guns in game besides pistol. I was slaying with sub machine gun with serial killer quirk. I have qwan in my party as AR and he’s by far the least useful member.

[snuggleform]

引用自 Shekelmoth Goldblaat：

引用自 Iso Koala：

Meat Grinder harpoon gun also is good, you get it after Bizarre at early game, and with mods my harpoonist has base dmg of 300 with it and range and accuracy of a high end sniper rifle with cost of 4AP. Works through the entire game.

Where do you get arrow bolts for it?

Bizarre has a few for sale, and the random encounters on the world map all have large crates that drop crossbow bolts. If you're in the habit of skipping world encounters then tough luck finding bolts.

[One]

reaper smg with fire mod and +8 damage barrel handled by 10 intel ranger does 800-1000 damage for 4ap - i think no AR in game can do the same damage

[Bastila Shan]

I think it’s just that AR has so few bullets per shot compared to smg, sniper makes up for in damage, shotgun in spread and handgun in more shots due to less ap required

[Astral Projection]

Uhh what game are you guys playing? Combined AR / SMG spec is the best in the game IMHO.

AR / SMG - longest default range, most ammo types, best perks, kill a guy and get AP, ignore partially cover, free shots, most shots, consistently good the entire game.

Heavy weapons is trash comparatively because they all take 5-7 AP and ridiculous miss rate. Early game absolute garbage.

Snipers is only consistently good outside of ambush if you take pistols with it.

Shotguns and pistols suck much of the game due to limited range and damage.

Finished game and my AR/SMG guys were dominating majority of fights. Swapping AR / SMG depending on fight is so good.

[[JdG] Pejman]

引用自 BigRockWall：

引用自 JdG Pejman：

sniper + 100% crit + serial ambush + Huge Mag

pew pew pew pew

Eliminator + -1ap load mag + 100% crit + draw + 2 pump chump

Pew x12 over 3 turns, if it even lasts that long

I like to add the big mag to the ray tracer to do the serial ambushing with

how do you manage to get 3 turns though?? unless it's a boss battle my sniper just kills everyone at the end of his turn (potentially 11 shots)

引用自 Astral Projection：

Uhh what game are you guys playing? Combined AR / SMG spec is the best in the game IMHO.

AR / SMG - longest default range, most ammo types, best perks, kill a guy and get AP, ignore partially cover, free shots, most shots, consistently good the entire game.

Heavy weapons is trash comparatively because they all take 5-7 AP and ridiculous miss rate. Early game absolute garbage.

Snipers is only consistently good outside of ambush if you take pistols with it.

Shotguns and pistols suck much of the game due to limited range and damage.

Finished game and my AR/SMG guys were dominating majority of fights. Swapping AR / SMG depending on fight is so good.

Smg do damage, AR does nothing
Heavy weapons have 10x damage output of AR (especially once you get minigun and start modding it), Also they have a stupidly strong strike ability (shared with SMG and shotguns)

Sniper is probably one of the best weapons once you get 100% crit and serial ambush
Shotguns early / mid game are lame, but late game are stupidly OP (especially when you mod them to cover half the map and then get extra damage for every enemy hit)

If you mod you weapons a bit ar get really useless, an SMG modded with extra range will ALWAYS be better than an AR

[rumpelstiltskin]

i was left with the same impression (that ARs are garbage), but looking back, i'm not sure why exactly. damage per AP seems to be quite comparable to same tier sniper rifles (for instance, kalash is only 10% less than death lance). everyone knows that snipers must get high crit chance, but why is it different for ARs? yes, they have starting crit multiplier 1.5 instead of 2, but once you add flat boni to it, the difference is not that high.
ARs have pretty useful puncturing shot (shoots through many targets; damages armor), and double tap to get a guaranteed critical on the second shot, although it seems to only do it to one bullet out of 3. possibly called shots have the same issue, in which case it's definitely a contributing factor to whys SRs are better.
apparently you can use the draw trick to fire meat maker for 2 ap, for double the damage output of same tier red dragon (although i still think draw was never intended to work for all weapons).
yes, some sniper rifles have risky shot for almost guaranteed criticals, and obviously the range is better. and with megacrit you can get insane numbers.
ARs' 4ap, otoh, is much more flexible, and in the beginning unless you take death wish (giving up sadomasochist), it means 2 shots against one per turn. also, sniper ammo is very scarce in the beginning.

[[JdG] Pejman]

sniper is good with serial ambush, outside of this it's Meh (I mean except if you use deathray + draw trick, probably other snipers that can use the draw trick too)
SR also have high penetration, and I have seen enemies "resisting" crosbow bolts (try firing a crosbow at liberty's robots lol)

If you want to pewpew your way through things SMG are god tier with their : Way superior DPAP (lol ripper goes BRRRRRTTTTT) and strong perks (free attack after moving, 15% damage when without cover) and their ridiculous strike (lol ripper goes BRRRRRRRRTTTTT in AOE) are just god tier weapons., just need to add a scope and you good (I usually try to use a +9m -5% crit one as SMG have high base crit chance and when you vomit buillets at that rate you gonna land a crit sooner or later). They also scale way better with mods (+ flat damage weapon op).
I have given pizepi a modded ripper with energy damage and the weird science perks are doing to much work here (+0.5 damage per armor on the target is quite great of a weapon that shoots 10 bullets in one go, you get +5 damage on whole attack for each armor point, that can scale PRETTY FAST).

anyway lategame SMG and SHOTGUNS (increase range and cone angle, take perk that increase dmg for every target you touch, fire your jackhammer, deal 8K total damage across 40% of your screen, yay) are GOD tier.
My shotgun is doing more dmg than my rocket launcher dude (except nuka launcher)

I havnt used pistols much, but I have seen some with pretty high damage (heck, there is a nailgun that deal 400+ dmg, lol)

TBH I don't use HMG that much, just tried a pyro minigun build (that's probably the most comon/minmaxed build for HMG) and it's quite strong, but I still prefer ZE RIPPER