Age of Wonders: Planetfall

Age of Wonders: Planetfall

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[Balance] Factions, secret techs, etc.
What is your take on balance?
How would you rate the different factions?
What about secret techs, npc factions, commander traits?
Be free to share your strategies too to illustrate your opinions*

Poll:
What's your favorite faction?[linkto.run]


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MVP of the thread so far:
Indepth view of Amazon By BillyLee
Indepth review of Amazons (2) By Zamnath
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Below are my favorite:
COMMANDER TRAITS

Martial, Energy, APC, Decadent (+10 hp).
More on APC
https://steamcommunity.com/app/718850/discussions/0/1643170903493680230/?ctp=4#c1643170903502431103


FACTIONS
1st
Kir'ko
Their psionics buffs + debuffs + aoe / teleport, make them very strong.
They have plenty heals. And are very good at mind control.
Their psionic abilities are on CD, not once per battle.
Only absorb pain and mind control are once per battle.
Their sniper is the best there is, and among the very best support unit.
They also make the best APC support heroes notably with Mantra of healing (teleport, absob pain, 'grenade' of heal).
Their last unit is IMPRESSIVE, capable to heal all friendly units on battlefield +2 range, +20%accuracy, +25% damage. Have 2 of them for perma buffs.

Most valued units: Hidden, Harbinger, APC, Transcendant.
Ratings: Damage potential 3.5/5, Supportive capabilities 5/5, Range 5/5, AOE: 2/5, melee 3/5.
Phase Ratings: Early: 3/5, Mid 4.5/5, Late: 5/5.
Best secret tech:
- Voidtech: +20% evasion on hidden.
- Celestian: free resurgence for lategame.

2nd
DVAR
Very mobile, thus potent at flanking. But also good in defense (trenchers, blind, concussion).
Bulwark is their bread and butter and always able to use its 3 action points in overwatch on a 12 strength attack, means that its damage potential is quite high.
The units that make them shine not only are good at what they do, but are t1/t2 and as such, easy to boot.
Their t3-4 actually seem pretty bad (Baron, Artillery etc.)
*If you manage to befriend Automatons, you're going for a good time.

Most valued units: Bulwark, Trencher, Scout.
Ratings: Damage potential 4/5, Supportive capabilities 1/5, Range 3/5, AOE: 3.5/5, melee 1.5/5.
Phase Ratings: Early: 3.5/5, Mid 4/5, Late: 4/5.
Best secret tech:
- Promethean: Phoenix launcher on Trenchers, and otherwise AoE + Dot and Heal for mechanical.


3rd
Vanguard
Their supportive and debuff capabilities are limited to single targets and often work on a once per battle basis.
Their range isn't that great, only thanks to Engineer (launcher) turrets do they manage to be competitive.
Engineer might be their most valued unit once the tech to upgrade turrets is acquired.
For a full contingent of Launcher turret, the PUG unit can be usefull, as it adds another layer of supportive capabilities on the battlefield, for the same amount of turrets.

Most valued units: Engineer, PUG, Gunship.
Ratings: Damage potential 3.5/5, Supportive capabilities 2/5, Range 4/5, AOE: 3.5/5, melee 0/5.
Phase Ratings: Early: 2/5, Mid 4/5, Late: 4/5.
Best secret tech:
- Promethean: some more laser mods for PUG and phoenix launcher on engineers
- Synthetic: +25% evasion mod for Gunship
- Celestian: late game resurgence


4th
Syndicate
They got the best rush capabilities thanks to their indentured, because of a low-tier tech which allows to diminish cost of production and upkeep.
Mix them with overseer with minimal mod, to produce cheap and quick to deploy squads.
Although it is required to settle couple cities before this mass produce gets really effective.
No mods on indentured also allows for more ressource allocation for Settlers, and thus a quicker spread of cities.

Most valued units: Indentured, Overseer, Mirage, Wraith tank.
Ratings: Damage potential 3/5, Supportive capabilities 3/5, Range 3/5, AOE: 2/5, melee 2.5/5.
Phase Ratings: Early: 3/5, Mid 4/5, Late: 4/5.
Best secret tech:
- Psynumbra: for a well mastered tech which can elevate mid game.


5th
Assembly
Their units seem lesser than most other faction units but can be revived.
Their engineer is also capable to summon some t1 fighters.
Overral, most of their units feel like cannon fodder with high resilience. But I am unsure if this whole thing is enough.

Most valued units: Engineer.
Ratings: Damage potential ?/5, Supportive capabilities 3/5, Range 2/5, AOE: 1/5, melee 3/5.
Phase Ratings: Early: 2/5, Mid: 3/5, Late: 3.5/5
Best secret tech:
- Synthesis for even more resilence and some skill refresh on summons and revives.
Last edited by Sloul Des Tucs; Aug 28, 2019 @ 7:37am
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Showing 1-15 of 389 comments
Climhazzard Aug 10, 2019 @ 2:12am 
Even though I have 35 hours in game I feel like I've barely experienced it. I can basically only compare Dvar with Vanguard. And even then, I used the early game units more than anything so I can't really compare the lategame units.

Vanguard have the better flying unit imo, unless you like ramming into things... worth comparing because flyers have better movement which make pure flyer armies strong strategically.

I also like the engineer and the PuG a lot more than the foreman. Foreman isn't bad, since you can buff the moral of one of your Bulwarks to mow down more enemies. But it's just cool to drop a turret with an engineer, then reset the turret skill with the PuG. The PuG is also nice to obscure your Hero or some other tough unit to distract the enemies.

Bulwark is really strong, and the trencher and trooper come in about even in awesomeness.

Can't really compare secret techs since I've only really put promethean to use. Promethean gets a super rocket launcher for a mod that all your low tier infantry can equip. It's called phoenix bombs or something.
Astasia Aug 10, 2019 @ 2:32am 
I don't really don't notice that much difference in power that I would rate them at this point. The Syndicate for example, their basic tier 1 troop is indeed probably the worst in the game and their support just gets them killed even faster, but at the same time they are also potentially the cheapest unit in the game and have some later synergies with mods and higher tier units. Their scout on the other hand is by far the best scout in the game, it's invisible on all terrain, they almost never die to marauders, and are actually pretty decent early combat units because of their escape teleport. Where I find the syndicate really shines is with their t2/t3 psionic vehicles, they are highly mobile and do a massive amount of damage that ignores armor and has some pretty crazy mod options. The faction has a lot of stealth, a lot of mobility, and a ton of damage, but lacks in defense.
Sloul Des Tucs Aug 10, 2019 @ 2:41am 
Interesting take Astasia, I might give them a second chance upon reading you.
Although, one thing that needs to be mentioned about Psionic attacks: it's not as good as it seems.
It's supposed to get through armor, and thus be better at piercing damage, the issue is that Mechanical units are resistant to it. By 4 points.
And there are so many mechanical units in the game, that the promess of piercing damage is often false imo.
Also, the damage output of psionic is often lesser than other damage channels, possibly because it's suppose to be piercing. Thus, your psionic units will often have crappy damage output against mechanical units.
I am unsure about cyborgs, but there are also quite a few units inherently resistent to psy.

Which is also why I was a bit sad about the performance of the Kirk'o sniper. Its native damage being 16 (instead of the usual 20 for snipers of other channels).
Last edited by Sloul Des Tucs; Aug 10, 2019 @ 2:42am
Horrible Marksman Aug 10, 2019 @ 3:08am 
Admittedly I've only tried Kir'Ko with void thus far, but I haven't found them weak. I've essentially been using them as high evade, high sustain shock troops. Hit the enemy with accuracy reducing effects like electrify, use the first void mod for the evade/pathing, effective use of shroud for 40% obscure/heals/buffs, regen, skitter makes it even better, quantum to force flanking or decoys, and ignore pain the primary evade tanks. The damage you end up taking is usually glancing and that's reduced even further with the ascendant and quickly regenerated. If late game with huge stacks is reached then this particular strategy might be rough, but it's been pretty great for me thus far.

Also, regarding the Kir'Ko sniper, you can change the damage type and also give it various buffs/debuffs since it still counts as psionic. I use them as a support dps as their damage is pretty good, their overwatch is great, and what you can do with innate shroud is pretty cool.



Last edited by Horrible Marksman; Aug 10, 2019 @ 3:08am
Prometheus Aug 10, 2019 @ 3:49am 
Psynumbra is very powerful.

Its first tech gives a tac op that deals 20 damage and staggers a unit. It only costs 1 op point and 25 energy. So it goes from heavily swinging your early battles for a reasonable cost to a spammable cheap op that helps out later on.

Not far in they get a strat op that summons an invisible scout with a repeating ranged attack that does a morale debuff. Its also etheral so its quite survivable. It only costs 60 energy to summon and does not take up any production time on a city. Early on this is a big advantage. They serve well to hit the flanks of enemy forces and get some debuff stacks in before coming in with your main stack.

The tier 2 offensive mod consuming gaze gives any unit a single action, 5 range, 12 damage attack that heals the user for 20 health and ignores line of sight and cover. This mod is amazing. The attack isn't once per battle either but a 2 turn cooldown. If you are frustrated by the limitations of healing, Psyn blasts those limitations away and gives you offensive power on top of it.

The end game mod it gives makes all the attacks the unit does have a chance at straight up hard CCing the enemy. It rolls this even on repeatable attacks. When the CC fails you get an automatic unresistable morale debuff instead.

Now about morale debuffs. When you have low morale you get a chance to fumble attacks. This gets down to 50% chance to fumble. A fumbled attack never hits the target you aim at and it most definitely can hit your own units. The Psyn units all deal morale debuffs with everything they do.

Makes you appreciate the Foreman a bit eh? Also the Foreman's morale buff is equal to a 10% crit chance buff when at base morale. Morale caps at 15% crit bonus so he can still help if you have some morale already too. Now note that Psyn gives your hero the option to learn an ability that gives the Foreman buff plus some resists to every friendly unit on the battlefield. The tier 4 Psyn unit has this ability as well.
Prometheus Aug 10, 2019 @ 4:02am 
Your analysis of the Syndicate is the opposite of my own. Indentured are crazy good when used right. First of note is that the support unit gives everything indentured a 10% increased crit chance just by existing on the battlefield with them. Later you can get an active ability through a mod on the support unit that gives every indentured 25% increased damage. Which synergizes with the mod in the Psy weapons tech line that makes psy buffs heal the target making this damage buff also heal every Indentured on the battlefield as well. Later you get another mod that adds another 25% crit chance to all indentured, just for having the unit with this mod on the battlefield. These are just the buffs.

The indentured unit itself is a bit weaker than its equivalents. I grant that. However they aren't that far behind. Give them the accuracy boosting mod on the first Syndicate faction tech. Boom they instantly become hugely effective (the sniper can really use this as well). Their special shot staggers an enemy AND knocks them back. Push units out of cover then punish. Yes, the Vanguard grenade is better, but Troopers don't get Indentured buffs. Well...ok they can if you are Syndicate and get some troopers. *insert evil cackling here*

Which brings me to the high value of finding settlements. It doesn't really matter what kind of settlement you get. Every race brings you units that help flesh out your strategy without having to research any of their techs. Amazons? Indentured Lancers are amazingly helpful to the Syndicate. I already mentioned indentured Troopers. Indentured Trenchers, oh my yes please. Note that you can indenture tier 2 units so...indentured Assembly or Kir'ko snipers. I know you weren't impressed with them but snipers work out quite nicely once they get some accuracy boosts and indentured snipers can be made to shoot two times in a single turn.
Sloul Des Tucs Aug 10, 2019 @ 4:21am 
Indentured snipers can be made to shoot 2 times? Can you explain?
Also how would you rank factions?
I take it that Psynumbra is your favorite secret tech?
Sad Cat Aug 10, 2019 @ 4:24am 
Originally posted by Horrible Marksman:

Also, regarding the Kir'Ko sniper, you can change the damage type and also give it various buffs/debuffs since it still counts as psionic. I use them as a support dps as their damage is pretty good, their overwatch is great, and what you can do with innate shroud is pretty cool.

Regarding the Kir'Ko snipers, to get into more specifics, their Shrouded Step ability also counts as a psionic buff, so any mods that grant a buff on psionic buff use will trigger and grant themselves and allies the effect. This makes the Mantra of Clarity very useful on them as their psionic shots trigger the 20% easier to hit debuff on enemies when shot by their main weapon. Then Shrouded Step will grant an additional 20% hard to hit effect on them and allies (60% total). If your units are also behind cover, forget about them even getting hit with an enemy ranged unit for two turns.

Then theres Mantra of life, which would give the same Shrouded Step ability a 15 point AoE heal every three turns, effectively turning them into mobile healing turrets.
Last edited by Sad Cat; Aug 10, 2019 @ 4:27am
Sloul Des Tucs Aug 10, 2019 @ 4:28am 
fack that sounds cool. Kirk'o might hit my next game.
AnemoneMeer Aug 10, 2019 @ 4:54am 
If you think Syndies are bad, you are playing them extremely wrong. They have a VERY different gameplan from what most people are going to attempt with them first.

I've had T4's on the board by turn 35 and T3's in the 20's. I've drowned enemies in waves of units who cost me almost nothing to build. I've had an amazing economy based on the fact that I can easily afford to not build a lot of units and still have a lot of units.

I'm probably going to have to write a guide about how to Syndie effectively, because if you're simply assuming you can play them like the Vanguard, you're in for a painful experience. You're playing a completely different game, and let me tell you right now, when you show up to someone's capital just after turn 40 with stacks of T3 and T4 units, heroes, and a veritable swarm of indentured, people are going to be asking what the hell kind of early game you had. Only it was a crap early game and you didn't get lucky.

Syndicate is absolutely bonkers if played right.

Also, Indentured are the best T1 in the game. While that sounds odd, it's due to how cost-effective they are. 20 energy/2 upkeep for a unit that has a 55% Crit Chance and 9 Range is incredibly affordable relative to its power.
Last edited by AnemoneMeer; Aug 10, 2019 @ 4:56am
Astasia Aug 10, 2019 @ 5:09am 
In regards to mechanical units and psionic resistance, 4 resistance of an element is equal to 4 armor or shields, and mechanical units often have a lot more than 4 armor so psionic attacks are still hugely effective against them. One game as vanguard I was rolling around with squads of bikes with 9 armor, these are low tier mechanical units, psionic enemies were the only major threat to them other than enemy doomstacks.

Originally posted by Sloul:
Indentured snipers can be made to shoot 2 times? Can you explain?

The basic syndicate support unit has an ability that can be used on any indentured unit to give them a big buff and an extra turn. In auto-resolve this will kill your unit almost every time, in manual battle it can be mildly effective if you find a good indentured unit to buff.
Pinhead Larry Aug 10, 2019 @ 5:39am 
No love for the Assembly here? Maaaaan you didn't even put them on the list. Are they really THAT bad?
Last edited by Pinhead Larry; Aug 10, 2019 @ 5:39am
Kanjejou Aug 10, 2019 @ 6:17am 
Personally here what i felt:

1st Amazon: Easy buff debuff (blind poison ect...) lots of healing giving a superb early and very good late game unit thus they never realy drop, they get lots of bonuses that stack easily in war and economi. every secret tech work well with them.

Commander get healing and buff for animals thus can be super strong with some neutral faction and neutral reward.


2nd Vanguard: extremely balanced there is no big weakness to exploit in this army. Maybe struggling vs vehicules could be considered a problem but laser tech can help a lot. No unit is/feel useless. every secret tech work okay to fine with them.

Commander can go jack of all trade and still be good or specialise, very hard to go wrong


3rd Dvar: very good pikeman,bulwark is good but auto battle suicide them. But they mostly do explosiv and kinetic thus are easy to build against. Some of their units a a bit lackluster or harder to use, foreman and their tank for exemple( the foreman is pure support with very meh combat power nor good tanking) they tend to be one shot per turn unit (event heir base defences) thus can be extremely crippled by accuracy debuff. their army doesn't sinergise well with secret tech, xenoplague/celestian/psynumbra/voidtech are melee short range oriented and move fast, prometean is fire anti cover and defense which dvar already have synthesis units don't complement dvar very well but can help their mecanical units.

Commander= damage and tankiness resist stuff. very straightforward but very predictable.


4th Kir'ko syndicat and assembly. they all are good but a bit behind the three first guys:

Kir'ko: Supposed to move as a death stack to get swarm shield, because without it they die very fast but then you get hit by missed shots becaus eof that taking more damages then supposed. they hit hard tank decently but their over reliance on melee make them easy to funnel thus map can break you hard...and taking early losses is common and slow you down. they combo well with melee oriented secret tech xenoplague/celestian/psynumbra/voidtech, but promethean and synthesis give them long range option and mean to counter mecanical or heavy cover useage.

Commander tend to be here to go full melee berserker buff pole or bring guns to compensate for Kir'ko lakc of guns.


Syndicat: fast high damages excellent skill to save/not lose units. Don't like some unit design like their ugly anti grav war gallion or kingpin in chair(final units mostly), they have psy and arc damages so they don't suffer vs anything as a whole but you really need to hit the right target since psy suchvs mechanical and arc kind of suck vs biological. They don't combine so well with secret tech except void tech and synthesis that goes int he same direction as their basic gear but the 4 other can work its just that everythign won't probably be used. strong but not flexible, strong economi

Commander: cloak and dagger flanker sniper melee... whatever you do you hit hard and die hard usually

Assembly: I want to like them but they are ugly as sin and their arc+kinetic combo mean they rape mecanical but suffer vs biological out of melee, but they are kind of frail early on...so getting in melee is dangerous, very interesting tactical power synergise well with most secret tech since they give the assembly melee regen to melee unit thus xenoplague/celestian/psynumbra/voidtech are good, promethean help to counter your lack of defensiv option early on and give the aegis to anchor you army around, synthesis is easy because is work on cyborg and mechanical and youa re all cyborg mecanical, problem si that they give ark damage AGAIN and thus your just raping mechanical harder...

Commander: support medic raise undead double tap wizardry. make you army play harder faster and brign dead units back to life thus mitigating your army frailness, unfortunately it mean you may need to get mostly assembly heroes. Can be also played as a melee undying monster.


for Secret techs: I woudl say it depend when you want to rely on it and the passiv commander buff ans tactical/strategical stuff you get

Xenophage give self healing extra hp and almost free limitless army when you kill stuff but fall off late game(damage rank up quite a lot thus you get more units killed in a turn), decent commander stuff

Voidtech: super fast super usefull and quite strong but costly/very costly To use and first few tech are a bit meh, very good commander stuff, can ignore defence/positions/ranged fire.

Promethean, burn all annoy cover user resist debuff and tank ranged attacks, very good items(purging field being a free heal that doesn't end turn, meh commander buff. can be a pain to fight becasue of burnign groudn spam.

Celestial/psynumbra strong but work mostly on being hit/buffing moral or hitting other/debuffing their moral, very snowbally but if their effects are resisted early ijn battle they will struggle the rest of the battle. gimmick centered commander stuff.

Synthesis: Very good early items(+25% dodging+1armor is super good) Army wide buff and powerfull anti mechanical tactics and stratagem but meh vs biological, its a counter choice since later you get immunity to psy effect(good by psynumbra/celestail) or bio/physical effect(GG promethean/xenoplague), thus can counter the debuff that annoy you the most.
very specific commander bonuses...

For me they all have their use itsd more abotu wanting to counter play or be aggressiv?
Last edited by Kanjejou; Aug 10, 2019 @ 6:37am
Sloul Des Tucs Aug 10, 2019 @ 7:00am 
Originally posted by Astasia:
The basic syndicate support unit has an ability that can be used on any indentured unit to give them a big buff and an extra turn. In auto-resolve this will kill your unit almost every time, in manual battle it can be mildly effective if you find a good indentured unit to buff.
Oh right, but that's 1 snap shot and one normal shot then.

@SyzygyAhah, no, it's just that I didn't play with them and as such I didn't feel like I could comment on them, it's written in op :steammocking:

Originally posted by Kanjejou:
3rd Dvar: very good pikeman,bulwark is good but auto battle suicide them.
The square formation is pretty epic against cavalry.
their army doesn't sinergise well with secret tech,
Would agree, but they do hold the best Promethean units thanks to their +20% damage 'plasma' tech.


Last edited by Sloul Des Tucs; Aug 10, 2019 @ 7:02am
Prometheus Aug 10, 2019 @ 4:44pm 
On double shooting Snipers. Syndicate get a mod that turns a unit into an indentured. It can only be put on units from factions other than their own though. So they can't do it to their own Arc damage sniper. However the Kir'ko and Assembly snipers can be collared. After that the Syndicate Overseer (their support unit) can prod any Indentured unit and fully restore their action points. So a sniper in position can get two full shots off in a single turn. Its very effective.

Also another benefit of being Syndicate. Everybody focuses on the indentured discount. I get it, that is a strong doctrine. However I don't take it as my first doctrine. Noble Diplomats is stronger as your first doctrine if you play it friendly with the natives. The energy gain is more for your first at peace NPC faction and you get some influence income. Both keep going up as you improve your relations.
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Date Posted: Aug 10, 2019 @ 1:03am
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