Please no More Packs till Pathing gets fixed!

[mishellovesyou]

I've seriously dumped hundreds of hours into this game, and bought all the packs and I am so frustrated every time I try to get back into this game that I waste hours on a habitat idea only to find I cant get the habitat door on, or complete the path because I want to give the guests an overhead walk way. I will literally use the same work around from one habitat, on another habitat and for some reason it wont work. (Which is usually some sort of adjustments with the barrier posts height and position and barrier type around the door) I've scoured the internet, watched videos, I've heard ALL of your tips and there has not been an "Ah hah now I understand what the problem is" moment at any point in my hours of troubleshooting. "Obstructed" by what? please tell me. I'm building my habitats and paths on a 4M grid determined by you, the game so please tell me why YOUR math doesn't work?

[Wylie28]

Attaching things to paths removes them from the grid and permanently deforms them. (as the game has no way of knowing what it looked like before) The approximated path shape isn't going to be perfectly flush with the rest of the path because that's the nature of approximations. If you build entrances to things literally as close to paths as you can get and then remove them, this is the affect. Don't push your margins so close.

The "grid" isn't a grid is a compromise. There is no grid, the paths are just a free form navmesh. The "grid" system locks certain path pieces into place. When you attempt to alter its shape it can no longer be counted as part of the fake grid. As that would break the rest of the grid from functioning at all.

You can't have it all.

Free form paths and grids are not compatible ideas.

Simulated guests with individual thoughts, desires, pathfinding, goals, stats, etc and restriction-less navmesh blending also can't co-exist. If the navmesh can be quite literally ANY shape then pathfinding is VERY expensive and more than 100 guests will cripple your computer like 3000 does currently. Paths have to exist on splines and as such, can't just simply join anywhere. Splines have mathematical restrictions. This is what allows so many real guests. This is why JWE with its "improved" path system has fake guests and can't do what PZ does.

(Look up Spline Continuity on youtube)

You just have to deal with it.

[Varick]

Sorry you are having problems with the paths. If I am reading your post correctly, it sounds like you are using the game given solid habitat barriers. While I do not do overhead walkways, the following may be a solution for the obstruction notice you are receiving. Build your habitat barrier to whatever height you want and add the gate. Have a section of the fence where you want your path entry a little wider than the path and switch that piece to a null barrier then add a construction wall, rock, whatever to cover the null barrier and do your path into the habitat. This may not be what you mean.

[mishellovesyou]

I appreciate the time it took to write these messages but I'm not sure my issue was clear in my previous message. I'm not having an issue with the building or decor pieces, process of elimination determines the that the issue is between the path and the habitat door, both on the ground and on any overhead walkway I try to build that had to travel over the habitat door. I typically build ALL my paths aligning to the 4m grid. I only toggle it off when I need to connect doors to the paths on the grid, I did try seeing if I could toggle to it to solve this issue and didn't seem to help. I've tried toggling various collision items in settings, tunneling, terrain modification ect. And have not been able to find a reliable solution that works each time I try to make a path go over the barrier. (Yes I have dropped the barrier height ect also) But I have also had this issue before with just paths going over paths. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. There is no clear reason why, and I think at this point the game could at least show you where the obstruction is, or why you cant do what it is you're trying to do so you can adjust your design according to the limitation.

[E↗↗↗↗YA↗↘↗↘HA~~~]

I build path with grid too, I also don't know why sometimes is obstructed when I already flatten the terrain and toggle on/off everything I tried, but then if I build from another direction, or if I delete path and put path again, it will work. I wish one day they can release a tutorial and patch to make it clear what is the way to make path.

[audiolady]

Just a thought. When I have trouble with paths over walls, or even other paths, I start it farther away, then make the path higher off the ground. Maybe that would work for you? Hope it does.

[Jendowoz]

Also, you can turn on or check the highlight all obstructions, or something like that, which may show you where the obstruction is, I'm not sure if this does that, as I haven't used it before but noticed it when I was looking at other settings. But I may be wrong there. It was just a thought.

[Wylie28]

Messaggio originale di mishellovesyou:

I appreciate the time it took to write these messages but I'm not sure my issue was clear in my previous message. I'm not having an issue with the building or decor pieces, process of elimination determines the that the issue is between the path and the habitat door, both on the ground and on any overhead walkway I try to build that had to travel over the habitat door. I typically build ALL my paths aligning to the 4m grid. I only toggle it off when I need to connect doors to the paths on the grid, I did try seeing if I could toggle to it to solve this issue and didn't seem to help. I've tried toggling various collision items in settings, tunneling, terrain modification ect. And have not been able to find a reliable solution that works each time I try to make a path go over the barrier. (Yes I have dropped the barrier height ect also) But I have also had this issue before with just paths going over paths. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. There is no clear reason why, and I think at this point the game could at least show you where the obstruction is, or why you cant do what it is you're trying to do so you can adjust your design according to the limitation.

I explained exactly why. There is no grid. Your habitat door is NOT on one and will show "inconsistent" behavior if you try to pretend its on a grid its not on.

[mishellovesyou]

Messaggio originale di Jendowoz:

Also, you can turn on or check the highlight all obstructions, or something like that, which may show you where the obstruction is, I'm not sure if this does that, as I haven't used it before but noticed it when I was looking at other settings. But I may be wrong there. It was just a thought.

I do have this enabled but it doesn't exactly show anything that explains why a path cant travel over another path. there is no text, or colour indication or anything so I don't exactly know what kind of visual I am supposed to be looking for because its not obvious.

[mishellovesyou]

Messaggio originale di Wylie28:

Messaggio originale di mishellovesyou:

I appreciate the time it took to write these messages but I'm not sure my issue was clear in my previous message. I'm not having an issue with the building or decor pieces, process of elimination determines the that the issue is between the path and the habitat door, both on the ground and on any overhead walkway I try to build that had to travel over the habitat door. I typically build ALL my paths aligning to the 4m grid. I only toggle it off when I need to connect doors to the paths on the grid, I did try seeing if I could toggle to it to solve this issue and didn't seem to help. I've tried toggling various collision items in settings, tunneling, terrain modification ect. And have not been able to find a reliable solution that works each time I try to make a path go over the barrier. (Yes I have dropped the barrier height ect also) But I have also had this issue before with just paths going over paths. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. There is no clear reason why, and I think at this point the game could at least show you where the obstruction is, or why you cant do what it is you're trying to do so you can adjust your design according to the limitation.

I explained exactly why. There is no grid. Your habitat door is NOT on one and will show "inconsistent" behavior if you try to pretend its on a grid its not on.

This isn't exactly an issue with the barrier or habitat, again, I'm sorry my explanation isn't getting thru but Its really hard to explain with out a video.

The ground path IS on a grid. (4M)
To build an overhead walkway using a grid, it default snaps the height in a 3D 4x4M Grid also. Only SOMETIMES, does the game decide that the path on the second level is permitted to be above the ground path.

This is the issue, it just happens to be that this height restriction/default is also preventing me from placing a habitat door under the walk way, but its the path that's the problem, not the door, because the paths are the common denominator to re create this problem, not the barriers or doors. - Its a sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't and there is no clear reason why I cant make tunnels under certain paths that this height with out having to redo my designs making them go from 4 to 8 which ruins the look I'm going for and puts the spectators walk way too high above and too far from the animals I am trying to have them view.

Grid building was the only way I could tolerate figuring out how to play the game because free form paths didn't allow me to make anything symmetrical.

[Wylie28]

Messaggio originale di mishellovesyou:

Messaggio originale di Wylie28:

I explained exactly why. There is no grid. Your habitat door is NOT on one and will show "inconsistent" behavior if you try to pretend its on a grid its not on.

This isn't exactly an issue with the barrier or habitat, again, I'm sorry my explanation isn't getting thru but Its really hard to explain with out a video.

The ground path IS on a grid. (4M)
To build an overhead walkway using a grid, it default snaps the height in a 3D 4x4M Grid also. Only SOMETIMES, does the game decide that the path on the second level is permitted to be above the ground path.

This is the issue, it just happens to be that this height restriction/default is also preventing me from placing a habitat door under the walk way, but its the path that's the problem, not the door, because the paths are the common denominator to re create this problem, not the barriers or doors. - Its a sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't and there is no clear reason why I cant make tunnels under certain paths that this height with out having to redo my designs making them go from 4 to 8 which ruins the look I'm going for and puts the spectators walk way too high above and too far from the animals I am trying to have them view.

Grid building was the only way I could tolerate figuring out how to play the game because free form paths didn't allow me to make anything symmetrical.

Again. Because there IS NOT A GRID. Just because the UI widget says so doesn't mean that's what is happening under the hood. You are utilizing near perfect tolerances for a system that's estimating something it cannot actually do. The ground may not be completely flat. The paths you think are on a grid might not actually be perfectly straight. The path itself might not accurately represent the actual navmesh. I wouldn't be surprised if different path textures have different tolerances. Or you might just simply be running into floating point inaccuracy. Or. You could be running into many of this issues at different times or quite a few more problems I can list that are the result of there not actually being a path grid.

That's the problem. This is the price you pay for wanting free form paths AND AI that actually interact with the world. This is why other games have fake AI, paths truly on a grid and no free form ability, or don't even let you estimate anything like a grid at all. There is no grid. Only splines. Splines that CANNOT be perfectly continuous at all points while also maintaining local control. (which isn't even perfectly preserved as it is) They will have imperfections if you attempt to build "grids". The ones you are looking at aren't going to be perfect and the nav mesh you don't see is far worse. There is no technical problem. There is nothing devs can do. its mathematically impossible. And why no other game lets you try.

Don't push the tolerances to near pixel perfect precision. The math required for this game to run on your machine at all isn't capable of that level of accuracy. Its not inconsistent. The same line of code computes tolerances. Its perfectly consistent. But like with all estimations (and floating point calculations) it has an error margin, and you are attempting to operate within it.

[grampers62]

I wonder if the op Could post a picture of the area in question to illustrate more precisely what is occurring?

[AJ]

The path mechanics in this game are the worst thing about it. Constant fighting with it!

[mishellovesyou]

Messaggio originale di Wylie28:

Messaggio originale di mishellovesyou:

This isn't exactly an issue with the barrier or habitat, again, I'm sorry my explanation isn't getting thru but Its really hard to explain with out a video.

The ground path IS on a grid. (4M)
To build an overhead walkway using a grid, it default snaps the height in a 3D 4x4M Grid also. Only SOMETIMES, does the game decide that the path on the second level is permitted to be above the ground path.

This is the issue, it just happens to be that this height restriction/default is also preventing me from placing a habitat door under the walk way, but its the path that's the problem, not the door, because the paths are the common denominator to re create this problem, not the barriers or doors. - Its a sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't and there is no clear reason why I cant make tunnels under certain paths that this height with out having to redo my designs making them go from 4 to 8 which ruins the look I'm going for and puts the spectators walk way too high above and too far from the animals I am trying to have them view.

Grid building was the only way I could tolerate figuring out how to play the game because free form paths didn't allow me to make anything symmetrical.

Again. Because there IS NOT A GRID. Just because the UI widget says so doesn't mean that's what is happening under the hood. You are utilizing near perfect tolerances for a system that's estimating something it cannot actually do. The ground may not be completely flat. The paths you think are on a grid might not actually be perfectly straight. The path itself might not accurately represent the actual navmesh. I wouldn't be surprised if different path textures have different tolerances. Or you might just simply be running into floating point inaccuracy. Or. You could be running into many of this issues at different times or quite a few more problems I can list that are the result of there not actually being a path grid.

That's the problem. This is the price you pay for wanting free form paths AND AI that actually interact with the world. This is why other games have fake AI, paths truly on a grid and no free form ability, or don't even let you estimate anything like a grid at all. There is no grid. Only splines. Splines that CANNOT be perfectly continuous at all points while also maintaining local control. (which isn't even perfectly preserved as it is) They will have imperfections if you attempt to build "grids". The ones you are looking at aren't going to be perfect and the nav mesh you don't see is far worse. There is no technical problem. There is nothing devs can do. its mathematically impossible. And why no other game lets you try.

Don't push the tolerances to near pixel perfect precision. The math required for this game to run on your machine at all isn't capable of that level of accuracy. Its not inconsistent. The same line of code computes tolerances. Its perfectly consistent. But like with all estimations (and floating point calculations) it has an error margin, and you are attempting to operate within it.

Can you stop? You are over explaining something I don't have the ability to comprehend or understand and not providing me with any solution other than "just deal with it"

-I know what I want is possible because I literally did it on another part of my park, and I'm just trying to make the same habitat design in a different area of my park that I made already and I am annoyed that there is no reason why I cant re create the design again. I flatten the ENTIRE map before I build my parks so it should literally be all of the exact same variables as the other build in the other area of the park. This is what I mean about consistency, I should be able to do the same thing twice, if I am doing it under the same circumstances.

[Wylie28]

Messaggio originale di mishellovesyou:

Messaggio originale di Wylie28:

Again. Because there IS NOT A GRID. Just because the UI widget says so doesn't mean that's what is happening under the hood. You are utilizing near perfect tolerances for a system that's estimating something it cannot actually do. The ground may not be completely flat. The paths you think are on a grid might not actually be perfectly straight. The path itself might not accurately represent the actual navmesh. I wouldn't be surprised if different path textures have different tolerances. Or you might just simply be running into floating point inaccuracy. Or. You could be running into many of this issues at different times or quite a few more problems I can list that are the result of there not actually being a path grid.

That's the problem. This is the price you pay for wanting free form paths AND AI that actually interact with the world. This is why other games have fake AI, paths truly on a grid and no free form ability, or don't even let you estimate anything like a grid at all. There is no grid. Only splines. Splines that CANNOT be perfectly continuous at all points while also maintaining local control. (which isn't even perfectly preserved as it is) They will have imperfections if you attempt to build "grids". The ones you are looking at aren't going to be perfect and the nav mesh you don't see is far worse. There is no technical problem. There is nothing devs can do. its mathematically impossible. And why no other game lets you try.

Don't push the tolerances to near pixel perfect precision. The math required for this game to run on your machine at all isn't capable of that level of accuracy. Its not inconsistent. The same line of code computes tolerances. Its perfectly consistent. But like with all estimations (and floating point calculations) it has an error margin, and you are attempting to operate within it.

Can you stop? You are over explaining something I don't have the ability to comprehend or understand and not providing me with any solution other than "just deal with it"

-I know what I want is possible because I literally did it on another part of my park, and I'm just trying to make the same habitat design in a different area of my park that I made already and I am annoyed that there is no reason why I cant re create the design again. I flatten the ENTIRE map before I build my parks so it should literally be all of the exact same variables as the other build in the other area of the park. This is what I mean about consistency, I should be able to do the same thing twice, if I am doing it under the same circumstances.

Ill simplify. First try these things.

- Check if the ground is 100% flat. (make sure any habitat fences, or buildings aren't nearby to prevent terraforming. Flattening the ENTIRE map at once is very error prone. No way its perfect.
- Make sure no habitat gates or guest buildings are affecting the shape of your path
- Make sure when building your staircases you are using the exact same method every time. Is every piece of the path on the "grid". Do you have any 90 degree turns you might have build without the grid? Are the staircases themselves maybe not build on the grid? Is this the same path size as your previous attempts? You might be doing something this time you didn't the other two times.
- Try using the same path texture as before if you aren't.

If none of these work then its you are probably just be building within the error margin of the grid system itself. You can trying shifting the entire path over. Slightly changing the angle of everything until you find a time it works.

Im explaining why you might have to just deal with it. Planet Zoo's guest and path system is a compromise between freedom and performance. With that comes mathematical limitations. And specifically. Estimations. (numbers that are slightly incorrect). Your only solution may very well just be install a mod that removes all clipping/terrain restrictions. But such a thing will introduce its own oddities.

[mishellovesyou]

Messaggio originale di chasbar:

Messaggio originale di chasbar:

You can maybe place down a few flat roof pieces to achieve symmetry using them as a guide for your free form path. Once started use angle snap to help you to lay your path.

Have you tried my suggestion. Easy enough to understand.

Thank you but adding building pieces doesn't make the path click at any differently. I have tried building the path around the building, and the building around the path. I have also tried building the upper path first and lower path second, and vice versa.