The AC-130

[CaveMonkey]

This actually sounds bad ass!

[Ace]

Back to the topic at hand, I say make it something like the Blackfish from ArmA 3 where you have this extra chonky Osprey that you can then swap out modules on the undercarriage (think of the Sky Crane helicopter or Ka-26 helicopter) in order to give it different abilities, such as an attack role, or maybe more utility roles like mid-air refueling, personnel transport, maybe vehicle transport, or even AEW or heavy EW capabilities.

Now you have not just one new niche filled, but several, all wrapped into one potent support aircraft.

Of course that also sounds super complicated but here's hoping the dev feels this is a cool enough idea to tackle. If not, ah well, I'm sure he's got other cool ideas.

[Hijong park]

İlk olarak Ace tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Hijong park tarafından gönderildi:

Then We need to play VTOL VR as what it is : it's a game about flying specific VTOL capable aircrafts in VR, not jack of all trades kinds of game that is going to feature every single aircrafts in the world.

If someone desperately wants AC-130 in VR, the realistic choice is finding and supporting other games that fills their desire, Like this 'Angel of Death' game that's specifically made for AC-130 gameplay.

I realize this is a difficult concept to grasp for everyone who makes this argument, but maybe we want to, I don't know, have fun flying with other people who fly other planes in VTOL VR???

I don't even know how to respond to you trying to say it shouldn't be a jack-of-all-trades-game or whatever. One, nobody said it should be. It's a plane game. Two, why shouldn't the dev attempt to add more planes? It's entirely up to the dev what ideas he thinks are cool or aren't interesting enough to be worked on.

You dopes made the same argument for the F-14. "If you wanna fly an F-14, go play DCS!!" Well there was an F-14like added anyway. It's called the EF-24B. We want that equivalent for the AC-130. Airplane with big fat guns that shoot sideways.

I'm sure next you'll be arguing "wah wah wah the original VTOL plane almost nobody uses already fills that niche!" and "it'll be easy prey for SAM and enemy players" while ignoring the helicopter already in the game and also the fact that most players play coop.



My point is: Stop hating fun. Let people suggest things. Seriously, it's insane how many people in this community go "UMMM AKSHUALLY" every time someone suggests a potential new plane idea. None of this should be controversial.

Because I learned that the developer of VTOL VR have very strong desire on making his own game he want to play, and is not driven by community's needs.

If he just cared about money and population, non-VR mode, HOTAS support, A-10 would have been added by now. But no, he is a passionate indie developer who wanted to satisfy his own niche : A VR-only flight sim that can be played without HOTAS featuring futuristic VTOLs.

So I decided to respect his decision and stop suggesting My favorite aircrafts in this game, like MD-500, AH-6J, AH-1S, and OH-58D, because i think no amount of suggestion are going to change his mind.

Instead, I put the time and effort on finding and supporting other flight sims that offer different experience to VTOL VR, or just make some ♥♥♥♥♥ by myself while occasionally enjoying boundless dynamic's own offerings in VTOL VR.

That had very positive effect on me as I no longer need to stressfully wait for something that's not going to happen while writing tons of threads that is practically ineffective to changing the dev's mind.

so I found suggesting a new AC-130 VR game as a great idea, that game actually looks very promising and well pollished to satisfy AC-130 lovers.


Also I don't think EF-24B is really F-14 just because it has variable steep wing.
Otherwise F-111 and MiG-23 are tomcat as well.

its capability and the cockpit are entirely different, while F-45B actually feels like F-35. If someone buy EF-24 expecting the F-14 from topgun movies or DCS, he might be disappointed.

[Ace]

I don't even know where to start with this. It seems like all you and anyone else actually get out of arguing in these threads is acting like you're superior to everyone else for ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ on everyone else having a discussion and fantasizing about what might be fun.

So let's debunk these one by one I guess.

İlk olarak Hijong park tarafından gönderildi:

Because I learned that the developer of VTOL VR have very strong desire on making his own game he want to play, and is not driven by community's needs.

A strong desire to make his own game, not driven by community needs. Which is why he solicits community suggestions in his Discord. Oh wait a second. That makes no sense. Maybe he wants people to suggest things. Obviously it's still subject to what the dev wants to do but you act like it has to be one way or another. That's stupid.

İlk olarak Hijong park tarafından gönderildi:

If he just cared about money and population, non-VR mode, HOTAS support, A-10 would have been added by now. But no, he is a passionate indie developer who wanted to satisfy his own niche : A VR-only flight sim that can be played without HOTAS featuring futuristic VTOLs.

So I decided to respect his decision and stop suggesting My favorite aircrafts in this game, like MD-500, AH-6J, AH-1S, and OH-58D, because i think no amount of suggestion are going to change his mind.

Instead, I put the time and effort on finding and supporting other flight sims that offer different experience to VTOL VR, or just make some ♥♥♥♥♥ by myself while occasionally enjoying boundless dynamic's own offerings in VTOL VR.

Your original argument was bad and you make a lot of equally bad assumptions about what I think the dev wants. I've developed games too. It's nice to hear community ideas. I may or may not do them for a variety of reasons. When I want people to stop suggesting a certain idea, I'll tell them myself. Unless the dev has gone out of their way to say "I'm not interested in doing an AC-130-like aircraft" then we're going to keep fantasizing about what ifs.

Though by all means if you want to make me look like a buffoon, direct my attention to where he says that and I'll promptly shut up. If there's a list I don't know about that says "I don't want to do these ideas" then I'll stop talking about them. It's like when the H3VR dev said he wouldn't add guns-attached-to-guns because it didn't work in the framework of the game. So the community stopped asking. It was a happy surprise when he did it anyway, but nobody was demanding it.

Although your suggestions for aircraft particularly suck. AH-1 is literally just another attack helicopter which we already have. For some reason you suggest a little bird twice, and while a little bird would actually be neat because it's a totally different use case than a gunship heli, I don't know why you suggest it twice. What, do you mean an armed and unarmed variant? And the OH-58D is a very specific aircraft. Real life aircraft are never going to get into the game. Nobody is asking for a direct AC-130, we want an aircraft kind of like it with guns sticking out the side. I have no idea what makes the OH-58D so special so I can't comment but to me it just sounds like a worse little bird and I question what niche you're trying to fill. What would a fictional aircraft even look like that's supposed to mimic it?

The whole argument you're making here makes no sense.

İlk olarak Hijong park tarafından gönderildi:

That had very positive effect on me as I no longer need to stressfully wait for something that's not going to happen while writing tons of threads that is practically ineffective to changing the dev's mind.

That sounds like a personal problem. Look I got airplane autism as much as the next person here but I'm not stressing out about it. What does irk me is when people like you show up and start posting garbage about how we're not allowed to have fun talking about what maybe could be.

Let us dream. It's fun. It promotes discussion in the community. And if we're lucky, maybe, just maybe, the dev thinks an idea is neat too and decides to start fiddling with it. And if he doesn't? Well I don't see anyone complaining about it. If I do, I'll be the first one to tell them to not be such entitled little crybabies.

We're having fun talking about what a fictional analogue of the AC-130 could look like in the context of VTOL VR. Stop going "UMMM ASKSHUALLY" because, as I said before, you hate fun.

İlk olarak Hijong park tarafından gönderildi:

so I found suggesting a new AC-130 VR game as a great idea, that game actually looks very promising and well pollished to satisfy AC-130 lovers.

Cool. We don't want to fly an AC-130. We want to fly a plane like an AC-130, and we want to fly it alongside our friends in multiplayer, should a mission maker will it. If you want to fly an AC-130, and only an AC-130, go play that other game.

Perhaps all this is a bit more clear now? This is very grating. Every time anyone suggests any new plane idea there's always someone coming along who has to sit there being a spoil sport telling us why we're wrong for chatting about it.

İlk olarak Hijong park tarafından gönderildi:

Also I don't think EF-24B is really F-14 just because it has variable steep wing.
Otherwise F-111 and MiG-23 are tomcat as well.

its capability and the cockpit are entirely different, while F-45B actually feels like F-35. If someone buy EF-24 expecting the F-14 from topgun movies or DCS, he might be disappointed.

Bad faith argument.

If it looks like a Tomcat, growls like a Tomcat, and launches from carriers like a Tomcat, it might not be a Tomcat, but it's pretty damn obvious what it's inspired by. But you can't just have another fighter since we already have one of those, so the dev came up with a new niche and made a fictional plane.

Literally what we wanted.

[Hijong park]

İlk olarak Ace tarafından gönderildi:

I don't even know where to start with this. It seems like all you and anyone else actually get out of arguing in these threads is acting like you're superior to everyone else for ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ on everyone else having a discussion and fantasizing about what might be fun.

So let's debunk these one by one I guess.

İlk olarak Hijong park tarafından gönderildi:

Because I learned that the developer of VTOL VR have very strong desire on making his own game he want to play, and is not driven by community's needs.

A strong desire to make his own game, not driven by community needs. Which is why he solicits community suggestions in his Discord. Oh wait a second. That makes no sense. Maybe he wants people to suggest things. Obviously it's still subject to what the dev wants to do but you act like it has to be one way or another. That's stupid.

İlk olarak Hijong park tarafından gönderildi:

If he just cared about money and population, non-VR mode, HOTAS support, A-10 would have been added by now. But no, he is a passionate indie developer who wanted to satisfy his own niche : A VR-only flight sim that can be played without HOTAS featuring futuristic VTOLs.

So I decided to respect his decision and stop suggesting My favorite aircrafts in this game, like MD-500, AH-6J, AH-1S, and OH-58D, because i think no amount of suggestion are going to change his mind.

Instead, I put the time and effort on finding and supporting other flight sims that offer different experience to VTOL VR, or just make some ♥♥♥♥♥ by myself while occasionally enjoying boundless dynamic's own offerings in VTOL VR.

Your original argument was bad and you make a lot of equally bad assumptions about what I think the dev wants. I've developed games too. It's nice to hear community ideas. I may or may not do them for a variety of reasons. When I want people to stop suggesting a certain idea, I'll tell them myself. Unless the dev has gone out of their way to say "I'm not interested in doing an AC-130-like aircraft" then we're going to keep fantasizing about what ifs.

Though by all means if you want to make me look like a buffoon, direct my attention to where he says that and I'll promptly shut up. If there's a list I don't know about that says "I don't want to do these ideas" then I'll stop talking about them. It's like when the H3VR dev said he wouldn't add guns-attached-to-guns because it didn't work in the framework of the game. So the community stopped asking. It was a happy surprise when he did it anyway, but nobody was demanding it.

Although your suggestions for aircraft particularly suck. AH-1 is literally just another attack helicopter which we already have. For some reason you suggest a little bird twice, and while a little bird would actually be neat because it's a totally different use case than a gunship heli, I don't know why you suggest it twice. What, do you mean an armed and unarmed variant? And the OH-58D is a very specific aircraft. Real life aircraft are never going to get into the game. Nobody is asking for a direct AC-130, we want an aircraft kind of like it with guns sticking out the side. I have no idea what makes the OH-58D so special so I can't comment but to me it just sounds like a worse little bird and I question what niche you're trying to fill. What would a fictional aircraft even look like that's supposed to mimic it?

The whole argument you're making here makes no sense.

İlk olarak Hijong park tarafından gönderildi:

That had very positive effect on me as I no longer need to stressfully wait for something that's not going to happen while writing tons of threads that is practically ineffective to changing the dev's mind.

That sounds like a personal problem. Look I got airplane autism as much as the next person here but I'm not stressing out about it. What does irk me is when people like you show up and start posting garbage about how we're not allowed to have fun talking about what maybe could be.

Let us dream. It's fun. It promotes discussion in the community. And if we're lucky, maybe, just maybe, the dev thinks an idea is neat too and decides to start fiddling with it. And if he doesn't? Well I don't see anyone complaining about it. If I do, I'll be the first one to tell them to not be such entitled little crybabies.

We're having fun talking about what a fictional analogue of the AC-130 could look like in the context of VTOL VR. Stop going "UMMM ASKSHUALLY" because, as I said before, you hate fun.

İlk olarak Hijong park tarafından gönderildi:

so I found suggesting a new AC-130 VR game as a great idea, that game actually looks very promising and well pollished to satisfy AC-130 lovers.

Cool. We don't want to fly an AC-130. We want to fly a plane like an AC-130, and we want to fly it alongside our friends in multiplayer, should a mission maker will it. If you want to fly an AC-130, and only an AC-130, go play that other game.

Perhaps all this is a bit more clear now? This is very grating. Every time anyone suggests any new plane idea there's always someone coming along who has to sit there being a spoil sport telling us why we're wrong for chatting about it.

İlk olarak Hijong park tarafından gönderildi:

Also I don't think EF-24B is really F-14 just because it has variable steep wing.
Otherwise F-111 and MiG-23 are tomcat as well.

its capability and the cockpit are entirely different, while F-45B actually feels like F-35. If someone buy EF-24 expecting the F-14 from topgun movies or DCS, he might be disappointed.

Bad faith argument.

If it looks like a Tomcat, growls like a Tomcat, and launches from carriers like a Tomcat, it might not be a Tomcat, but it's pretty damn obvious what it's inspired by. But you can't just have another fighter since we already have one of those, so the dev came up with a new niche and made a fictional plane.

Literally what we wanted.

Sorry, You are the winner in this argument, my argument look bad by now.


I actually made many false assumptions because It looked like OP wants the literal AC-130 in VR, and I had been thinking that The dev is a person who doesn't care suggestions much or get affected by communitiy needs as He is very passionate on doing things that other flight sims hadn't done and I thought he don't want his game to be similar to any other flight sims, by never adding HOTAS support and A-10 and other popular aircrafts no matter what.


that made me to conclude that There's zero point in discussing new planes for VTOL VR, but now i stand corrected thanks to your superior argument and reasoning.

[醉仙望月]

İlk olarak Ace tarafından gönderildi:

Unless the dev has gone out of their way to say "I'm not interested in doing an AC-130-like aircraft" then we're going to keep fantasizing about what ifs.

The dev did not directly comment on requests to add a flyable gunship similar to the AC-130, but when someone asked to allow players to fly an AWACS aircraft, he rejected it, saying "unless you mean actually flying it but that's just taking off and pressing altitude hold".
A gunship pilot is inevitably like this. After taking off, turn on the autopilot and there's nothing to do.

İlk olarak Ace tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak 醉仙望月 tarafından gönderildi:

Why would you want to play the AC-130 in VR?
Its gunner will stare at a virtual flat screen for the entire game, at that point why even use VR

shut

And you skipped my question.
When someone asked Project Gunship to add VR mode, its developer refused and agreed with my point, saying: "This really is the answer that I have. It actually would add an extra layer of complexity to the game that may only provide a marginal difference in the overall experience."

İlk olarak Ace tarafından gönderildi:

Although your suggestions for aircraft particularly suck. AH-1 is literally just another attack helicopter which we already have. For some reason you suggest a little bird twice, and while a little bird would actually be neat because it's a totally different use case than a gunship heli, I don't know why you suggest it twice. What, do you mean an armed and unarmed variant? And the OH-58D is a very specific aircraft. Real life aircraft are never going to get into the game. Nobody is asking for a direct AC-130, we want an aircraft kind of like it with guns sticking out the side. I have no idea what makes the OH-58D so special so I can't comment but to me it just sounds like a worse little bird and I question what niche you're trying to fill. What would a fictional aircraft even look like that's supposed to mimic it?
The whole argument you're making here makes no sense.

I can see why he mentioned helicopter gunships. It's the same reason you skipped above.
You want a multi-crew aircraft with guns sticking out the side. But being a VR game, players shouldn’t just be staring at a flat screen, so the gunner would have to be either a door gunner who can see out, or have a helmet display for situational awareness or head-mounted sight like an attack helicopter operator.
Also, only helicopters can keep the pilot busy instead of sitting on autopilot while the gunner enjoys shooting.

[Rockethead293]

it would be good as a singleplayer craft. but singleplayer only.

[Ace]

İlk olarak 醉仙望月 tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Ace tarafından gönderildi:

Unless the dev has gone out of their way to say "I'm not interested in doing an AC-130-like aircraft" then we're going to keep fantasizing about what ifs.

The dev did not directly comment on requests to add a flyable gunship similar to the AC-130, but when someone asked to allow players to fly an AWACS aircraft, he rejected it, saying "unless you mean actually flying it but that's just taking off and pressing altitude hold".
A gunship pilot is inevitably like this. After taking off, turn on the autopilot and there's nothing to do.

İlk olarak Ace tarafından gönderildi:

shut

And you skipped my question.
When someone asked Project Gunship to add VR mode, its developer refused and agreed with my point, saying: "This really is the answer that I have. It actually would add an extra layer of complexity to the game that may only provide a marginal difference in the overall experience."

İlk olarak Ace tarafından gönderildi:

Although your suggestions for aircraft particularly suck. AH-1 is literally just another attack helicopter which we already have. For some reason you suggest a little bird twice, and while a little bird would actually be neat because it's a totally different use case than a gunship heli, I don't know why you suggest it twice. What, do you mean an armed and unarmed variant? And the OH-58D is a very specific aircraft. Real life aircraft are never going to get into the game. Nobody is asking for a direct AC-130, we want an aircraft kind of like it with guns sticking out the side. I have no idea what makes the OH-58D so special so I can't comment but to me it just sounds like a worse little bird and I question what niche you're trying to fill. What would a fictional aircraft even look like that's supposed to mimic it?
The whole argument you're making here makes no sense.

I can see why he mentioned helicopter gunships. It's the same reason you skipped above.
You want a multi-crew aircraft with guns sticking out the side. But being a VR game, players shouldn’t just be staring at a flat screen, so the gunner would have to be either a door gunner who can see out, or have a helmet display for situational awareness or head-mounted sight like an attack helicopter operator.
Also, only helicopters can keep the pilot busy instead of sitting on autopilot while the gunner enjoys shooting.

Sorry, I seem to have mistakenly combined your talking points with someone else when replying to this thread. Hence, my short (and rude/dismissive) responses. I apologize for that. You actually do make some decent points as to why an AC-130like aircraft might not be very much fun in the context of VTOL VR.

When you say it like that, staring at a flat screen, like I think that would be okay, but I also perfectly understand the argument of why it might not be very fun. Why be in VR if you're just staring at a flat screen anyway? Certainly can seem silly.

I for one would not have a whole-ass crew of guys in a fictional analogue to the AC-130, I'd just have a copilot who would then also have access to firing the weapons out the side. Said copilot could take over flying the plane if necessary. Also, it doesn't have to just be an AC-130. If it is, I do think that is really skimping out on the full potential of what kind of aircraft this could be. The idea I like to think about is something modular where you have a basic V-22 on steroids looking aircraft that you can then swap out the main body to have different utilities from cargo to ground attack to maybe even AEW/EW or refueling. Suddenly the idea gets a lot more interesting. I haven't played Nuclear Option but I think they do something like that with one of their planes, based on some videos I've seen? I'm not sure.

But your core argument is not actually that flawed, I'll tell you that much. I see the merit in the point that merely staring at a screen as you would with a real AC-130 to be very dull in a VR game. You'd need more to it than that. I think it can still be done, though. You just can't confine yourself to only making it an AC-130 bootleg. Like, just how the EF-24 is not just a Tomcat. Tomcats are cool but if it were just a legally distinct Tomcat like why bother? We already have the F/A-26. Instead it adds a whole new EW mechanic, which is fun. An AC-130like plane needs to do more than just be an AC-130 or like what's the point in a VR game?

[Kit]

Nah, it's lame. Give me dynamic campaigns, smart ground units, 64 players 24\7 dedicated constant online war servers. And planes for red side. Now that would be cool.

[Ace]

İlk olarak Kit tarafından gönderildi:

Nah, it's lame. Give me dynamic campaigns, smart ground units, 64 players 24\7 dedicated constant online war servers. And planes for red side. Now that would be cool.

I mean, this is all amazing, yes, but I don't understand why these things are mutually exclusive.

But I'd definitely want those things first... AC-130 thing idea can wait until later in development, if ever.

[Kit]

İlk olarak Ace tarafından gönderildi:

I don't understand why these things are mutually exclusive

Because this game is developed by one man and he refuses to expand to team, and as any man he has only 24 hours in day, so if he's working on AC-130, he's not working on better singleplayer\multiplayer

[Ace]

İlk olarak Kit tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Ace tarafından gönderildi:

I don't understand why these things are mutually exclusive

Because this game is developed by one man and he refuses to expand to team, and as any man he has only 24 hours in day, so if he's working on AC-130, he's not working on better singleplayer\multiplayer

I think the dev is smart enough to know that. The community however is complete cancer. Unlike say, H3VR, where we discuss fun ideas that may or may not ever be in the game, with no concern over the dev's resources because we know none of us control him, here in VTOL VR we constantly ♥♥♥♥ on other people's ideas and discussions because God forbid the previous dev take time and effort away from the thing you want.

This community is pretty trash as far as flight sims is concerned, and that's saying a lot.

The dev is going to do what the dev wants. None of us control that. Stop acting like it does and let us entertain ourselves by talking about things.

[Kit]

You're taking it all too close to the heart, don't you think? Relax a bit

[Ace]

İlk olarak Kit tarafından gönderildi:

You're taking it all too close to the heart, don't you think? Relax a bit

Tell that to the people who rant and riot while the rest of us wanna just talk about planes and vibe.

[Kit]

İlk olarak Ace tarafından gönderildi:

Tell that to the people who rant and riot

I am.

[Ace]

İlk olarak Kit tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Ace tarafından gönderildi:

Tell that to the people who rant and riot

I am.

I wouldn't be doing so if the community's attitude to these discussions amounted to "No fun allowed"