Two Amiri Freebooter Builds: Which is Better?

[Ash Wednesday Valentine]

One with Alchemist (second build, scroll down):
https://www.neoseeker.com/pathfinder-kingmaker/builds/Amiri

One without:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder_Kingmaker/comments/c5bgtl/when_and_what_to_multiclass_amiri_to/

I guess Alchemist is going to give a lot more defense, but going without will have much more powerful spells and more of them?

[Mork]

The second one

In my opinion, the point of a Freebooter is to get to level 4 as fast as possible to get the flanking mass buff.

If it was me, i would go with something like this
Level 1: Barbarian
Level 2-6: Freebooter
Level 7: Barbarian
Level 8: x (Pretty much anything is good at that point...)

So very similar to the second build.

The first one is too much a min maxer build for my taste...

[mbradtke]

just go full barbarian, freebooter is nice to have but unless you MC depends on it, not really necessary... and it gimps Amiri's rage progression, either go full Barbarian and stick to her recommanded class or go something else but being a low Int char Alchemist makes no sense roleplaywise,
6 freebooter gives acces to shatter defense what is interesting option tough but she can achieve very high attack bonus already so.... even as barbarian you will be fine most likely

[Orion Pax]

I’ve done a splice of both. I agree with Mork that the Freebooter’s main point is to get to lvl. 4 for the +2 attack bonus. It’s the easier of the two functions to use (can do it before combat, affects all team members on all enemies). Level 6 gets you easy Shatter Defenses (bypassing Dazzling and Weapon Focus if you want), so that’s another reason to prioritize Freebooter early.

That said, I couldn’t help the Vivisectionist dip early to juice her STR, AC, and Sneak dmg. Downside to that is you don’t advance BAB, but whatevs.

After finishing 6 levels of Freebooter, I gave a couple more Vivi levels (to 4), and the rest Two-Handed Fighter (again for feats mostly). Filled out with Cleave, Crane, and Vital Stirke lines.

Mine looked something like:

1. Barb
2. FreeB
3. FreeB (Power Attack + Cleave)
4. Vivi
5. FreeB (Outflank)
6. FreeB
7. FreeB (Cleaving Finish)
8. FreeB (Shatter)
9. Vivi (Imp. Unarmed Str. + Dodge)
10. Vivi
11. Vivi (Crane Style + Crane Wing)
12. TH Fighter (Crane Riposte)
(rest TH Fighter)

Even though I was using reach weapons, I still always felt the +8 to AC from Crane helpful. Had enough feats to spend. I’m hindsight I might build it a bit differently now. But hey.

[mbradtke]

shatter defense is good but also requires full time demoralized enemy so it depends a lot on the party composation, not a fan of Vivi on Amiri but if that works for you...
not sure why you would take crane line on her tough, she is no tank, so pretty much a waste, esp. if u use reach weapon and enlarge person

[Orion Pax]

My experience (in turn-based) is that enemies don't care too much if you have a reach weapon. Sure they target the front more, but not exclusively. They come from multiple angles often. And sometimes I need this particular melee to hit that particular enemy, taking it out from behind safety. In short, it's not always feasible to hide behind another tankier friend.

Maybe that's just my playstyle. I prefer to have the flexibility for them to go and handle their business. I find melee characters that can't take hits to be dicey. Reach weapon gives someone greater range which is useful for many reasons.

[mbradtke]

problem is serious enemies will still hit amiri, no matter what, she is no tank and even valerie still struggles with difficult enemies because some have very high attack rolls, and lesser enemies dont matter much also amiri has enough HP to survive em, esp. with rage hp bonus and high barbarian hit dice if u stick to her primary class, it all doesnt matter if u play on a lower difficulty but if u play on hard and above there are far better strategies like keeping her on range, blurring her with casters and if u really have to, you can still use vanish spell or potions to remove her from the hate list

[valium]

Wasnt a fan of Amiri on hard difficulty regardless, but when I was doing her quests, going full barb for the beast line and pounce, she made a good backline flanker.

If you dont mind respeccing her, going for a mad dog build is probably the best option, but that wasnt my jam, I keep things vanilla.

[D-Black Catto]

Originally posted by valium:

Wasnt a fan of Amiri on hard difficulty regardless, but when I was doing her quests, going full barb for the beast line and pounce, she made a good backline flanker.

If you dont mind respeccing her, going for a mad dog build is probably the best option, but that wasnt my jam, I keep things vanilla.

Nah, take two levels in barbarain(to get rage power feats) and eventually choose reckless stance and the upgrade that gives bonuses to her allies as well

Then go two handed fighter for the remaining 18 levels

And give her a weapon with reach like glavie(once you get a decent one) so she can hit enemies from behind the other characters/summons

[Orion Pax]

Originally posted by mbradtke:

problem is serious enemies will still hit amiri, no matter what, she is no tank.

Exactly my point. Hence helping her with some AC since she is a melee. Giving her Crane feats doesn't make her a tank. It makes her tougher by degree, allows her to get hit some of the time (+ reach weapon minimizes some vulnerability). Val / your tank can still take the brunt, but getting +8 AC from Crane feats is a pretty efficient bonus.

Originally posted by valium:

Wasnt a fan of Amiri on hard difficulty regardless, but when I was doing her quests, going full barb for the beast line and pounce, she made a good backline flanker.

This is what I did on my last playthrough. I really dig pounce - it just stinks it takes so long to get to it. Not saying it should come earlier. But I benched her as soon as I got the chance.

[dwarfpcfan]

My favorite build for her so far is Barb 2/2 Handed fighter 7/ Rogue (usually thug) 11

Still excellent to hit, stacks damage very high thanks to 2H fighter damage boosts with 2handers and sneak attack dice. Give her a reach weapon and she's basically always flanking

bonus feats from fighter and rogue as well so plenty of options to build her right.

[asame_akio]

I went with a vital strike build for my freebooter Amiri. Haven’t taken it to high levels yet, and I’m not playing on high difficulties so the meta’s a bit different, but I still like how it came out, more or less. I’m planning on sticking envy of the master in her armor slot towards endgame to boost her Int and Wis, since I should have better gear for dedicated casters by then.

L1: Barbarian 1 (Exotic WP Bastard, Toughness)
L2: Freebooter 1
L3: Freebooter 2 (Cleave, menacing style: Power Attack)
L4: Freebooter 3
L5: Freebooter 4 (Cleaving Finish)
L6: Two-Handed Fighter (bonus: Vital Strike)
L7: Freebooter 5 (Great Cleave)
L8: Freebooter 6 (menacing style: Shatter Defenses)
L9: Freebooter 7 (Outflank)
L10: Two-Handed Fighter 2 (bonus: Improved Cleaving Finish)
L11: Freebooter 8 (Improved Vital Strike)
L12: Freebooter 9
L13: Freebooter 10 (Skill Focus Persuasion, menacing style: Dreadful Carnage)
L14: Sword Saint 1 (bonus: Weapon Focus Bastard Sword)
L15: Sword Saint 2 (Improved Critical Bastard Sword)
L16: Sword Saint 3 (arcana: Extended Magic)
L17: Sword Saint 4 (Greater Vital Strike)

Haven’t planned beyond 17 yet, since that more or less achieves the basic concept of the build, but pretty nearly anything will work at that point. I just liked the idea of Vital Strike for Amiri since she’s so attached to her sword, and it works out decently mechanically since it’s an oversized weapon, so giving her some additional effective size increases via lead blades and actual size increases via a friendly caster will quickly stack dice for a vital strike. Improved Cleaving Finish plus reach from size increases will help spread that around. Sword Saint is mostly there for perfect strike to maximize those vital strikes, though the support spells and arcana (I believe I tested extended magic, and found that it will affect spells from other lists, so it can be used on lead blades) are a nice bonus. Maybe on a mechanical level sticking an Int casting class doesn’t make a lot of sense for Amiri, but I flavor it in RP less as “she’s a smart magus” and more as “she’s so focused on getting that one devastating giant chop in that she’s developed these particular supernatural powers to facilitate that.”

Obviously not even remotely tanky, but I haven’t found it particularly difficult in turn-based to maneuver her around the battlefield in a way where she’s not really taking many hits. In early-to-mid-levels she’s switching between vital strike and cleave where it makes sense to do so, and switching between a reach weapon and her bastard sword where that makes sense, and she’s been a pretty decent damage contributor.

[Orion Pax]

I’ve come to appreciate Vital Strike late in my Freebooter builds. I had thought I’d use it mostly on a turn I used Freebooter’s Bane. But what I found was I needed to move & hit and enemy more often than using Bane without moving. Vital Strike allows you to move and hit hard.

So in the future I am inclined to use it on more melee builds. I had previously felt it wasn’t terribly relevant because a full round attack was simply better. But I guess my playstyle being more mobile means being able to move and hit on the same turn happens more as I finish enemies off.

[valium]

Vital strike builds are fairly popular along with reach weapons and the cleaving line. If you like big numbers, this is a fun way to build.