Valerie Builds

[Orion Pax]

Curious to hear how people like to build Valerie these days? She can go several directions, which is fun.

For me, I find:
1) Don't care to focus on Tower Shield Specialist much until late game due to lack of good Tower Shields. So maybe level 2 or 4 early for feats? Save level 5 til late.
2) I have mostly tended to give mostly Bard levels so she can take over Inspire late.
3) Early game I find myself trying to scratch out anything that will help her tank better and hit at least some of the time. That has usually meant 1-2 levels of Vivi just for the shot in the arm. Is that weird?
4) In theory would like to rely on her to Dazzle, but early on, on harder difficulties, she can't seem to Dazzle much for me. Her stats have potential, but take some levels to round off (DEX, CON, CHA all odd numbers, STR even but low for melee).

Do folks go Stalwart much? She's obviously setup for that. I just found I rarely used Stalwart's main feature since I do want to be able to move w/ out penalty most battles.

Thoughts?

[mbradtke]

mirror image is nice to have but i think it it better to get it later, spell slots are rather limited at early levels and i rather like to keep my valerie as pure martial char to deck her out with with martial classes and feats than to relay on a few mirrow images the whole time to survive, you can get her AC so high with proper feats, classes and gear, you dont need mirror image so early, of course you can go bard 4 early to get the 2 casts and it can be very handy but it comes with drawbacks of course, going archeologist 2 with DD later to get some spells just makes more sense to me as she will also have more CHR later and you will have the important feats at that point

[Zuloph]

My favourite build for Valerie that I ever did was
2 Fighter
3 Sorcerer
4 Dragon Disciple
10 Eldritch Knight
1 Thug

Gave her Arcane Armour Training + Mastery and had her running around in Mith Full Plate at the end of the game with only 5% spell fail on the chance she had to rebuff during combat, took armour off outside of combat for buffing

Focused on 2h weapons, with the Sorcerer levels she got access to the Shield spell so she didn't really need to be carrying a shield any more

With the thug level you can probably also tell I did the whole Dazzling Display / Dreadful Carnage build too. The build overall was quite effective. Mirror images + High AC is always a nice combo. I only ran the build on Core though and it was a bit slow to start. Once she hit level 7 though and finally got Mirror Image she really started taking off.

[Orion Pax]

Originally posted by mbradtke:

mirror image is nice to have but i think it it better to get it later, spell slots are rather limited at early levels and i rather like to keep my valerie as pure martial char to deck her out with with martial classes and feats than to relay on a few mirrow images the whole time to survive, you can get her AC so high with proper feats, classes and gear, you dont need mirror image so early, of course you can go bard 4 early to get the 2 casts and it can be very handy but it comes with drawbacks of course, going archeologist 2 with DD later to get some spells just makes more sense to me as she will also have more CHR later and you will have the important feats at that point

Martial early for Val is what I do as well for similar reasons.

I found I don’t prioritize as much the extra AC feats other than Crane, although those are solid choices, because having a super tank I’ve found to be less impactful for winning battles than a solid tank with other melees who are also reasonably tough. Reason being that if most of my group is limping after tough fights and/or time is elapsing and buffs, spells, and abilities start wearing off, it’s time to rest. Having one person who outlasts all that doesn’t gain me anything I feel.

Mirror Image I’ve found to be amazingly useful at any time. Especially for painful archer attacks.

[Frostfeather]

Originally posted by Zuloph:

My favourite build for Valerie that I ever did was
2 Fighter
3 Sorcerer
4 Dragon Disciple
10 Eldritch Knight
1 Thug

Gave her Arcane Armour Training + Mastery and had her running around in Mith Full Plate at the end of the game with only 5% spell fail on the chance she had to rebuff during combat, took armour off outside of combat for buffing

Focused on 2h weapons, with the Sorcerer levels she got access to the Shield spell so she didn't really need to be carrying a shield any more

With the thug level you can probably also tell I did the whole Dazzling Display / Dreadful Carnage build too. The build overall was quite effective. Mirror images + High AC is always a nice combo. I only ran the build on Core though and it was a bit slow to start. Once she hit level 7 though and finally got Mirror Image she really started taking off.

I did something like this once, too! Had some interesting potential for Stunning Barrier since she can actually take a hit.

[valium]

Eldritch Knight is just busted, not my cup of tea.

[talemore]

magus

[GeorgeJJR]

I used the build from GameFaqs and was very happy with the result (finished at level 19)

(https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/pc/242460-pathfinder-kingmaker/faqs/78307/valerie-main-tank)

Basically fighter 9, Rogue 4, Stalwart Defender 6 at lvl 19 finish. Great tank.

[mbradtke]

rogues dont have the most noble image, i think valerie would agree with me...
therefore i dont like rogue levels on my valerie /:
also i dont think it is that good, main reson would be the lv 4 injury ability,
but often she is in the middle of several mobs, to trigger sneak attack u'll usually need another one attacking the same target, what is manageable but still can be difficult at times if u want her to super tank a boss f.e

[asame_akio]

I don’t consider classes to be something visible within the world—I see them more as constructs for the players and GM to define the mechanics. There are some inextricably connected with a profession, like paladin, but people aren’t necessarily going to consider themselves rogues even if they know how to deal extra damage to foes they can catch off guard. There are a lot of potential ways to flavor abstracted mechanical constructs within the game itself. A cleric doesn’t have to be a formal priest and vice versa.

[talemore]

Many feats are given by class that just having 1 in every class you unlock 1/3 of all feats.

[Janthis]

Originally posted by mbradtke:

rogues dont have the most noble image, i think valerie would agree with me...
therefore i dont like rogue levels on my valerie /:

Yeah, someone who wants to roleplay or follow a character's theme wouldn't give Valerie thug or vivisectionist levels. It's a case of gameplay/story segregation. Thankfully there are easier difficulties for people like me who just want to rp/follow the story too. :)

[ptirodaktill]

Not sure why vivi don`t fit her. She is litteraly chaotic evil during her scar arc.
But well, her she is a bardic monk =) With a little extra vivi for bite attack.
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/2015978842873484845/97AF457F293DBD4F5945D6FA426E5646A9C61247/

[Frostfeather]

Originally posted by valium:

Eldritch Knight is just busted, not my cup of tea.

You mean it's too strong? EK is so versatile that it doesn't necessarily end up op. And Val certainly isn't an ideal base for it either.

There are some classes and abilities I almost never use because they're too strong (Arcane Trickster, Deadly Earth, etc) but EK is fine to me as long as it's not min/maxed.

[Orion Pax]

Nice yup. My next Val build looks something like:

Early (1-6)
[TSS], Vivi, TSS (WF + Dazzling), Monk (Crane S), TSS (Outflank), TSS (Crane W)
—> Keeps BAB up mostly. Crane Wing at 6. May take Accomplished ahead of Dazzling.

Mid (7-18)
Bard 1 (Accomplished), DD, DD (Shatter + Initiative), DD, DD (Improved Crit), rest Bard 8.

Late (19-20)
TSS 5, Vivi 2

Don’t need to support intimidate since Dirging. So rest of feats negotiable.

[valium]

Originally posted by night4:

Originally posted by valium:

Eldritch Knight is just busted, not my cup of tea.

You mean it's too strong? EK is so versatile that it doesn't necessarily end up op. And Val certainly isn't an ideal base for it either.

There are some classes and abilities I almost never use because they're too strong (Arcane Trickster, Deadly Earth, etc) but EK is fine to me as long as it's not min/maxed.

Eldritch Knight can easily trivialize the game, same with base kineticist, which is why I limit my use of it to the kinetic knight. I know Val isnt the best EK ever, but the entire prestige class turns me off.