A Just Reward

[e11]

I'm sorry, but WHO DESIGNED THIS QUEST??

Challenge is one thing, but this is just impossible for a lower level character.

I'm trying to survive with my paladin. I managed to kill the hydra with the help of some potions, but that owlbear is complete murder. I tried going invisible, going around the manticore and past the redcaps. But there's a trap, and I don't have a weapon that can hurt them.

So I try invisibility again (as the quest suggests!!) but the owlbear spots me most of the time.

I make it past the owlbear, and there's a completely unavoidable set of traps. That giant plant murders my ass each time I try to fight it. I make it past the plant after several tries, and I CAN'T EXIT THE MAP.

I'm going to have to restart an earlier save, because this is literally impossible. I literally can't avoid being seen by the plant, and literally can't exit the freaking map.

Overall I love the game, but this is just dumb.

[Mysteria]

Oh, the invisibility wasn’t the problem. It was figuring out which way to go without running into monsters that completely ignore the fact that you are invisible.

(Btw, did I mention that neither summoned monster nor the flytrap trigger the traps at the entrance? Even if they move right over/into it? Grrrr)

Edit: Oh, and I do like the game. There’s just about 5% or so that makes me want to pull my hair out.

[Primeless]

Originally posted by shaki92:

Originally posted by \\F.A.B.// Lucius:

You are supposed to go alone. Why on Earth would you enter the map and keep exploring it with your party as the game warns you that she will not show up if the party is with you? Also, many players went there alone (what I didn't do - I let them go when I arrived). And that is just a piece of the horrible game design.

No. This is a great game design, because it's immersing. It's such an obvious trap, any smart person would check the place with full party beforehand an stock on invis potions and other items. Only reason why people don't do it, it's because game made them used to being babysitted. You walk into a trap without preparation, because you expect that the game would just leave you an obvious path out. The problem isn't with Pathfinder, is with all other games that do this ♥♥♥♥, so players are used to being immortal gods who can do anything without using their brains. I like that for once, I actually feel endangered in this game sometimes, plan everything, and have to think about my choices.

That why i LOVE this Game. Was so obvius for me that im lvl 9 and never went there. Maybe i should now.

I love ganes that does not play traditionally in the way they all asume you Will manage any situation.

This Game rewards preparation and knowledge vía exploration.

[knightcvel]

Originally posted by Primeless:

Originally posted by shaki92:

No. This is a great game design, because it's immersing. It's such an obvious trap, any smart person would check the place with full party beforehand an stock on invis potions and other items. Only reason why people don't do it, it's because game made them used to being babysitted. You walk into a trap without preparation, because you expect that the game would just leave you an obvious path out. The problem isn't with Pathfinder, is with all other games that do this ♥♥♥♥, so players are used to being immortal gods who can do anything without using their brains. I like that for once, I actually feel endangered in this game sometimes, plan everything, and have to think about my choices.

That why i LOVE this Game. Was so obvius for me that im lvl 9 and never went there. Maybe i should now.

I love ganes that does not play traditionally in the way they all asume you Will manage any situation.

This Game rewards preparation and knowledge vía exploration.

Yes, but it was a trap. If you go without reading any guide you will be in a dire situation.

[ositodefelpa]

Originally posted by Primeless:

Originally posted by shaki92:

No. This is a great game design, because it's immersing. It's such an obvious trap, any smart person would check the place with full party beforehand an stock on invis potions and other items. Only reason why people don't do it, it's because game made them used to being babysitted. You walk into a trap without preparation, because you expect that the game would just leave you an obvious path out. The problem isn't with Pathfinder, is with all other games that do this ♥♥♥♥, so players are used to being immortal gods who can do anything without using their brains. I like that for once, I actually feel endangered in this game sometimes, plan everything, and have to think about my choices.

That why i LOVE this Game. Was so obvius for me that im lvl 9 and never went there. Maybe i should now.

I love ganes that does not play traditionally in the way they all asume you Will manage any situation.

This Game rewards preparation and knowledge vía exploration.

Yeah, but you can't really prepare can you? If you go with a full party nothing happens. If you take an invisibility potion, it doesn't work well (didn't for me anyway). If you come back later, when you're stronger, the quest might have timed out by then. Ultimately, you likely end up save scumming your way through it, and that's not satisfying.

In general, I like much of what the devs are trying to do, but the truth is that if you know nothing about what is going to happen, any way you choose to approach it comes down to a coin flip.

[Omrictu]

Where do you even go for this quest? I can't figure that one out. it's just been sitting there being undone while i go on lol

[Carsomyr +6]

It's *meant* to be a death trap. If you want to trigger the death trap, knowing it's a death trap, then you have to go prepared. If you went there on Ironman mode in your first playthrough, sorry, otherwise, yeah, just reload, go later for fun, it's an optional quest afaik.

And if you complete the area by clearing it and go inside the building, you will find a literal death trap, a trap that is not detectable, a door that is not openable, and it fires like 8 instances of a level 9 spell at your party. You will super die, and the game design is like, hrm, I wonder if this area is important later... no durr.

[Bijat]

If we say it like this. If my DM woud pull this crap i woud stand up and walk out and never answer the phone.

Sure it was obvius something bad woud happend and i buffed up and had invis pots on me when i klicked the tree, killed the hydra. Then ran to the wall and try climb it and its a 22DC with my 6 athletics, no way i will survive trying that (taking 10dmg evry time theres a good chance i will die before suceeding). Then used invis pot and took long way around the owlbear (lower DC) so even with my 0 stealth had no probs getting around him. Then there was only one way out (that i had used less then 5min ago) and BAM TRAP. Was like wtf? the dryad ported away and none of thease creatures seems to be able to cast a magic trap but w/e. I RUN to the exit get hit once by the bady plant but swiftly uses another invis pot...nothing happend..trying using exit but dont work. Attack the plant once to break my invis and re drink another pot but it don´t let me exit map, im invis agen and i die.

Firstly the DC is to mutch honestly, also tried to the wall jumpin / tree jumpin and fall on the jump (to not have to walk past traps) but evry time i used invis pot and tried walk past the plant he found me (dident even see him doing a perspection check in the log).

Secondly if the DM knows the DCs to survive this is high and the player that is doing it is not a skill monkey he will lower the DCs or not kill the player when he fails, simply make him go unconscious and wake up one week later with real bad injurys. Only time this type of encount woud be fine woud be if the player and DM had come to an agreement to kill of the char for whatever reason.

Thirdly up to this point there has not been any encounters that was even close to this overpowered so beeing that ready is expecting alot from the player (most players have atleast played for 10h at that point).

and lastly...it woud be ok if invis pot worked easy in this zone alone (all monsters have rly low perception & no traps) or that you coud use only 1 skill to get out of the situation (evryone will prob have atleast 1 skill high).

[Big K]

♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ garbage devs rofl. No idea what they're doing.

[Hailspork]

Originally posted by KaneDrakkonis:

Unforuntaely you get NOTHING for killing all the monsters, i even made circuits around the entire place twice slowly to make sure I didnt miss an invis redcap or anything... NADA

Do you still get XP? If there's no XP, I'm just skipping the obvious trap.

This reminds me a bit of when Neverwinter Nights came out with Premium Modules. I bought the first round of those. One of them, I believe also called Kingmaker, was little more than being a noble that walks around town until you're told to report back home. I still had a quest outstanding, essentially titled "Walk into the obvious trap in a dark alley", and I decided to skip it. Thing was, I couldn't progress the main plot because it requires you to walk into the obvious trap, where there's enemies who aren't really prepared to actually win their obvious ambush.

I'll take a game that punishes you for walking into a trap over punishing you for not walking into it every time. This is like if a roadrunner started complaining that the roadrunner chow left mysteriously on the road was accompanied by a murderous coyote. Beep beep.

[knightcvel]

I only escaped thanks to a trainer with a god mode functionality. So I went back to the world map and could be back to normal play.

[Demonbox]

Originally posted by Bijat:

Secondly if the DM knows the DCs to survive this is high and the player that is doing it is not a skill monkey he will lower the DCs or not kill the player when he fails, simply make him go unconscious and wake up one week later with real bad injurys. Only time this type of encount woud be fine woud be if the player and DM had come to an agreement to kill of the char for whatever reason.

I guess it depends which kind od DM you are playing with?

While I agree, also due to the fact this is a videogame and not a TT session, some DCs on some difficulties are a bit steep, I almost always played with DMs that were fine in having characters die, we were fine as well of course as players.

Playing a campaign in which the only way for your PC to die is by plot decision (agreeing with your DM) isn't kind of boring?

Don't get me wrong losing the character you've been playing for almost 4 years due to some very unlucky dice rolls, and our own party stupidity, might sting (and it did), but is part of the game.

[fefnir3284]

interesting I didnt know about climing UP the eastern wall... I was able to kill the hydra with no problem, then used the sprint and free movement scrolls to run pass the owlbear and quick swig the invis pot to lose agro, then waited out the entangle trap and jumped the gap and made it out....

[fefnir3284]

oh yeah and immediately came back with everyone and slaughtered everything else -.-

until i went inside and got neg 10 level and all dead. still havent gone back inside :p

[Kempol]

I NEED HELP
i can get past all the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ but i cant click the exit icon, now what the ♥♥♥♥ should i do?

[Baijiu]

Yeah this quest is mean, but I mean, what did you expect? Linzi basically telegraphs "TAKE POTIONS AND SCROLLS AND PREPARE FOR BETRAYAL" so if you walk in and expect a picnic, you're playing the wrong game.