Submit Your Best Builds! (Build Olympics!)

[MightyMickey88]

In honor of the old DPR Olympics for Pathfinder... Lets start a build thread! It's titled DPR since I don't want people to feel like they have to write out all the math behind their damage output ;)

Please post any of your own build ideas or suggestions! I suggest trying to emulate this format (or at least using the header for the name of your build). This will make it easier for all of us to browse builds if we want to skip past the commenting.

Champion of Debilitation

Race & Abilities
Muse-Touched Aasimar (+2 Dex, +2 Cha)
Lawful Good

STR:13
DEX: 18
CON: 14
INT: 10
WIS: 12
CHA: 16

Ability Increases from Level: All to Dex
Ability Increases from Items: Belt to Dex, Headband to Cha

Levels & Feats
1st Rogue (Thug) : Power Attack
2nd Rogue (Thug): Rogue Ability (Weapon Focus: Rapier)
3rd Rogue (Thug): Dazzling Display
4th Paladin
5th Paladin Dodge or Accomplished Sneak Attacker (your preference)
6th Rogue (Thug): Rogue Ability (Skill Focus Persuasion)
7th Fighter: Cornugon Smash, Shatter Defenses
8th Fighter: Combat Reflexes
9th Fighter: Seize the Moment
10th Fighter: Improved Critical (Rapier)
11th Fighter: Weapon Specialization (Rapier), Weapon Training (Rapier)
12th Rogue(Thug):
13th Rogue (Thug): Rogue Ability (Combat Feat Critical Focus), Wings Aasimar Only Feat
14th Rogue (Thug):
15th Rogue (Thug): Rogue Ability (your pick), Staggering Critical (Rapier)
Beyond I'm not too sure the options since I haven't hit high level play

Skills
You will be able to max 3 skills all the time and more later. So Persuarion, Trickery, and another of your choice. At level 12+ You can start using excess Rogue skills to flesh out other skills.

Items
Gloves of Dueling: You need 5 levels of fighter for these but they buff your weapon training
Armor / Shield +X: Always favor +X over abilities
Cloak of Resistance +X
Ring of Protection +X
Amulet of Natural Armor +X

Explanation of Build

The first few levels are rough. You are rushing Rogue to 3rd level so that you can get DEX to damage. However you are no worse than a normal rogue. You should also note that currently power attack is bugged where Finesse weapons only get -1 attack +1 damage. Hopefully this is fixed soon.

At 4th-5th level you pick up Paladin. This allows you to equip shields and is a huge buff to your saving throws (+3 Fort/Will + your CHA to all saves). Also, casters start becoming more prevalent around this time so you want those Will saves up. Don't forget, against evil big bad guys SMITE is extrememly powerful. Sure you aren't getting a big level bonus to damage but you are completely negating their DR.

6th level you hop back to Rogue for Debilitating Injury. I pick to lower their AC because your other abilities (see below) will be drastically reducing their attacks. But you still have flexibility.

7th level is the sweet spot where the build fully comes online. Before you are a tanky rogue with decent damage, now you are a debilitating powerhouse. Cornugon Smash means all of your attacks that hit get a free demoralize check. You are likely to succeed being your race bonus and optimized Persuasion. Enemies hit by you will be demoralized (Intimidate), Flat-Footed (Shatter Defenses), Sickened (Thug Brutal Beating), and AC penalized (Debilitating Injury) for a total of -4 Attack, -2 damage, No Dex to AC, -2 AC(-4 AC for you), -4 saving throws, -4 skill/ability checks. In addition, if your persuasion roll high enough they could outright flee in terror (effectively working like a stun with extra attacks due to Attacks of Opportunity).

8th - 11th are Fighter Levels. These are necessary to pick up your Teamwork Feats in addition to Weapon Training. Having Seize the Moment + High Dex means anytime another team member with this feat gets a crit, you get a free attack.

Who is your teamate? When you get Amiri at lvl 1 immediately tuck away her big sword (it's really a sub-optimal weapon) and use a falchion. Also multi-class her with 2-handed fighter and keep her that for a long time. She will still be slightly underpar of a custom built falchion user but it's not a big deal. She should also then get Seize the Moment. She will only get 2 triggers due to her DEX but she is there to help you. At 10th level both of you will have 15-20 critical threat range and multiple attacks. Expect to trigger this teamwork feat a ton!

Weapon Training is good but way better with Gloves of Dueling (which increase it by +2 attack & damage)

12+ and it's all gravy with extra sneak attack damage. Once you get Staggering Critical opponents hit by you could lose their full-round attack (since they can only take a standard or move action).

*note* Now as an alternative you could go STR based for better Persuasion (Due to Intimidating Prowess adding STR to CHA) and overall 2-Handed damage but would lose out on a lot of AC due to no shield and extra attacks from seize the moment due to low DEX.

[Blackdragon]

I'll take your Muse-Touched Aasimar and bump it up a notch or 2:

Class: Sorcerer 20
Bloodline: Draconic (either Red/Gold for Fire, or Blue/Bronze for Electricity)

STR: 7
DEX: 20
CON: 13
INT: 7
WIS: 7
CHA: 20

Ability Increases from Level: All to Cha
Ability Increases from Items: Belt to Dex, Headband to Cha

Skills: Since you always get a minimum of 1 skill point, you can safely dump Int and still max one skill, the most important one for main character: Persuasion. You also get class and race bonuses to it, for a total of +11 Persuasion at level 1.

Feats:

Level 1: Spell Focus: Evocation, Spell Specialization: Burning Hands (or Shocking Grasp if you went electric, but ymmv).

This should get you 5 casts of Burning Hands per day, each at 3d4+3 damage. Enough to wipe prologue encounters.

Afterwards get Combat Casting, Greater SF, Elemental SF (your element), Metamagic: Empower, Metamagic: Maximise, Spell Penetration, Improved Initiative.

Always Specialize in your best damage spell of your element, if a spell level doesn't have a good spell fill it with metamagicked lower level spells.

Fire is great for early levels, but late game lightning is awesome due to Chain Lightning (nuke without friendly fire). There is no Meteor Swarm, so use those 9th level slots for Maximised Chain Lightning or fire equivalent.

In general stay away from multiclassing and PRCs, unless the PRC is with full caster progression, and losing caster levels is always bad, but doubly so for a sorcerer who is already a level behind Wizard in spell progression. You will also lose out on bloodline bonuses, which by themselves can be almost as good as a PRC.

Good option for multiclassing:

Sorcerer 9/Vivisectionist 1/Arcane Trickster 10
With Accomplished Sneak Attacker feat and Sense Vitals spell, this adds 12d6 damage to your spells. Moreover, this damage is of the same type as the spell, so benefits from Draconic Bloodline Arcana (i.e. becomes 12d6 +12).

Sneak Attack damage can be applied by ranged touch attack spells (rays, orbs etc.). Furthermore, AT capstone "Surprise spell" applies sneak attack on AOE spells when enemies are flat-footed. Hint: You being invisible makes enemies flat-footed in this game, so Greater Invisibility is your friend, along with Surprise Rounds.

One level in Magus will let you cast arcane spells in Light Armor without spell failure; however, that is hardly worth losing a Sorc level. Might be worth it for a Wizard, to also grab a Draconic Bloodline from Eldritch Scion.

Items: Apart from the usual (bonuses to CHA and DEX, +saves etc.), look for bracers of armor, metamagic rods (especially empower and maximize), anything that boosts your sell damage or DC. Bear in mind that you get natural armor from bloodline, so amulet slot can be used for something else.

[MightyMickey88]

Personally I haven't messed with casters other than the Bard for it's amazing song and Cleric for healing. Has the increased need to rest affected your ability to explore / perfom kingdom actions? I feel like a martial character will perform more optimally in this game due to the many time constraints... And I'm lazy and just want to watch my party kill things with little interaction lol.

[Meeky]

There is no PRC with full caster progression

Arcane Trickster says hi. It does, in fact, have full caster progression unless they changed it from tabletop to this game.

You can sack 1 level of Sorc for 1 level of rogue, take accomplished sneak attacker, qualify for Arcane Trickster, and come out as a 19th level spellcaster with 7d6 sneak attack. This makes you a lot better at burst damage in the long run, especially with rays. (Rays are apparently borked with sneak attack damage here: each ray applies sneak attack, not just the first ray.)

[Qiox]

1 Monk / 1 Fighter / 18 Knife Master
Dual Wield Daggers
Human
8 Str 18 Dex 12 Con 10 Int 18 Wis 8 Cha

Increase Dex with level ups. Wear bracers instead of armor. Wear +dex and +wis gear for AC bonuses. Finesse Training Daggers for Dex bonus to damage. Knife Master for D8 sneak damage. Fighter level is for 1 additional BAB and Feat.

Skills: Athletics, Mobility, Trickery, Stealth, Lore Nature, Perception

Main Feats: Dodge, Two-Weapon Fighting line, Improved Crit, Crit Focus, Crane Style

It is my most consistent melee damage dealer and at level 5 catches up with the AC of a custom min-maxed Tower Shield Specialist. At higher levels pulls ahead with better AC while maintaining excellent damage output.

[FemKUltra]

Grenadier Alchemist

Human +2 Int

10 STR
16 DEX
12 CON
20 INT (+2)
10 WIS
7 CHA

Ability increases: All to INT
INT headband, DEX belt

Discoveries:
2nd Precise Bombs (free)
2nd Explosive Bombs
4th Tanglefoot Bombs
6th Choking Bombs
8th Fast Bombs
10th Blinding Bombs
12th Infusion
14th Force Bomb
16th Greater Mutagen
18th Grand Mutagen
20th Capstone

past fast bombs the order doesn't matter, take whatever bomb discoveries you think are cool. Infusion you can get sooner or later, you dont really need it til you get to your level 4 and 5 formulas really.

Feats:
1st Point Blank Shot
Human Precise shot
3rd Rapid shot
5th Whatever the +2 bomb DC feat is
7th Two Weapon Fighting
9th Weapon focus: Bombs
11th Improved Critical: Bombs
13th Improved TWF
15th Greater TWF
17th Extra Bombs
19th Extra Bombs

Im assuming Two weapon fighting still works with fast bombs as they do in the pnp game, I have no reason to believe they dont. This allows alchemists to put out some of the highest DPR in the entire game while inflicting very very severe debuffs at a rediculously high DC the only downside is it can burn through your resources super fast if you arent conservative enough with them.

Explanation: Early game you will be outdamaging your allies in aoe fights. Late game you will also be outdamaging your allies in both single target and aoe fights because youll be throwing up to 6 bombs a round, often ending encounters in the first round of combat.

In some fights you will need to conserve bombs, because just because you can throw 6 bombs in a round, doesnt mean you should, it just means you can in case of fights where things get too hot to handle.

[Babbles]

Why the 'Cha headband, dex belt' thing you all say - even for characters that don't use CHA?

[Silver]

Originally posted by ShokTherapy:

Grenadier Alchemist

Im assuming Two weapon fighting still works with fast bombs as they do in the pnp game, I have no reason to believe they dont. This allows alchemists to put out some of the highest DPR in the entire game while inflicting very very severe debuffs at a rediculously high DC the only downside is it can burn through your resources super fast if you arent conservative enough with them.

Explanation: Early game you will be outdamaging your allies in aoe fights. Late game you will also be outdamaging your allies in both single target and aoe fights because youll be throwing up to 6 bombs a round, often ending encounters in the first round of combat.

In some fights you will need to conserve bombs, because just because you can throw 6 bombs in a round, doesnt mean you should, it just means you can in case of fights where things get too hot to handle.

So as someone who has been playing an alchemist and am almost level 11 I will share my experience.

Two Weapon Fighting 100% doesnt work with bombs, and from what I can tell Rapid shot also doesnt work so you can just remove those 2 feats entirely. (I think Rapid shot may just be a unintended glitch, but I doubt 2 weapon will be).

Explosive bombs while good are a waste at level 2, you actually need acid bombs for numerous encounters thanks to fire resistant (a lot of stuff).

You will want Infusion early, like literally first Discovery early. The ability to use spells on others, namely heals for levels 1-3 is paramount for not wasting tons of time resting. Barkskin is also great as a further buff early for all your melee, etc. You are both the main damage dealer, early on the main healer, and also one of the main buffers for your party.

Explosive bombs are still great though so you probably want them "early" also. So something like Infusion, Acid, Explosive, Fast are probably your first 4, really sucks, but sorta of necessary.

[FemKUltra]

Originally posted by Silver:

Originally posted by ShokTherapy:

Grenadier Alchemist

Im assuming Two weapon fighting still works with fast bombs as they do in the pnp game, I have no reason to believe they dont. This allows alchemists to put out some of the highest DPR in the entire game while inflicting very very severe debuffs at a rediculously high DC the only downside is it can burn through your resources super fast if you arent conservative enough with them.

Explanation: Early game you will be outdamaging your allies in aoe fights. Late game you will also be outdamaging your allies in both single target and aoe fights because youll be throwing up to 6 bombs a round, often ending encounters in the first round of combat.

In some fights you will need to conserve bombs, because just because you can throw 6 bombs in a round, doesnt mean you should, it just means you can in case of fights where things get too hot to handle.

So as someone who has been playing an alchemist and am almost level 11 I will share my experience.

Two Weapon Fighting 100% doesnt work with bombs, and from what I can tell Rapid shot also doesnt work so you can just remove those 2 feats entirely. (I think Rapid shot may just be a unintended glitch, but I doubt 2 weapon will be).

Explosive bombs while good are a waste at level 2, you actually need acid bombs for numerous encounters thanks to fire resistant (a lot of stuff).

You will want Infusion early, like literally first Discovery early. The ability to use spells on others, namely heals for levels 1-3 is paramount for not wasting tons of time resting. Barkskin is also great as a further buff early for all your melee, etc. You are both the main damage dealer, early on the main healer, and also one of the main buffers for your party.

Explosive bombs are still great though so you probably want them "early" also. So something like Infusion, Acid, Explosive, Fast are probably your first 4, really sucks, but sorta of necessary.

This is actually my pathfinder society character I use in the pnp game, where rapid shot and TWF absolutely work with bombs, but only if you take the 'fast bombs' discovery which allows you to create as many bombs as you want in a round, allowing you to treat them like a one-hand range weapon. It definitely works with rapid shot, and Im hoping they coded it to work with TWF as well, which is how it is supposed to work.

[Silver]

Originally posted by ShokTherapy:

This is actually my pathfinder society character I use in the pnp game, where rapid shot and TWF absolutely work with bombs, but only if you take the 'fast bombs' discovery which allows you to create as many bombs as you want in a round, allowing you to treat them like a one-hand range weapon. It definitely works with rapid shot, and Im hoping they coded it to work with TWF as well, which is how it is supposed to work.

I am telling you they DO NOT work in the GAME. We are not talking about the pathfinder tabletop where they do work like you said.

[MightyMickey88]

Originally posted by Babbles:

Why the 'Cha headband, dex belt' thing you all say - even for characters that don't use CHA?

For the Champion of Debilitation, DEX applies to attack (weapon finesse) and damage (weapon training). CHA applies to all saves (Paladin 2) and Persuasion which is necessary for debuffs.

For the sorcerer build DEX applies to AC/Ranged Touch Spells while CHA is their main casting attribute.

[MightyMickey88]

Originally posted by ShokTherapy:

In some fights you will need to conserve bombs, because just because you can throw 6 bombs in a round, doesnt mean you should, it just means you can in case of fights where things get too hot to handle.

This is why I will never play with Alchemists. For starters, save the vivisectionist they are a confused class. The Mutagen is pretty much at odds with a bomb build. Also, they tend to burn through resources very fast. This leads to tedious micromanaging or an imbalance of being worthless most fights and outrageously op. For this game, I think the most optimized builds are those that can consistenly contribute across a long adventuring day (pretty much martial classes). This is due to the time limit on many events.

[FemKUltra]

Originally posted by Silver:

Originally posted by ShokTherapy:

This is actually my pathfinder society character I use in the pnp game, where rapid shot and TWF absolutely work with bombs, but only if you take the 'fast bombs' discovery which allows you to create as many bombs as you want in a round, allowing you to treat them like a one-hand range weapon. It definitely works with rapid shot, and Im hoping they coded it to work with TWF as well, which is how it is supposed to work.

I am telling you they DO NOT work in the GAME. We are not talking about the pathfinder tabletop where they do work like you said.

Really? wow that sucks, Im hoping they fix it

[STING =BMR=]

challange - someone find out how to make a barbarian / monk in game ... maybe by making decisions that can shift alignment or somthing to get that build.

[Slunko]

Here's a party composition I'm destroying the game with, so far at level 11.

4 Knife Master rogues (max dex, dump cha/wis) aasimars with +2dex+2cha. Can work on other races too, but aasimar get wings for +3 AC.

Feats on them: Martial Weapon Proficiency, Weapon Focus: Kukri, Combat Reflexes, Two Weapon Fighting, Improved Two Weapon Fighting, Precise Strike, Double Slash, Improved Critical: Kukri, (From here on, I aim to get Dispelling strikes, cripling strikes wings...)
The Fun Feats: Outflank, Sieze the Moment, Oppurtunist.

Now how this game handles it, is two chars attacking 1 target means all the attacks are sneak attacks. With all the feats and rogue abilities, these fellows, even on rogue BAB hit most of their attacks. And whenever any of them crits (15-20 threat range!), all others get an attack of oppurtunity. Whenever one hits an enemy, another gets an attack of oppurtunity. Whenever another guy crits, they get another attack of oppurtunity. And every. Single. Attack. Is a full sneak attack.

This is backed by two Vivisectionist Alchemist archers, who also always sneak attack with their bows if they shoot at a target being attacked by two other characters in melee. They also provide handy buffs for when your rogues just don't have enough AC to stand up in the frontline in the form of Infusion, where they can give out shield, barkskin, stoneskin, heroism, displacement, haste, you name it.

To give a sense of how good this works: This party killed the Troll King boss in 1 turn on Hard.

[MightyMickey88]

Originally posted by Slunko:

Here's a party composition I'm destroying the game with, so far at level 11.

This sounds awesome but I think you would've benefitted a lot from diversifying your rogues. For instance, have one that 2-Hands an Elven Curved Blade, another Rapier, perhaps have a thug or two and focus on Shatter Defenses / Cornugon Smash for an ultimate debuff. I imagine it will be difficult to find 8 decent Kukri's. But that party comp does sound ridiculous. How do you handle healing? Just buy a ton of potions?