Mental Perfection +6

[ericsaxon35]

Shouldn't this give you skill points? In Pathfinder, having a +INT item gave you a set of knowledge skills.

[Toadally Awesome]

It will give you the extra skill points on next level up, same for any effect that increases your Intelligence.

I am not sure how this is supposed to work if you remove it, which could cause shenanigans as you can level up everyone with the +8 Int hat later in the game and possibly bank on up to 4*character level extra skill points but eh.

[ericsaxon35]

I've had the crown for 2 levels now and haven't gotten anything, so I'm going to say that's not how it works in game.

So when did the extra skill points start happening? And are you sure they are happening?

[For_Science!]

Originally posted by Toadally Awesome:

It will give you the extra skill points on next level up, same for any effect that increases your Intelligence.

Naw; it doesn't work that way. Permanent changes to Int -- such as when you advance a stat every four levels -- give you skill points retroactively, as if you'd had that Int from the beginning.

Temporary Int-enhancing equipment does not give you skill points, either retroactively or if you level up while wearing it. And, unlike in pen-and-paper Pathfinder, it doesn't give you a fixed set of skills either. The devs seem to have decided that was over-complicated, and reverted to earlier-edition d20 rules on this topic.

[ericsaxon35]

I'm starting to think Toadally just makes stuff up to troll people.

Every report I've made, his game somehow always works differently from everyone else's and he's always the first one to tell you, "It works for me."

I guess he's just going on my ignore list.

[Toadally Awesome]

When I had the crown it worked differently for me and this is the only thing I can report. You can go through my posts here and decide for yourself if "I make stuff up" :/

It is good to know though that they simplified things for the sake of it.

[Procrastinating Gamer]

Int-boosting items not giving skill ranks may also be a side-effect of the reduced number of skills in the game. I suspect that a Wizard or other Int-heavy class with such an item would end up with more skill points than there were skills in the game.

[Brian Sirith]

It should after 24 hours according to the PnP rules, but as far as I know it doesn't.

On a side note: Mental perfection +8??? Physical perfection +8? My players just scrapped and bargained and proudly got a headband of vast intelligence +6 at level 13 in PnP and they were extremely happy. Where do these OP items come from? :P

[Ashley]

Yes, normally speaking, increasing your Int modifier should give you extra skill points to allocate for as long as you have the bonus. But with the condensed skills in Kingmaker, Wizards or high-Int Rogues might end up with more skill ranks than skills, so it was probably a tactical choice to remove that feature.

And the +8 things are based on existing wondrous items, but the PnP versions only go up to +6 and are ridiculously expensive. I can only guess why Owlcat included +8 versions.

[Brian Sirith]

Originally posted by Buster:

And the +8 things are based on existing wondrous items, but the PnP versions only go up to +6 and are ridiculously expensive. I can only guess why Owlcat included +8 versions.

[Procrastinating Gamer]

Originally posted by Brian Sirith:

Originally posted by Buster:

And the +8 things are based on existing wondrous items, but the PnP versions only go up to +6 and are ridiculously expensive. I can only guess why Owlcat included +8 versions.

Yeah, the multi-stat items are pretty well-known in Pathfinder tabletop. They affect two stats (so a Belt of Physical Perfection could do STR & CON, STR & DEX, or DEX & CON) but progress in the same steps as their single-stat counterparts. Naturally, they also cost a lot more (16k for a +2, 64k for a +4, and 144k for a +6 - a single-stat item of the same values would cost 10k, 16k, and 36k).

Our party in a War for the Crown campaign managed to find a DEX & CON Belt +2 as loot early in the third part of the AP.

EDIT: Okay my mistake - the Perfection items do cover all three. There's separate items that do two of three. Those prices I quoted were for the 3-stat and the 1-stat versions, respectively, but here's one of the 2-stat ones for comparison: http://aonprd.com/MagicWondrousDisplay.aspx?FinalName=Belt%20of%20Physical%20Might4

[Toadally Awesome]

Well to be honest I've only found one item that gives +8 to all three mental stats and it was loot from what the game considered an achievement worthy boss.

It was found on the magical prison under the Lonely Barrow after you beat the Lich, alongside a large number of +5 armors and weapons with unique effects.

[Brian Sirith]

Originally posted by Shadow88:

Originally posted by Brian Sirith:

Yeah, the multi-stat items are pretty well-known in Pathfinder tabletop. They affect two stats (so a Belt of Physical Perfection could do STR & CON, STR & DEX, or DEX & CON) but progress in the same steps as their single-stat counterparts. Naturally, they also cost a lot more (16k for a +2, 64k for a +4, and 144k for a +6 - a single-stat item of the same values would cost 10k, 16k, and 36k).

Our party in a War for the Crown campaign managed to find a DEX & CON Belt +2 as loot early in the third part of the AP.

EDIT: Okay my mistake - the Perfection items do cover all three. There's separate items that do two of three. Those prices I quoted were for the 3-stat and the 1-stat versions, respectively, but here's one of the 2-stat ones for comparison: http://aonprd.com/MagicWondrousDisplay.aspx?FinalName=Belt%20of%20Physical%20Might4

I didn't know about these items. Oh well... You're tempting me to throw a belt of Physical Perfection to my Hell's Vengeance evil party and see the fighter, ranger and rogue handle that loot distribution... rofl.

Anyway, thanks for the info. Back to the OP's topic.

[charles leshrac]

It was probably removed for several reasons:

1) In 3.5, you do not get additional skill points for wearing items that permanently boost your Intelligence (such as a Headband of Vast Intelligence). You needed a permanent bonus (i.e. Inherent bonus from a Manual). In Pathfinder, this was changed.

2) However, a big HOWEVER in Pathfinder, is that the Headband of Vast Ingellience gives you additional skill ranks BUT those skills (one skill per +2 bonus) must be chosen upon the item's creation and do not stack with the player's existing skill ranks. Otherwise, it's a random Knowledge skill.

Rather than having a different skill attached to the Headband of Vast Intelligence, the designers probably just went with 1) and prevents funky (i.e. bug-filled) interactions when removing the said magic item.

Also rules for Headband of Vast Intelligence also applies to Mental Perfection.

[Entropie]

Considering that for most skillchecks only the best char is being tested, you will probably be fine even without the additional skillranks.

It is way easier to cover all the bases in this game than it is in PnP pathfinder already.

[ericsaxon35]

Originally posted by Entropie:

Considering that for most skillchecks only the best char is being tested, you will probably be fine even without the additional skillranks.

It is way easier to cover all the bases in this game than it is in PnP pathfinder already.

No one is getting to wear the Crown. It's not a headband, it's a CROWN. I am not sharing that ♥♥♥♥ with anyone.

Now, I'd like my skill.

I'm not saying give me 3 skills but a +1 skill per level isn't too much to ask for a +6 item.