Weapon Focus: Ray

[complexcloud]

Hello,
It might be a stupid question, but I am still confused about the skills.
One of them is that weapon focus.
Does the "Weapon Focus: Ray" work for spells?

[TeeQueue]

Only ranged touch spells, but yes.

[complexcloud]

Thank you very much for the expanation.
By saying ranged spells, do you mean every spell that do not need to touch the target?

[Irx]

Originally posted by complexcloud:

Thank you very much for the expanation.
By saying ranged spells, do you mean every spell that do not need to touch the target?

There are melee touch and ranged touch spells (also spells that don't need touch).
Ray is a ranged touch attack.

[Wintermist]

And, it's really not a stupid question :) The tooltips could really explain the differences better than they do.

[complexcloud]

Thank you !
I cannot find it in the skill description. Does it show in somewhere? I mean which type of touch the skill is.

[Corridian]

Rays works for Ray spells. Touch works for touch and ranged touch

[Corridian]

people who do not know rules are giving bad advice. See above

[dhan]

I will give you some basic rules from the Pathfinder Pen&Paper, which also hold for Dungeons&Dragons. Note that I haven't played the video game here, things might be different.

Spells have several variants in checking if they work.
For example, some spells target a single enemy who then has to succeed on a safe. If I try to charm you, you have to roll your Will save against my spell DC.
The same applies to some area spells, like a fireball: you have to roll your Reflex save against my spell DC and if you succeed, you take only half damage.
There are spells which automatically hit, for example Magic Missile.
And then there are spells which require you to do the active roll. Those are touch spells. The idea is that other spells hit automatically, like charming or the fireball, and then the enemy reacts, but these spells need to be aimed.
Some are close range, like Ghoul Touch, which requires the caster to actually touch the enemy (but it is fine if only his armor is touched, therefore the armor bonus to AC does not count).
Others are so called ranged touch attacks. Those are usually some sort of magic projectile that is hurled at the enemy. As with the close range touch attacks, it does not matter if they hit the armor, therefore no AC bonus by armor against them either.

Only touch attacks require *you* to actively roll for success, therefore only those are attacks and can benefit from boni to attacks (although there are also things that give a bonus to your spell DC).
Now the important thing for Weapon Focus (Ray) is that the attack has to be a *ray*. It does not suffice for it to be a ranged touch attack. Rays are a specific subset of that.
For example, you can easily get some Spell-Like-Ability with which you can for example create a bolt of fire that is a ranged touch attack but not a ray, like for example when you are a sorcerer of the fire bloodline, or a cleric who worships a deity of fire like Sarenrae (same applies to other elements and other non-elemental examples).

In essence, the rule of thumb is this: Look if something is *called* a ray. Mostly this means that it has the word ray in its name, but theoretically something could not have that and instead have a description that says it counts as a ray.
My advice is to look for the name and discard anything else. Scorching Ray and Polar Ray are clear examples of rays. Take it that simple, do not assume anything else is one.

That said, changing the feat into applying it to all ranged touch attacks would not be over-powered. In a PnP session, I might allow that as a house-rule, and in a video game, the makers might also decide on doing so. Therefore again the disclaimer, I haven't played the video game, I just know a lot about the PnP.

[Blood Flowers]

Originally posted by Corridian:

Rays works for Ray spells. Touch works for touch and ranged touch

Originally posted by Corridian:

people who do not know rules are giving bad advice. See above

People who haven't tested things in game are giving bad advice. See quoted.

Ray works for RANGED TOUCH in this game. Things like Acid Splash, Hellfire Ray, etc are all given a bonus by Weapon Focus: Ray.

Touch only works for MELEE TOUCH. This does not affect ranged touch spells.

I've tested this in-game as I use Octavia as an Arcane Trickster on Unfair so that +1 is actually fairly important.

[Morgan Blackhand]

Why are people who have not played the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ game answering questions about the game? Why are you idiots even on this forum? "Steam (Platform Forum): Pathfinder:Kingmaker (game title)".

[JonWoo]

Originally posted by Morgan Blackhand:

Why are people who have not played the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ game answering questions about the game? Why are you idiots even on this forum? "Steam (Platform Forum): Pathfinder:Kingmaker (game title)".

Who are you talking about?

[Immortal Reaver]

Originally posted by Jonwoo89:

Who are you talking about?

Him.

Originally posted by dhan:

I will give you some basic rules from the Pathfinder Pen&Paper, which also hold for Dungeons&Dragons. Note that I haven't played the video game here, things might be different.

[Cadelanne]

Originally posted by Immortal Reaver:

Originally posted by Jonwoo89:

Who are you talking about?

Him.

Originally posted by dhan:

I will give you some basic rules from the Pathfinder Pen&Paper, which also hold for Dungeons&Dragons. Note that I haven't played the video game here, things might be different.

He states he's only talking about what is it in theory yet he's still getting insulted. Why people stop applying the most basics politness rules as soon as they're on the internet is a mystery to me.