Why are all the stat boosts even (numbers)?

[toroks]

Why are all the stat boosts even (numbers), like +2 STR, +4 CHR etc. ? It makes it even more useless to have an odd numbered stat, so you can't find some +1 or +3 stat equipment to even it out. Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter nights etc. all had odd numbered stat boosts.

[r-cane]

Because they are meant to improve your bonus, not just your attribute.

And the only way to achive this is by giving the boni in +2 increaments since only every 2 raise the bonus by 1.

And yes, having an odd numbered attribute is something to avoid if you try to build an EFFECTIVE character in Pathfinder AND D&D, unless its odd because you want to raise it even further.
So, if you need the char to be as effective as possible, you need to make those you dont want to raise even. If you just want to play a character and dont care about effectiveness that much feel free to build however you want.

[toroks]

Did some research, it's the DM's decision if he'd allow odd numbered stat boost items in the game or not. I disagree with the decision to not allow it. It makes character building and stat distribution less flexible when every stat has to be even or else one point will always be wasted. If odd stat boosts existed, there would always be a chance to find some equipment that fits every stat value, be it odd or even. And anyway, your primary stat wont always be even, because you raise it by one point every 4 levels.

This "rule" that every stat item has to give an even bonus did not exist in the old classics and it shouldn't exist here. Odd numbered stats do exist, and this "rule" makes them more useless. To be frank, I see this as an unfair and unjust downgrading of characters with many odd stats :) :) It's not their fault, after all - they were born with those stats :P

[Uzkin]

There is an armor in the game with +3 WIS.

The transmuter special ability can give odd-numbered stat boosts as well (depending on level).

[toroks]

Interesting :) I knew about the transmuter ability, but not the +3 WIS armor.

[InEffect]

I bet it was a design decision to not punish players for making sensible 'naked' characters. Kinda makes sense, if you ask me.

[Azure]

The "old classics" ie 2e that the likes of baldurs gate runs on, where as this is a continuation of 3.5e which went with Even numbers as standard. Nothing wrong with having a odd number in any stat, there are a few things which need an odd as a minimum and for those characters they may never need more than whatever that minimum is.

The word the second poster is wanting to actually use is optimised because you can create a effective character without squeezing the life from it.

[InEffect]

Originally posted by AzureTerra:

The word the second poster is wanting to actually use is optimised because you can create a less effective character without squeezing the life from it.

FTFY

[JonWoo]

Originally posted by InEffect:

Originally posted by AzureTerra:

The word the second poster is wanting to actually use is optimised because you can create a less effective character without squeezing the life from it.

FTFY

Needlessly.

[NamelessOne]

There is odd number stat boosts. It's every 4 levels you get +1... I almost never buy a 18, but I buy 17 all the time. You get 5 stat increases, so you should only put odd numbers in stats you are going to spend a point in, or on stats you need a 13 or 17 in (improved twf or Dodge etc).

[toroks]

Originally posted by r-cane:

Because they are meant to improve your bonus, not just your attribute.

And the only way to achive this is by giving the boni in +2 increaments since only every 2 raise the bonus by 1.

And yes, having an odd numbered attribute is something to avoid if you try to build an EFFECTIVE character in Pathfinder AND D&D, unless its odd because you want to raise it even further.
So, if you need the char to be as effective as possible, you need to make those you dont want to raise even. If you just want to play a character and dont care about effectiveness that much feel free to build however you want.

In real roleplaying, characters are made authentic using the whole attribute scale, so I don't see this as a real argument at all. Like Valerie, for instance, she has STR 14, DEX 13, CON 19, INT 9, WIS 10, CHA 15. She would appreciate some odd numbered stat items.

And items are enchanted according to how strong the magic is. No reason it should come in paired increments to fit he most optimized stats for powergaming...

[InEffect]

Odd stats only happen if rolling. PB-ing a bunch of odd stats is just gimping your character on purpose and you should live with that choice. Frankly I wouldn't allow PB-ing something senseless like that cause gimped character would cut into the fun of others.

[toroks]

Originally posted by InEffect:

Odd stats only happen if rolling.

In roleplaying , making a REAL character, it happens when you determine what the real attribute numbers are for the given character, using the WHOLE scale.

[NamelessOne]

Originally posted by InEffect:

Odd stats only happen if rolling. PB-ing a bunch of odd stats is just gimping your character on purpose and you should live with that choice. Frankly I wouldn't allow PB-ing something senseless like that cause gimped character would cut into the fun of others.

I sometimes only buy a 13 just to qualify for a feat. But only if I can't afford to just get the 14.

Also the "real role-playing" argument of toroks sounds like the "no true Scotsman" fallacy. It's definitely an example of the Stormwind fallacy.

[NamelessOne]

Originally posted by toroks:

Originally posted by InEffect:

Odd stats only happen if rolling.

In roleplaying , making a REAL character, it happens when you determine what the real attribute numbers are for the given character, using the WHOLE scale.

What does that even mean? They have stat arrays, but they are for 15 bp equivalent characters:15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8. The npc stat arrays is even worse, and the base stat arrays for monsters is 11 11 11 10 10 10.

I don't know any GM who forces the heroic array on anybody. And the gold standard is 20 point buy as per PFS rules. (Though the monsters CR is based around facing 15 bp characters, 15 points is crippling for most MAD character concepts).

[toroks]

Originally posted by NamelessOne:

Originally posted by InEffect:

Odd stats only happen if rolling. PB-ing a bunch of odd stats is just gimping your character on purpose and you should live with that choice. Frankly I wouldn't allow PB-ing something senseless like that cause gimped character would cut into the fun of others.

I sometimes only buy a 13 just to qualify for a feat. But only if I can't afford to just get the 14.

Also the "real role-playing" argument of toroks sounds like the "no true Scotsman" fallacy. It's definitely an example of the Stormwind fallacy.

Isn't Valerie a real character (4 out of 6 odd attributes)...?