NERF GREATER SHOUT

[Beldr]

AoE stun with no save...

[wendigo211]

Fight the Wild Hunt monarchs first. If you feel the same way after fighting them, then you can post your comment.

[kirill-busidow]

It is bugged.

You dont need to "nerf" it, just make it work as per Pathfinder RPG system.

[kirill-busidow]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder_Kingmaker/comments/9r4kg8/greater_shout/

[kirill-busidow]

Greater Shout

This spell functions like shout, except that the cone deals 10d6 points of sonic damage (or 1d6 points of sonic damage per caster level, maximum 20d6, against exposed brittle or crystalline objects or crystalline creatures). It also causes creatures to be stunned for 1 round and deafened for 4d6 rounds. A creature in the area of the cone can negate the stunning and halve both the damage and the duration of the deafness with a successful Fortitude save. A creature holding vulnerable objects can attempt a Reflex save to negate the damage to those objects.

[kirill-busidow]

Originally posted by wendigo211:

Fight the Wild Hunt monarchs first. If you feel the same way after fighting them, then you can post your comment.

You are abusing bugged spell. You can as well play on story mode.

[wendigo211]

Originally posted by kirill-busidow:

Originally posted by wendigo211:

Fight the Wild Hunt monarchs first. If you feel the same way after fighting them, then you can post your comment.

You are abusing bugged spell. You can as well play on story mode.

No, the function of the spell matches its in game description. That's not a bug it's a design decision.

Having actually beaten the game, there's a lot of unbalanced content in the last two chapters. Ultimately you need cheesy stuff to counter the enemy's cheesy stuff right now.

Kirill, I know from your comments elsewhere that you haven't beaten the game. Or gotten to see the really broken content yet. Until you get to that point, your opinion is utterly invalid.

[mreed2]

The thing is that Chapter 7 is more or less insanely difficult on story mode if you don't abuse Greater Shout. There are other cheasy ways to get through this area, but it is all but impossible to get through this area without using some sort of exploit. CR 30 encounters with character level 16 parties will do that, you know.

{I agree that Greater Shout should be fixed -- but this should happen after the balance issues in Chapter 7 are addressed).

[dfedwards2001]

How do you come up with CR 30 encounters?

[Shadenuat]

I can't wait until developers decide to re-balance it and people would throw down their games due to endgame packs becoming ten times more annoying lol

[mreed2]

Originally posted by dfedwards2001:

How do you come up with CR 30 encounters?

I got that information elsewhere, and it turns out to be inaccurate -- my bad.

• Wild Hunt Scout: https://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/fey/wild-hunt/wild-hunt-scout/, 51,200 XP, CR 15.
  
• Wild Hunt Monarch: https://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/fey/wild-hunt/wild-hunt-monarch/, 204,800 XP, CR 19.
  
• Wild Hunt Archer: https://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/fey/wild-hunt/wild-hunt-archer/, 25,600 XP, CR 13.

There are also other creatures in these encounters -- call them CR 14, 35,000 XP.

So, 1xMonarch, 2xArcher, 4xScout, 2xOther = 204,800 + 25,600x2 + 51,200x4 + 35,000x2 = 204,800 + 51,200 + 204,800 + 70,000 = 460,870 XP total. Per https://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/#Table-Experience-Point-Awards, that's a CR 22 encounter. Note that a party isn't expected to be able to defeat an encounter whose CR is Average Party Level + 4 or higher (so > CR 20 = "Run away").

However, this underestimates the difficulty by a signficant margin, because the Monarch's "Wild Hunt Link" ability is highlysynergistic with the other creatures in the encounter, which isn't taken into account in the above CR ratings / XP rewards. Adding regneration 10 to all of the creatures in the encounter should, at a minimum, be worth a +1 CR vs. their baseline CR. And for the encounters where you have to fight someone without the monarch present, a further boost is appropiate (since it is no longer possible to remove the regeneration, making killing the foes impossible). And so forth and so on.

CR 30 is probably an exageration, but I think you could get into the high twenties using the baseline creatures templates and reasonable adjustments. And all of this is before taking into account any boosts that Owlcat may have added in addition.

[corisai]

Originally posted by mreed2:

So, 1xMonarch, 2xArcher, 4xScout, 2xOther = 204,800 + 25,600x2 + 51,200x4 + 35,000x2 = 204,800 + 51,200 + 204,800 + 70,000 = 460,870 XP total. Per https://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/#Table-Experience-Point-Awards, that's a CR 22 encounter.

You're forget about templates :) They at least have advanced creature template - so AT LEAST if CR+1.

[Beldr]

still waiting

[ArchAngel]

It is supposed to be nerfed in 1.1.

[Sev]

Originally posted by ArchAngel:

It is supposed to be nerfed in 1.1.

Now 1 turn stun, think staggered on save.

Now no one will use it lol.