Remember when Tails actually did stuff in the plot?

[NBOX21]

No, seriously, they ruined Tails in this game. He went from being able to keep up with Sonic in Sonic 2 and 3, to becoming confident in himself in Adventure 1 and 2, being a useful teammate in Heroes to even flying Sonic to different parts of the world and being the professor's assistant in Unleashed, and now he's a complete wimp in this game that can't even do anything.

Really? What happened to his character growth in these games? It almost seems like they completely undid everything he had accomplished in other games like they're starting from scratch. Even in Mania, Tails on his own was still the confident hero he was back in Sonic 2 and 3.

[靈 El Riesgo Siempre Vive]

What Lore. Eggman has a scheme every time and Sonic saves the day. They had gravity once when the robot died for the birds and reunited the family, that was sweet. Also entirely without dialogue..

Sonic is about speed, the story has about as much depth. Make it like the mushrooms I say.

(or just never force me to watch and let me cut the dialogue) I really don't like muting racing transformed. The music is stellar.

[NBOX21]

ПарадДикихМаппеt の投稿を引用：

What Lore. Eggman has a scheme every time and Sonic saves the day. They had gravity once when the robot died for the birds and reunited the family, that was sweet. Also entirely without dialogue.

In the classic games, most of the story, lore and character development was all told through the instruction manuals, so it was still a thing even back then - you just had to go out of your way to find it. You can find scans of the original manuals either online or through the Sonic Mega Collection Plus and Sonic Gems Collection on PS2.

[靈 El Riesgo Siempre Vive]

That's synopsis maybe I'm splitting hairs.

You had to look and interpret those ones. It was so much better.

Not knocking you or anyone who likes to read more into it. I just miss having a choice sometimes.

[NBOX21]

ПарадДикихМаппеt の投稿を引用：

That's synopsis maybe I'm splitting hairs.

You had to look and interpret those ones. It was so much better.

Not knocking you or anyone who likes to read more into it. I just miss having a choice sometimes.

Imagine what Tails was like before the events of Sonic 2 where he and Sonic became best friends? Sonic Triple Trouble's manual actually goes into a bit of detail mentioning that the animals of South Island used to tease him constantly until that point. Even with that, a lot of that was still left up to the player's own imagination, which is a certain magical feeling you just can't experience with modern games.

[靈 El Riesgo Siempre Vive]

I always figured he came out of one of those pods and followed Sonic around like Shortround. Still do.

That's cool though and absolutely true. What are you switching sides on the story debate?

[NBOX21]

ПарадДикихМаппеt の投稿を引用：

That's cool though and absolutely true. What are you switching sides on the story debate?

I'm just expressing a different point of view. Still, I'd happily take that over Sonic Forces turning Tails into a coward despite facing far greater danger in the past.

[靈 El Riesgo Siempre Vive]

NBOX21 の投稿を引用：

ПарадДикихМаппеt の投稿を引用：

That's cool though and absolutely true. What are you switching sides on the story debate?

I'm just expressing a different point of view. Still, I'd happily take that over Sonic Forces turning Tails into a coward despite facing far greater danger in the past.

I'm not watching the story myself, have Amy over Sonic and Metal Sonic over Gimmick. ;)

Looks bad though. Silicon Robot Generic man is rolling out grey goo? That's about all I can gather. And Generations Sonic is back with poor physics for some reason. Solid game still as far as I've gotten.

Tails never seemed to grow after Station Square. I tapped out when his voice changed.

[NBOX21]

ПарадДикихМаппеt の投稿を引用：

Tails never seemed to grow after Station Square. I tapped out when his voice changed.

He was part of Team Sonic in Sonic Heroes as the fly character - that alone I think is enough to show character growth after Adventure 1 as it shows that he's no longer just a sidekick and is now a real hero and worthy of being part of the team. He even gets Sonic and Knuckles get through certain sections of levels they cannot conquer by themselves, which is an integral part of not just the story, but the gameplay as well.

[SpongebobTheHedgehog (Soul)]

NBOX21 の投稿を引用：

ПарадДикихМаппеt の投稿を引用：

Tails never seemed to grow after Station Square. I tapped out when his voice changed.

He was part of Team Sonic in Sonic Heroes as the fly character - that alone I think is enough to show character growth after Adventure 1 as it shows that he's no longer just a sidekick and is now a real hero and worthy of being part of the team. He even gets Sonic and Knuckles get through certain sections of levels they cannot conquer by themselves, which is an integral part of not just the story, but the gameplay as well.

Not only that, Tails did a lot of things on his own for the group in Adventure 2 as well. Find the president & track Robotnik's location, clear out the G.U.N. & Eggman Robots around Eggman's Pyramid Base so they could enter, and even create the fake yellow Chaos Emerald that saved Sonic's life.

Tails is also, the only one that actually gets to fight Robotnik in the game. Not even Sonic has a boss fight with Robotnik.

[靈 El Riesgo Siempre Vive]

That's a stretch. He's been carrying around those two ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ since 1994. He saved Sonic's life at the end of Sonic 2 in 1992.

[NBOX21]

ПарадДикихМаппеt の投稿を引用：

That's a stretch. He's been carrying around those two since 1994. He saved Sonic's life at the end of Sonic 2 in 1992.

It was fleshed out further in Heroes where the stages were designed with the abilities of all three characters in mind. Not to mention thunder shoot is OP as heck.

Point is, there used to be a point in the series where Tails actually did stuff and made for a useful character in the overall story. Ever since Colours, he's been doing nothing but sitting on the sidelines just to cheer him on or give occasional advice. I can't think of a single time in Colours onward where Tails actually contributed to the plot in any real way.

Well, except for Boom, anyway...

[SpongebobTheHedgehog (Soul)]

ПарадДикихМаппеt の投稿を引用：

That's a stretch. He's been carrying around those two ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ since 1994. He saved Sonic's life at the end of Sonic 2 in 1992.

Yes and no. Canonically, Sonic turned Super at the end of Sonic 2 and saved himself. Tails didn't have to be there, but as a just in case I guess. Plus, just saving someone's life is a lot different than standing up to someone which is what the adventure games and heroes had: Tails standing up for himself and for the group.

[Duckilous]

ПарадДикихМаппеt の投稿を引用：

NBOX21 の投稿を引用：

ПарадДикихМаппеt の投稿を引用：

What Lore. Eggman has a scheme every time and Sonic saves the day. They had gravity once when the robot died for the birds and reunited the family, that was sweet. Also entirely without dialogue.

In the classic games, most of the story, lore and character development was all told through the instruction manuals, so it was still a thing even back then - you just had to go out of your way to find it. You can find scans of the original manuals either online or through the Sonic Mega Collection Plus and Sonic Gems Collection on PS2.

That's synopsis maybe I'm splitting hairs.

You had to look and interpret those ones. It was so much better.

Not knocking you or anyone who likes to read more into it. I just miss having a choice sometimes.

Synopsis implies it's summarising the overall plot of the game which would be very brief and simple if we're referring to the Mega Drive era games.
But the manuals didn't give synopses, they provided backstories before the events of the games, especially in the Japanese manuals.

Sonic 2 Prologue (translated from Japanese)

In the midst of his ever so carefree adventures, Sonic suddenly came across one island.
It was a small island, with pleasant green meadows spread throughout it.
"Alright, I'm gonna take a short break."

Sonic's beloved plane Tornado slipped into the island's silhouette while drawing white arcs with the exhaust smoke--then, as if it were following him, a suspicious shiny figure faded into the opposite side of the island.

The Legend of the Illusionary West Side Island

In the remote past, the people of this island developed civilizations by using the mysterious stones, and had lived highly prosperous lives.
However, that prosperity had been brought to nothing in a single night by people who tried using the stones in unintended ways, and the mysterious stones are said to have ended up being sealed somewhere in the island by the gods.

One day, only a few days since landing on the island, Sonic noticed that someone is following him from behind.
When he turned around, he was met with a small fox. When the fox was noticed by Sonic, he quickly hid in the shadow of a palm tree. However, when Sonic started running, the fox followed him as hard as he could.
"Oh well, I'll let him do what he wants." Sonic decided, not paying much mind to him.

"Miles Prower" is a small fox. Miles has two tails. That is why the animals of the island call him "Tails."
He was often bullied because of his two tails. But after seeing Sonic, who came to this island, Miles changed. He made up his mind.
"I want to become cool, too!" he said. And after that, Miles began following Sonic around throughout the day.

One early afternoon, Miles found a beautiful airplane on the beach. Miles, who loves machines and vehicles, approached the side of the plane short of breaking into a run.
The wings were depicted with a stylish body and sharp lines. Fascinated by this aircraft, Miles walked to the other side and stopped, startled. Sonic was taking a nap under the wing on the other side.
Then, when Miles gently changed his direction and returned to the other side of the aircraft...

A flash sparkled at the forest.
Followed by a large explosion and rising fire pillars. Pebbles and tree splinters are raining down.
Almost getting blown away, Miles, who tumbled under the airplane, fluttered his eyes, unable to digest the situation. Forests burning in red and robots digging up the ground as if they are looking for something were reflected in his eyes.

Miles stared at the non-stop explosions and flames covering the island, dumbfounded. He felt someone's presence and looked to the side. Sonic was there, scowling at the blazing forest.

"That blasted Eggman...!" As soon as he muttered that, Sonic kicked up the sand and headed into the woods.
Something has happened. Something unthinkable.
Seized with that premonition, Miles unconsciously went running after Sonic...

"Daaaaahahahahah!!"
A coarse, loud and familiar laughter was echoing in the forest. It was him. Doctor Eggman.

"I finally found it. The island where the Chaos Emeralds sleep--the illusionary West Side! Ahh, I'm glad I pursued Sonic. Now I should be able to even complete my ultimate weapon--the Death Egg. I'm waiting for you, Sonic! And this time, this time, I will beat you, and collect the Chaos Emeralds! Then, I will become the world's conqueror!! Daaahahahah!!"

The actors are set. The adventure and excitement will now start once again!

Source: http://info.sonicretro.org/Sonic_the_Hedgehog_2_(16-bit)/Manuals

ПарадДикихМаппеt の投稿を引用：

you don't play Sonic for plot wtf

Nobody plays Sonic solely for the plot but who's to say we can't appreciate the franchise even further when it tries to expand upon itself by incorporating lore or story?

ПарадДикихМаппеt の投稿を引用：

I guess it's an age thing. You people better not be adults! lol

You really think children even care about elaborated stories?
I can't even imagine most kids today would care about the Sonic franchise, they'd be too busy playing Fortnite or other popular games like Grand Theft Auto Online and Call of Duty or worse, mobile games. You have to be very out of touch if you think children aren't like that.

Most of the people you're talking to on this forum are most likely adults who grew up with the Sonic series and there's a reason as to why we still stick around and wanted more when it comes to lore or the overall quality of the games: because we give a damn. Why wouldn't we? We're fans.
Who cares how old we are? Unless you're an ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ who rather have people live their mundane lives miserably, you shouldn't be gatekeeping on how people want to enjoy themselves based on their age.

◆Ikagura◇ の投稿を引用：

ПарадДикихМаппеt の投稿を引用：

you don't play Sonic for plot wtf

I agree a lot! Why people are insisting on wanting a story for what is basically about a blue animal running fast to chase a fat scientist with colored stones.

Again, we're talking about the same blue hedgehog whose rival is a fat red plumber who jumps on turtles that happens to receive games that told stories that are beyond saving princesses.
C'mon, I've said this several times. I get that you're stubborn but you can't ignore or bloody deny that.

NBOX21 の投稿を引用：

SpongebobTheHedgehog (Soul) の投稿を引用：

I myself play Sonic games for both the gameplay and the plot as well. Just because Sonic has cartoon animals as its protagonist, doesn't mean that there cannot be better plots for the games. Just look at Sonic SATAM, the Sonic OVA, Sonic X, early 3D Sonic games, and the Archie & IDW comic series. The recent movie even, while not perfect, it still portrays Sonic as an actual character which is more than what I can say for the recent video games.

Furthermore, it's worth pointing out that even other platformers like Jak & Daxter, Ratchet & Clank, Sly Cooper and Klonoa all have interesting, compelling stories that treat their characters with respect despite also being platformers. While it's true that a game doesn't need a good story to be any good, a good story can turn an otherwise good game into an amazing one.

For the case of indie platformers, I believe that if you don't have an unique innovating gameplay then at least try to establish some kind of fascinating lore that makes your universe seem like a fun place to explore in because I don't think anyone would care about your game otherwise if it's something they've already seen before. It will be flopped and no one will miss it, it'll be part of the generic indie platformer graveyard.

[靈 El Riesgo Siempre Vive]

I hope that's a joke. Enjoy Sonic stories they are cheese and ham that's about where I would've left most of that.

[Duckilous]

ПарадДикихМаппеt の投稿を引用：

I hope that's a joke. Enjoy Sonic stories they are cheese and ham that's about where I would've left most of that.

You'd be surprised how many people actually bought and enjoyed reading the Sonic Archie & IDW comics, praised Unleashed for its story or even regarded Sonic and the Black Knight as the best characterisation of the titular character.

Even if you don't agree with them, that doesn't mean you should make fun of them because there's no point to it. You can't change people's minds that way.