How do you use the mortar?

[Rinne]

I have no idea how to activate the mortar. Does it use ammo? If so where it is sold?

[SertanDoom]

Probably good against hard to hit light mechs, mechs with an armor debuff, and light mechs with an armor debuff. I don't really see it as a game changer that can swing the tide of battle in your favor.
There is one thing I just thought of and haven't noticed- How much stability damage do they do?
If they do a lot, I may have a use for it.

[Zloth]

I don't think they do any.

[wesnef]

But yeah, they're quite entertaining against a crowd of Locust M's. Or in Urban terrain.

[Zloth]

Yeah, and the AI does like to perch its mechs up on the buildings!

[Your Mom's Oshi]

Stick it on a tank and let your backstabbers get the kills.

[Big mean bunny]

Mortar/thumper have quite low damage but can be good against evasive light mechs, Ecm cloak and if of a high initiative mech grabbing attention on defend base or escort missions

[OrbPlaytime]

Originally posted by Big mean bunny:

Mortar/thumper have quite low damage but can be good against evasive light mechs, Ecm cloak and if of a high initiative mech grabbing attention on defend base or escort missions

Yeah the cloak and maybe the 3-way destroy base mission, but it would be a tough call between Mortar/thumper to that of a Striker or Gladiator for defend base/escort as they only need to draw target attention which they can do repeatedly vs the 1 shot Mortar/2shot Thumper with cooldown.

[wesnef]

Hah, that was fun. Doing the "escort the VIP in a Griffin" mission, a third party dropped in right between me and the enemy. They then immediately run into each other. I was able to drop a Thumper on 6 guys. :D
(alas, by the time it had cooled down for a second shot, there were two enemies left out of eight)

[Graygan]

They're great for that one shot when the AI bunches up... but it's so situational, it's not really worth carrying it around. Unless you keep an arty mech handy for those missions where you think you'll use it.

Over all, I prefer to use the tonnage for other weapons that will add up to more damage over time.

Besides... by the time I start using it in the campaign, I'm already killing an average of 2 enemies per round after combat starts... at that point, there's no real need for the cannon.

It might be fun to have it early campaign game... but then the game would be even easier than it already is.

[wesnef]

Yeah, I'm unsure about the actual "mortar" equipment. I could see trying to jam one into something small & fast at the beginning, to try wiping up all those lances of Lights. But it costs 3mil, not something easy to grab in the early game.

But I've been dragging my MAZ into almost every fight since I got it. When I'm not using it's Thumper, the 2xUAC5++, 2xUAC2++, and 2xERML++ are plenty of boom to be useful.

[knowthyself2]

I find that it's not very useful. Even against bases, it takes two mortar shots to take down a building.
Maybe if your entire lance has mortars? And of course the enemy would have to be grouped up. They group up sometimes but not enough so that a mortar lance would be useful.

[Highlander]

A little late to the thread, but I've only just got the game a month ago, and I have to say I love it.
As for the Thumper, anyone else trying more than one Bullshark/Thumper combo? I'm running 2 right now. In career, got one from Flashpoint, and another from Black Market. I can tell you that I've had a lot of fun with it, even against med and heavy mechs.

I had 4 mix of medium mechs near the base I needed to destroy. They were all clumped up nicely. 2 Thumpers from my 2 Bullsharks on the same turn ended up destroying ALL the medium mechs and demolished the buildings.

2 Shots don't always destroy medium mechs, but it's happened often enough where if I get a clump of 3-4 mechs together, 2 thumper shots will usually kill at least one or two, while severely damaging the others where a small gust of LRMs will usually finish em off.

Even against Heavies, 2 Thumpers soften them all up very nicely, and can sometimes take a limb off. Definitely weakens their rear enough that it just takes one of your faster mechs to flank and wipe em out.

I bumped into another Blackmarket that's selling 6 salvage Bullshark parts so I could essentially have 4 Thumpers! Don't have the cash to do it at the moment, but I'm going to aim for it just for the entertainment value =).

[danko9696]

Originally posted by art_hong:

A little late to the thread, but I've only just got the game a month ago, and I have to say I love it.
As for the Thumper, anyone else trying more than one Bullshark/Thumper combo? I'm running 2 right now. In career, got one from Flashpoint, and another from Black Market. I can tell you that I've had a lot of fun with it, even against med and heavy mechs.

I had 4 mix of medium mechs near the base I needed to destroy. They were all clumped up nicely. 2 Thumpers from my 2 Bullsharks on the same turn ended up destroying ALL the medium mechs and demolished the buildings.

2 Shots don't always destroy medium mechs, but it's happened often enough where if I get a clump of 3-4 mechs together, 2 thumper shots will usually kill at least one or two, while severely damaging the others where a small gust of LRMs will usually finish em off.

Even against Heavies, 2 Thumpers soften them all up very nicely, and can sometimes take a limb off. Definitely weakens their rear enough that it just takes one of your faster mechs to flank and wipe em out.

I bumped into another Blackmarket that's selling 6 salvage Bullshark parts so I could essentially have 4 Thumpers! Don't have the cash to do it at the moment, but I'm going to aim for it just for the entertainment value =).

I've tried it, alone, two and four MAZ within a lance. IMO it is the worst weapon of the game. Nothing more than a win-more one-trick pony which only is going to be "helpful" when the battle outcome is already predetermined, like fighting lights or mediums while using 95t lostech assaults.

With such mechs you shouldn't need to soften up mediums but outright obliterating them from the front (and heavies too) as soon as they're within range, without having to flank with other mechs in order to finish them. That's something it would seem appropriate for a full light-medium lance against heavies/assaults, not high-end assaults fighting meds.

About the two Thumpers killing four medium mechs, unless they were badly maintained I doubt it. It is possible but they'd have to be among those with the lowest rear armor AND you'd still need to be VERY lucky, because the average damage per location is not only low on average but also varies wildly, from 10 to 50 dmg.

Against heavies all of them have more than 100 in armor + structure, and the damage (two Thumpers) is 20-100, you'd have to get a very high damage roll for both Thumpers, AND the heavies should be low tier, AND then you'd have to pass the crit roll AND also the roll for a location with armor in it so it explodes destroying an arm.


So for fun? sure, why not. It is (along the Mortar) an unique type of weapon. But still is very very bad imo.

[Highlander]

Originally posted by danko9696:

I've tried it, alone, two and four MAZ within a lance. IMO it is the worst weapon of the game. Nothing more than a win-more one-trick pony which only is going to be "helpful" when the battle outcome is already predetermined, like fighting lights or mediums while using 95t lostech assaults.

With such mechs you shouldn't need to soften up mediums but outright obliterating them from the front (and heavies too) as soon as they're within range, without having to flank with other mechs in order to finish them. That's something it would seem appropriate for a full light-medium lance against heavies/assaults, not high-end assaults fighting meds.

About the two Thumpers killing four medium mechs, unless they were badly maintained I doubt it. It is possible but they'd have to be among those with the lowest rear armor AND you'd still need to be VERY lucky, because the average damage per location is not only low on average but also varies wildly, from 10 to 50 dmg.

Against heavies all of them have more than 100 in armor + structure, and the damage (two Thumpers) is 20-100, you'd have to get a very high damage roll for both Thumpers, AND the heavies should be low tier, AND then you'd have to pass the crit roll AND also the roll for a location with armor in it so it explodes destroying an arm. Barely a scratch on anyone else.


So for fun? sure, why not. It is (along the Mortar) an unique type of weapon. But still is very very bad imo.

In my experience thus far, I can't say that it's "very very bad". Certainly not necessary, and certainly not great by itself. But depending on how you play, it can still offer some advantages in such that it isn't completely irrelevant. But also, I am speaking from a standpoint of having 2-4 Thumpers.

In the situation where mediums get roasted by 2 thumpers, is indeed based on rng, and it's also based on their rears being weak points so two high damage thumpers to the rear center torso, or weakly armored legs, will take them out.

And yes, you do play a little differently to maximize effectiveness. I tend to unleash thumpers when not in direct view. So they don't have effective fire on me, but I can still take out red blips from behind structures/hills.

I just recently had a fun example against Black Widow/Bounty Hunter flashpoint, and had gotten my 3rd Bullshark. Softened up BW by time BH came in, so now there's like 8 mechs in close proximity. Got into position where they don't have direct fire on me, lunched 3 Thumpers, which ended up finishing off 2 more mechs, another 2 rounds later from various gunfire, lunched 3 more Thumpers and wiped the rest of the team clean and only one of my mechs had armor stripped on the left arm.

Now obviously this depends on your goals. If you only plan to ever have just 4 mechs in your Bay, and you have Atlas IIs to choose from, then obviously you'll want that heavy fire power. But say in my case, playing Career from scratch, and having Bullshark access before any Atlas', it has been quite fun piloting 3 of them. Not sure if I'll go for a 4th, but... why not =).

[danko9696]

I'm not saying the Thumper has no advantages at all, it does have some. But all other weapons have something going for them too.

IMO the Thumper is very bad because the low and unreliable damage, very limited ammo, very big foot print (both in weight and in number of crit slots). So it's mostly a win-more weapon, something you use when you know you're going to win anyway.

So yes, it's clearly going to be good against lights and underarmored mediums, but (again) you're using a high-end lostech assault and your opponents should be full armored heavies and assaults. If the BSK-MAZ didn't have the Thumper then it would be superior to the A-II. Instead it is merely a good assault, inferior to some other assaults and several heavies, because (of course) you still can use its remaining weight, hardpoints and extra internal cooling.

With two high-end mechs you can remove two mediums per turn with PS and then maybe another one or two foes with your other mechs without PS (like two vehicles or one low tier heavy, for example). And that isn't luck, not versus that quality of foes.

I've made tests where against two vehicles using four MAZ and it took me three salvos to kill one of them and the other was still alive after the fourth!!!. That's bad, very very bad, and shows how unreliable the weapon is. Still it could be good if it had some endurance for attrition based playstyles, but two salvos?. LRMs have moderate damage (actually pretty good for the range with +2 dmg tubes) but they can sustained over long periods of time. Other weapons can have very high focused alpha and sustain it too. Support weapons have very low range but incredible efficiency and they can be quite decent in the endgame for hit & run.


Don't take wrong, I'm not saying don't play with them. I sometimes play with terrible loadouts just for the dakka, but I don't fool myself thinking that if they work is because they're good. They might work and still be really really bad, because the game is essentially made to be so easy that almost anything will work.