Harebrained Schemes vs Harmony Gold Copyright Lawsuit

[Zorlond]

https://youtu.be/xLtlynQrG6c

Oh will this feud ever blow over? Ugh. :(

EDIT: Only changed the title of the thread to something more informative/less sensational.

Edit2 (8/17): Update with Leonard French's new video on this lawsuit, with reading of the legal paperwork.

WARNING: VERY VERY DRY.

https://youtu.be/nPou5WuE-Y4

From the sound of it, HBS and HG are now talking things out in private to decide if a judge and jury need to get involved.


Edit3 (8/20): Another vid from Leonard French (likely the one harleshade80 is referring to). May want to start at about 7:30, unless you really like dogs. (edit: Sorry, looks like he edited that bit out) He talks about who's actually got the Robotech rights in this one (Harmony Gold vs Tatsunoko Production).

Reading more legal paperwork, of course. So, more Very Dry stuff, and it kinda drags on. For an hour.

https://youtu.be/CZrfOtJyJpM

Personally, I'm very curious about those 41 Origional character designs that Tatsunoko didn't have the rights to liscence to HG. Any mech designs in there? One may argue that a pilot's mech is as much a character as the pilot...

Edit4 (11/23): Looks like it's shots fired on this legal battle, and it's a pretty serious strike. SidAlpha starts with a rundown of his own experience with BattleTech, then a refresher on this case, and finally gets to the actual news about 4.5 minutes into the video.

https://youtu.be/k3Z3-y0mr00

Harmony Gold is likely to take a serious hit if this motion goes through. It may even be an end to this decades-long feud if it's declared that they really don't have the right to file these sorts of lawsuits anymore due to lack of copyright ownership.

Edit5 (2/2/2018): Don't troll.

Edit6 (4/8/18): Ok, new YouTube video came up about this, and while it doesn't contain anything new for anyone closely monitoring the lawsuit, it does offer a nice summary of what's been going on for the last few months in the case. So anyone not familiar with the case can take a look to keep up to speed, at least.

https://youtu.be/yVphRmbx9Uo

Here's hoping the judge insists on a mutch shorter deadline (I'd go for one week myself) for those documents so this nonsense can be settled in a reasonable time frame.

Edit7 (4/14/18): And another vid from SidAlpha covering the last week where the case against HBS is getting dismissed with predjudice, and the judge's demand that HG give good reason why not to dismiss the rest of it as well. I rather like his closing statement. :)

https://youtu.be/k1V8jxUZYbg

Looks like this game, at least, is in the clear, though no word yet as to whether or not the Unseen will be showing up in the game (HBS probably has yet to decide). But at least it's a valid possibility.

[tarasis]

Thank you for restarting this thread.

[mgridgeview]

I hope Harmony Gold realizes how many people they're disappointing by screwing things up with HBS. Is it worth it HG? Is it worth having legions of fans hate you because being a patent troll is all your company has left to live for?

[non]

mgridgeview původně napsal:

I hope Harmony Gold realizes how many people they're disappointing by screwing things up with HBS. Is it worth it HG? Is it worth having legions of fans hate you because being a patent troll is all your company has left to live for?

In a material world, the sad answer is: yes

[PocketYoda]

mgridgeview původně napsal:

I hope Harmony Gold realizes how many people they're disappointing by screwing things up with HBS. Is it worth it HG? Is it worth having legions of fans hate you because being a patent troll is all your company has left to live for?

Its always worth it to a company protecting its rights, even if they are not the companies to start with...

[uMakeMeHot]

DanteYoda původně napsal:

mgridgeview původně napsal:

I hope Harmony Gold realizes how many people they're disappointing by screwing things up with HBS. Is it worth it HG? Is it worth having legions of fans hate you because being a patent troll is all your company has left to live for?

Its always worth it to a company protecting its rights, even if they are not thye companies to start with...

The difference is when they claim rights they apparently don't have as indicated by their recent legal negotiations with Tatsunoko, who also apparently doesn't own those rights that HG is claiming. Protecting your IP is one thing, excessive overreach is another. This is why so many consider them to be copyright trolls who are acting in bad faith. Not using the law to protect their interests, but using the law as a weapon to attack and get a piece of others interests.

It's been said HG won't be able to use many of the character and mecha designs they always have in their new Robotech movie because they apparently don't own or even have a proper license for those rights they've been claiming this whole time.

This is just the first time anyone's really been able to fight them on it for Battletech without going completely broke.

[PocketYoda]

uMakeMeHot původně napsal:

DanteYoda původně napsal:

Its always worth it to a company protecting its rights, even if they are not thye companies to start with...

The difference is when they claim rights they apparently don't have as indicated by their recent legal negotiations with Tatsunoko, who also apparently doesn't own those rights that HG is claiming. Protecting your IP is one thing, excessive overreach is another. This is why so many consider them to be copyright trolls who are acting in bad faith. Not using the law to protect their interests, but using the law as a weapon to attack and get a piece of others interests.

It's been said HG won't be able to use many of the character and mecha designs they always have in their new Robotech movie because they apparently don't own or even have a proper license for those rights they've been claiming this whole time.

This is just the first time anyone's really been able to fight them on it for Battletech without going completely broke.

I understand all that this is currently being followed in the MWO forums as well. My issue with all this is Fasa stole those mech designs years ago from Robotech and to this day its been a running battle..

I personally love Robotech and Battletech but sadly we the customers are still paying the price to this day..

Tbh i feel both companies have a say in this battle i just hope we aren't the casualties..

[uMakeMeHot]

DanteYoda původně napsal:

. My issue with all this is Fasa stole those mech designs years ago from Robotech and to this day its been a running battle.

No, FASA didn't steal anything from Robotoech.

FASA got an intellectual property license from a Japanese company for Battledroids/Battletech just like HG did for Robotech.

The different companies in Japan that were licensing out Macross rights didn't all own the rights they were licensing out.

It was a legal mess in Japan that took a couple of decades or more before it was sorted out. But it was eventually sorted out.

HG had more money and legal manpower than the companies they were targeting so at the time they could make it too expensive in the US for companies like FASA to survive a protracted lawsuit. Companies with less money to mount an extended legal defense would end up in so much debt they'd go out of business, so instead they settled out of court with HG for much less money than a protracted lawsuit would cost just so they could survive.


It's completely wrong to say FASA "stole" anything from Robotech. Here's why:

Battledroids (Battletech) launched a year before HG's Robotech

FASA's licensing was through proper channels. Indirectly through Studio Nue which was determined in Japan to own the mecha designs.

HG's licencing was through Tatsunoko, which never owned the mecha designs.

HG had another license for toys not media from yet another company (might have been Revell?) that IIRC ran out long ago, who also didn't have the right to license the media or designs to HG for any other reason than selling the toy line. This meant they couldn't use that license to make movies or comics. I'm murky on this part. It's been a long time since I read the details about it.

Remember, this isn't an issue of "Macross license" anything. HG legitimately licensed Macross media content, but that license never legitimately gave ownership of Macross and it never gave them legitimate rights to certain character and mecha designs.

FASA didn't need to license Macross media. Only the mecha designs they were interested in. Which FASA licensed legitimately. However that took over 20 years to be cleared up in Japan and in the meantime HG apparently overextended their licensing claims.

HG owns Robotech. It's theirs. But some of the characters and designs in it don't belong to HG. They don't own Macross. And, they apparently don't have the rights to sue HBS or PGI over the mecha designs.

I guess we'll see how that plays out once the lawsuit is concluded.

[PocketYoda]

uMakeMeHot původně napsal:

DanteYoda původně napsal:

. My issue with all this is Fasa stole those mech designs years ago from Robotech and to this day its been a running battle.

No, FASA didn't steal anything from Robotoech.

FASA got an intellectual property license from a Japanese company for Battledroids/Battletech just like HG did for Robotech.

The different companies in Japan that were licensing out rights didn't all own the rights they were licensing out.

It was a legal mess in Japan that took a couple of decades or more before it was sorted out. But it was eventually sorted out.

HG had more money and legal manpower than the companies they were targeting so at the time they could make it too expensive in the US for companies like FASA to survive a protracted lawsuit. Companies with less money to mount an extended legal defense would end up in so much debt they'd go out of business, so instead they settled out of court with HG for much less money than a protracted lawsuit would cost just so they could survive.


It's completely wrong to say FASA "stole" anything from Robotech. Here's why:

Battledroids (Battletech) launched a year before HG's Robotech

FASA's licensing was through proper channels. Indirectly through Studio Nue which was determined in Japan to own the mecha designs.

HG's licencing was through Tatsunoko, which never owned the mecha designs.

HG had another license for toys not media from yet another company (might have been Revell?) that IIRC ran out long ago, who also didn't have the right to license the media or designs to HG for any other reason than selling the toy line. (I'm murky on this, it's been a long time since I read the details about it.)

Remember, this isn't an issue of "Macross license" anything. HG legitimately licensed Macross media content, but without certain character and mecha designs.

FASA didn't need to license Macross media. Only the mecha designs they were interested in. Which FASA licensed legitimately. However, that took over 20 years to be cleared up in Japan, and in the meantime...HG apparently overextended their licensing claims.

HG owns Robotech. It's theirs. But, some of the characters and designs in it don't belong to HG. They don't own Macross. And, they apparently don't have the rights to sue HBS or PGI over the mecha designs.

I guess we'll see how that plays out once the lawsuit is concluded.

They originally licenced them yes but after the licence ran out they kept on using them.. Still today they are.. You saw it the Video a lot of those mech are almost exact copies.. Sure the second group made zero sense as they were not anything close to robotech but the first group sure are..

[uMakeMeHot]

DanteYoda původně napsal:

uMakeMeHot původně napsal:

No, FASA didn't steal anything from Robotoech.

FASA got an intellectual property license from a Japanese company for Battledroids/Battletech just like HG did for Robotech.

The different companies in Japan that were licensing out rights didn't all own the rights they were licensing out.

It was a legal mess in Japan that took a couple of decades or more before it was sorted out. But it was eventually sorted out.

HG had more money and legal manpower than the companies they were targeting so at the time they could make it too expensive in the US for companies like FASA to survive a protracted lawsuit. Companies with less money to mount an extended legal defense would end up in so much debt they'd go out of business, so instead they settled out of court with HG for much less money than a protracted lawsuit would cost just so they could survive.


It's completely wrong to say FASA "stole" anything from Robotech. Here's why:

Battledroids (Battletech) launched a year before HG's Robotech

FASA's licensing was through proper channels. Indirectly through Studio Nue which was determined in Japan to own the mecha designs.

HG's licencing was through Tatsunoko, which never owned the mecha designs.

HG had another license for toys not media from yet another company (might have been Revell?) that IIRC ran out long ago, who also didn't have the right to license the media or designs to HG for any other reason than selling the toy line. (I'm murky on this, it's been a long time since I read the details about it.)

Remember, this isn't an issue of "Macross license" anything. HG legitimately licensed Macross media content, but without certain character and mecha designs.

FASA didn't need to license Macross media. Only the mecha designs they were interested in. Which FASA licensed legitimately. However, that took over 20 years to be cleared up in Japan, and in the meantime...HG apparently overextended their licensing claims.

HG owns Robotech. It's theirs. But, some of the characters and designs in it don't belong to HG. They don't own Macross. And, they apparently don't have the rights to sue HBS or PGI over the mecha designs.

I guess we'll see how that plays out once the lawsuit is concluded.

They originally licenced them yes but after the licence ran out they kept on using them.. Still today they are.. You saw it the Video a lot of those mech are almost exact copies.. Sure the second group made zero sense as they were not anything close to robotech but the first group sure are..

Again this is wrong. First, those aren't "almost exact copies". They look different enough to me and a lot of other people so much so we really don't like them as much as the original mechas. And some people like them a lot more for their boxier "added realism". However, that's something for a court to make a final determination on. Your or my lay eye can argue over what we see ad infinitum and it won't make a lick of difference. It'll be up to design experts in a courtroom to make that case if it ever goes that far in a courtroom.

We don't know a lot of details about FASA's or any subsequent Battletech company's side of the licensing with the Japanese companies. Even after the past lawsuits. Those license agreements tend to be private until something brings them to light. They may still have the rights, they may not, they might have a handshake/verbal deal, or they may not.

Which may be immaterial if the current Battletech designs are determined to not be materially similar by a legal standard to be copies, if a company with the actual rights to sue ever decides to do so. HG apparently isn't that company at this time. So it's a moot point. HG's making a play they apparently don't have a right to. But, that's never stopped bullys before.

However, that may ultimately be determined by this court case.

[PocketYoda]

uMakeMeHot původně napsal:

DanteYoda původně napsal:

They originally licenced them yes but after the licence ran out they kept on using them.. Still today they are.. You saw it the Video a lot of those mech are almost exact copies.. Sure the second group made zero sense as they were not anything close to robotech but the first group sure are..

Again this is wrong. First, those aren't "almost exact copies". They look different enough to me and a lot of other people so much so we really don't like them as much as the original mechas. And some people like them a lot more for their boxier "added realism". However, that's something for a court to make a final determination on. Your or my lay eye can argue over what we see ad infinitum and it won't make a lick of difference. It'll be up to design experts in a courtroom to make that case if it ever goes that far in a courtroom.

We don't know a lot of details about FASA's or any subsequent Battletech company's side of the licensing with the Japanese companies. Even after the past lawsuits. Those license agreements tend to be private until something brings them to light. They may still have the rights, they may not, they might have a handshake/verbal deal, or they may not.

Which may be immaterial if the current Battletech designs are determined to not be materially similar by a legal standard to be copies, if a company with the actual rights to sue ever decides to do so. HG apparently isn't that company at this time. So it's a moot point. HG's making a play they apparently don't have a right to. But, that's never stopped bullys before.

However, that may ultimately be determined by this court case.

The differences are so minute that anyone can see they are copies, sure changing them makes copyright harder but these are so close i think the courts might say HG have a point..

I'm not saying i like any of this but i'm being honest here PGI designs are blatant ripoffs..

[uMakeMeHot]

DanteYoda původně napsal:

uMakeMeHot původně napsal:

Again this is wrong. First, those aren't "almost exact copies". They look different enough to me and a lot of other people so much so we really don't like them as much as the original mechas. And some people like them a lot more for their boxier "added realism". However, that's something for a court to make a final determination on. Your or my lay eye can argue over what we see ad infinitum and it won't make a lick of difference. It'll be up to design experts in a courtroom to make that case if it ever goes that far in a courtroom.

We don't know a lot of details about FASA's or any subsequent Battletech company's side of the licensing with the Japanese companies. Even after the past lawsuits. Those license agreements tend to be private until something brings them to light. They may still have the rights, they may not, they might have a handshake/verbal deal, or they may not.

Which may be immaterial if the current Battletech designs are determined to not be materially similar by a legal standard to be copies, if a company with the actual rights to sue ever decides to do so. HG apparently isn't that company at this time. So it's a moot point. HG's making a play they apparently don't have a right to. But, that's never stopped bullys before.

However, that may ultimately be determined by this court case.

The differences are so minute that anyone can see they are copies, sure changing them makes copyright harder but these are so close i think the courts might say HG have a point..

I'm not saying i like any of this but i'm being honest here PGI designs are blatant ripoffs..

Ripoffs? The original designs were licensed in good faith by FASA for the Battletech when it was first created as Battledroids. Then HG was sold rights to the Macross mecha designs by companies that didn't have the rights to sell those designs and HG has since claimed rights they apparently haven't ever had despite possibly knowing they didn't have those rights to the designs since at least 2003's court decision in Japan, if not before, after which they nevertheless continued to claim rights their licensors apparently never had to give them in the first place. It was sufficiently publicized, discussed in their own fanbase and people wrote them enough letters or email (I know I did!) that it's not reasonable for them to claim they didn't know about the design rights decision in Japan regarding Tatsunoko, Big West/Studio Nue.

You can't rip off something from someone else who doesn't actually own that thing. Battletech launched (as Battledroids) with proper licensing through proper channels to the actual rights holders (Studio Nue) before Robotech ever launched. If there are ripoffs, then HG's apparently the ones doing the ripping off.

However the current PGI designs aren't even copies of the original designs. Inspired by? Yes. Derivative of? Maybe and that's not a problem as far as I know. What you see as minute differences look significant to me but those are just our lay opinions. Again if it ever comes down to a company that actually owns the design rights ever suing a Battletech company that has the money to pursue a vigorous defense then it'll be up to a court to decide whether or not PGI's designs are considered copies or materially different.

HG apparently never had the design rights to win the lawsuit they're pursuing. Which is what the current court case may finally determine.

But no I don't think PGI's Battletech designs aren ripoffs of Robotech designs. If anything it's apparently the other way around. Battletech was around first and it was properly licensed.

HG apparently can't truthfully make either of those claims regarding the mecha designs they're suing over.

You can keep trying to claim PGI's designs "ripped off" Robotech all you want but the facts apparently speak otherwise.

If you want further evidence. Look at the reasons HG's Robotech movie with Sony was reported to not use those designs in the movie.

It would be laughable if HG weren't causing so much legal expense and trouble for other companies over design rights HG apparently didn't have which was reportedly discovered by the arbiter between HG and their own licensor Tatsunoko. HG won that arbitration for other reasons, but some very interesting facts about the design rights were revealed.

Lets go back to waiting for actual news on the lawsuit instead of you trolling a Battletech forum with ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ claims.

[PocketYoda]

uMakeMeHot původně napsal:

DanteYoda původně napsal:

The differences are so minute that anyone can see they are copies, sure changing them makes copyright harder but these are so close i think the courts might say HG have a point..

I'm not saying i like any of this but i'm being honest here PGI designs are blatant ripoffs..

Ripoffs? The original designs were licensed in good faith by FASA for the Battletech when it was first created as Battledroids. Then HG was sold rights to the Macross mecha designs by companies that didn't have the rights to sell those designs and HG has since claimed rights they apparently haven't ever had despite possibly knowing they didn't have those rights to the designs since at least 2003's court decision in Japan, if not before, after which they nevertheless continued to claim rights their licensors apparently never had to give them in the first place. It was sufficiently publicized, discussed in their own fanbase and people wrote them enough letters or email (I know I did!) that it's not reasonable for them to claim they didn't know about the design rights decision in Japan regarding Tatsunoko, Big West/Studio Nue.

You can't rip off something from someone else who doesn't actually own that thing. Battletech launched (as Battledroids) with proper licensing through proper channels to the actual rights holders (Studio Nue) before Robotech ever launched. If there are ripoffs, then HG's apparently the ones doing the ripping off.

However the current PGI designs aren't even copies of the original designs. Inspired by? Yes. Derivative of? Maybe and that's not a problem as far as I know. What you see as minute differences look significant to me but those are just our lay opinions. Again if it ever comes down to a company that actually owns the design rights ever suing a Battletech company that has the money to pursue a vigorous defense then it'll be up to a court to decide whether or not PGI's designs are considered copies or materially different.

HG apparently never had the design rights to win the lawsuit they're pursuing. Which is what the current court case may finally determine.

But no I don't think PGI's Battletech designs aren ripoffs of Robotech designs. If anything it's apparently the other way around. Battletech was around first and it was properly licensed.

HG apparently can't truthfully make either of those claims regarding the mecha designs they're suing over.

You can keep trying to claim PGI's designs "ripped off" Robotech all you want but the facts apparently speak otherwise.

If you want further evidence. Look at the reasons HG's Robotech movie with Sony was reported to not use those designs in the movie.

It would be laughable if HG weren't causing so much legal expense and trouble for other companies over design rights HG apparently didn't have which was reportedly discovered by the arbiter between HG and their own licensor Tatsunoko. HG won that arbitration for other reasons, but some very interesting facts about the design rights were revealed.

I've seen your other posts trying to push the narrative that PGI ripped off HG, so I don't believe for a minute that you're being honest. Lets go back to waiting for actual news on the lawsuit instead of you trolling a Battletech forum with ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ claims.

No the original designs were licenced to Fasa for a set time period and Fasa continued to use them after set time ended..

They did rip them off its been well known for 20 years they ripped them off, just because you love battletech does not change this fact.

[M3chaMike]

DanteYoda původně napsal:

uMakeMeHot původně napsal:

Ripoffs? The original designs were licensed in good faith by FASA for the Battletech when it was first created as Battledroids. Then HG was sold rights to the Macross mecha designs by companies that didn't have the rights to sell those designs and HG has since claimed rights they apparently haven't ever had despite possibly knowing they didn't have those rights to the designs since at least 2003's court decision in Japan, if not before, after which they nevertheless continued to claim rights their licensors apparently never had to give them in the first place. It was sufficiently publicized, discussed in their own fanbase and people wrote them enough letters or email (I know I did!) that it's not reasonable for them to claim they didn't know about the design rights decision in Japan regarding Tatsunoko, Big West/Studio Nue.

You can't rip off something from someone else who doesn't actually own that thing. Battletech launched (as Battledroids) with proper licensing through proper channels to the actual rights holders (Studio Nue) before Robotech ever launched. If there are ripoffs, then HG's apparently the ones doing the ripping off.

However the current PGI designs aren't even copies of the original designs. Inspired by? Yes. Derivative of? Maybe and that's not a problem as far as I know. What you see as minute differences look significant to me but those are just our lay opinions. Again if it ever comes down to a company that actually owns the design rights ever suing a Battletech company that has the money to pursue a vigorous defense then it'll be up to a court to decide whether or not PGI's designs are considered copies or materially different.

HG apparently never had the design rights to win the lawsuit they're pursuing. Which is what the current court case may finally determine.

But no I don't think PGI's Battletech designs aren ripoffs of Robotech designs. If anything it's apparently the other way around. Battletech was around first and it was properly licensed.

HG apparently can't truthfully make either of those claims regarding the mecha designs they're suing over.

You can keep trying to claim PGI's designs "ripped off" Robotech all you want but the facts apparently speak otherwise.

If you want further evidence. Look at the reasons HG's Robotech movie with Sony was reported to not use those designs in the movie.

It would be laughable if HG weren't causing so much legal expense and trouble for other companies over design rights HG apparently didn't have which was reportedly discovered by the arbiter between HG and their own licensor Tatsunoko. HG won that arbitration for other reasons, but some very interesting facts about the design rights were revealed.

I've seen your other posts trying to push the narrative that PGI ripped off HG, so I don't believe for a minute that you're being honest. Lets go back to waiting for actual news on the lawsuit instead of you trolling a Battletech forum with ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ claims.

No the original designs were licenced to Fasa for a set time period and Fasa continued to use them after set time ended..

They did rip them off its been well known for 20 years they ripped them off, just because you love battletech does not change this fact.

All of this is pretty moot however when all you have to do is point out the fact that the newer designs for the "Unseen" mechs are different visually and characteristically than the designs they originally ripped off. HG would have a leg to stand on if the Battletech mechs' names were close to their counterparts, or if they were depicted in a specific scene or animation that the Robotech versions were known for.

As it is, these aren't the case. HG knows this, and if you had actually been following this story you'd know that at this point HG has no legal standing here, and simply uses this as a ploy to drain the money of their competitor. Every time it actually comes close to a final ruling, HG suddenly pulls out, leaving the other side without enough money to finish whichever project they're currently working on. And leaving HG with the same avenue of attack for next time.

[uMakeMeHot]

DanteYoda původně napsal:

uMakeMeHot původně napsal:

I've seen your other posts trying to push the narrative that PGI ripped off HG, so I don't believe for a minute that you're being honest. Lets go back to waiting for actual news on the lawsuit instead of you trolling a Battletech forum with ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ claims.

No the original designs were licenced to Fasa for a set time period and Fasa continued to use them after set time ended..

They did rip them off its been well known for 20 years they ripped them off, just because you love battletech does not change this fact.

Where's your evidence? You don't back up anything you say. There's no proof I've heard about in any of these cases where FASA's license had an expiration if there was one in public exposition. Do you have a reference backing up what you claim? Otherwise you're just bullshitting again.

When you asked me to prove what I stated I did http://steamcommunity.com/app/637090/discussions/0/1700541698699416489/?ctp=2#c1700541698705258208

And who is the "them" that you seem to think FASA was ripping off? It can't be HG because HG never owned the designs, and Battletech launched a year before Robotech.

Nothing you're stating has been "well known" for 20 years unless you read some PR from HG 20 years ago and fell for fake news.

I provided you with references for my facts (see link). Time for you to do the same.

Because I love Battletech I get my facts straight.

If you have solid information from a credible source I'll be happy to know more.

Otherwise unless you have new information to contribute regarding the current lawsuit, please stop trolling with irrelevant claims and ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

[SaltyClownShoes]

uMakeMeHot původně napsal:

DanteYoda původně napsal:

No the original designs were licenced to Fasa for a set time period and Fasa continued to use them after set time ended..

They did rip them off its been well known for 20 years they ripped them off, just because you love battletech does not change this fact.

Where's your evidence? You don't back up anything you say. There's no proof I've heard about in any of these cases where FASA's license had an expiration if there was one in public exposition. Do you have a reference backing up what you claim? Otherwise you're just bullshitting again.

When you asked me to prove what I stated I did http://steamcommunity.com/app/637090/discussions/0/1700541698699416489/?ctp=2#c1700541698705258208

And who is the "them" that you seem to think FASA was ripping off? It can't be HG because HG never owned the designs, and Battletech launched a year before Robotech.

Nothing you're stating has been "well known" for 20 years unless you read some PR from HG 20 years ago and fell for fake news.

I provided you with references for my facts (see link). Time for you to do the same.

Because I love Battletech I get my facts straight.

If you have solid information from a credible source I'll be happy to know more.

Otherwise unless you have new information to contribute regarding the current lawsuit, please stop trolling with irrelevant claims and ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

Dude, you're a jack ass. Trolling is your favorite word. If anyone is "trolling" on the forums here, it's you.