Will Warpfrog sell licences and devbuilds?

[Mystic Monkey]

You know how almost all game developers these days use Unity or Unreal Engine to make games these days? Epic Games and Unity Technology are not exclusive to the one game corporate, they offer licence and highly flexible program to anyone who can buy their business modules and agree to their ToS etc.

I was thinking, will WarpFrog ever consider making a Developer Build of B&S VR engine and physics?

No offence to B&S but the games graphics look sixth-gen at best and really just simulated combat than anything else. But that's only because the developers are concentrating on the VR and physics where the game truly shines. The game also had a modding community allowing players to build around the games engine and push the game itself (though examples I mostly find are Star Wars maps and weapons). I wonder if WarpFrog will ever consider allowing other game companies to buy the engine to use in their own games.

Think about it, wouldn't it be cool if there were games like Gothic or Dark Messiah for VR? For developers to make such a game in VR they'll have to make the VR gameplay that's comfortable and functional and then build the world around that gameplay with the right physics and engine. This is why most older first-person games can't just have a VR expansion, it would require the whole game to be reconstructed and reprogrammed around it.
But WarpFrog prioritise the VR gameplay and physics above all else for B&S which despite it's appearance not looking as polished as most other games we have today it's substance still surpass most other VR games in physics and gameplay. If they could make and sell their own VR gameplay and physics engine for distribution then it would allow game developers interested in making VR adventure games to have a leg up (something the VR industry really needs really). A VR gameplay engine that has everything they need, easily modifiable or adjustable for the game they're working on will allow the developers more ease to make the rest of the world and game around it.

[The Baron]

Heya! Afaik I don't think so, and the reason is because I believe the plan is to use the B&S physics engine as the platform for all future Warpfrog games. B&S was two things - the physics framework, and then the actual game, but future projects will benefit greatly because the worst part will be done (the physics). So in a sense the physics framework is literally the best part of B&S because kospy put two years into the development of it, and it's why you see many imitators but no one quite manages to emulate the quality. So going forward kospy has some really great ideas for future games once B&S is squared away, so we could see some really cool stuff from Warpfrog (including different genres!). Since B&S was a successful game the clout built from it should really help with future developments for bigger ideas. Originally B&S was a one man arena sandbox, but thanks to the fans we will now have the dungeons expansion, which was added completely after the fact based solely on the game's success. So going forward into game #2, hopefully all that fan goodwill will follow and the company will really boom.

[Mystic Monkey]

I agree that the physics framework is the best part of the game and yes there are many imitators out there but none who manage to emulate the quality thatKospy put so much time and effort into. B&S is more of a VR combat simulator that strives for realism in weapon weight, physics and damage that other game developers have struggled to achieve.

So, why not sell them a licence to allow other developers to use it?

When you started development plans to make B&S you knew you couldn't just program the game from the ground up. That's where Unity came in. Unity is a game developing program that allows other developers to not only make games but allows them to be marketed as professionally made games without too many legal ties. Instead of WarpFrog ending up as a subsidiary to Unity Tech along with all the other developers who marketed games with Unity instead Unity Tech offers you to buy a licence to sell and distribute games independently with their program without too much legal kerfuffle. Unity offers a program that probably a third professional developers use these days and credits don't have to copy-paste the production credits of Unity itself or have to pay the individuals of the individuals their cut. (I think crediting the program Unity is a mandatory, I dunno. I just messed about on the free version myself and yet to make anything noteworthy.)

What I'm getting at with Unity as an example is that what if WarpFrog would do the same with it's VR and physics framework in the same manner Unity Tech distributes it's game making program. Unity still makes money from selling the rights for developers to make games with it and those game developers are still regarded independent developers who are permitted to use Unity as a tool.

I'm not saying WarpFrog should sell the full rights and use to other companies that be willing to buy, that be crazy, I know. Just sell development builds of B&S's physics framework and VR-build the same way Unity Tech sells Unity itself.
(In fact, given B&S was made with Unity, what I'm suggesting could perhaps be done through the Unity Store, a feature on Unity that sells pre-made and additional content. Some pricey, some free.)

There are two benefits I see from distributing the physics framework to other developers:

1. You could make money. Unity Pro is like US$150 per month. Truth be told I don't know if WarpFrog has annual or monthly fees to Unity Tech. I just mess about on the free version myself but if B&S is £15.49, you could probably get a lot more just renting out the bones of the game.
   
2. It could help the VR industry in the long run. I notice that domestic Virtual Reality gaming has been around for about a decade now but it is still a struggling market. There are various reasons, some I know of, some I don't. But if game developers are struggling to adapt to VR then wouldn't it be beneficial to share your successful VR physics framework so that they can build their games around it? With more ease of access into VR game development means more VR games which in turn will generate more interest in WarpFrog's VR projects.
   
   For example, let's say Arkane Studios wants to make a new VR game as a successor to Dark Messiah or Arx Fatalis. Like the original game players can fight enemies with objects from their surroundings than just combat while the combat itself will be tough, fair and realistic. Problem is it would take a huge chunk of their budget to make such a VR framework and little enough to make an expansive world for the player to explore. But if you're willing to allow Arkane to have a devbuild of B&S VR and physics framework that they can easily adapt to then they can build the rest of the game around it. In return WarpFrog will get fees, mentioned on the credits and anyone who would play such a game would perhap know the game is built around the B&S framework so money and attention are coming back to you.

If there's going to be some that say "You really don't know how the gaming industry work here" or various legal systems in place that make my suggestion bull$#!7, I'm not saying I understand what's going on, I don't at all. I'm just saying that with lots of game developers trying to jumpstart the VR industry with games showing off who has the best VR games amongst one another to an audience asking "is it worth spending hundreds for a VR headset just for a few games?", perhaps it's best to help one another out in order to assure the industry thrives. Being business it's understandable to offer a small fee for your help but if more game developers have more ease of access into the VR Industry means more VR Industry, right?
It's kind of with Blender, Unity and Unreal Engine did. Without them developers would perhaps still be making their games from pure coding like the old days.

[The Baron]

Well I'm only speculating here (kospy is the dev, I'm community manager btw) but I believe it is likely because kospy is in it for the long haul and wants to keep making games. If he sold the B&S framework, it's over. He would make money on commission perhaps, but the 'secret sauce' is out there and so that is the end of warpfrog. Why would anyone buy a small indie game from warpfrog if EA had the same secret sauce but with millions of dollars of advertising. The big guys would crush small guys like warpfrog and then without any competition they would go right ahead and charge $60 + day one DLC, and cookie cutter low hanging fruit game mechanics. It is the secret sauce that makes this otherwise tiny abstract game a big hit, know what I mean? And since kospy wants to keep making games I imagine it is important for him to keep an edge. I believe full physics is the way for all VR games to go, but I reckon let the other companies innovate the same way warpfrog did and don't give them an easy out. No game companies cared about VR physics until B&S shook up the scene (and then boneworks hammering the nail in), and then with the success of B&S we saw even huge budget games using our own marketing language back at us (which shall remain nameless ).

However with all this I'm just speculating as I say, and I don't know all the answers and am no expert. As a player I totally do get what you are saying though, but I also understand why kospy wouldn't wanna sell out as an up and coming dev, so I see both sides. I do know he was never in it to make a quick buck from day one though; if he was, then he wouldn't have expanded the scope of the game for no reason other than it'd be awesome for players, and also we wouldn't have bothered with an ethical marketing of the game. We decided from day one that regardless if it was to the detriment of the game's advertising, we would always use a 'warts and all' policy. That is, we'd always tell fans about the bad stuff and never try gloss over the bugs, and also we'd never use clickbait or make exaggerated claims such as this is "the greatest blah blah". (underpromise and overdeliver policy) We are gamers first and foremost and we hate that kind of stuff too. And we also said we'd never attack other indie competition (boneworks, hellsplit, etc) and would never encourage our fans to either, because we are all small VR devs just struggling against the stagnation of the machine. But from a purely business standpoint, all these thing are bad business lol however some things are bigger than money!

Anyway, at the end of the day only kospy will know what he feels is the right thing to do.

[Mystic Monkey]

I'm not saying sell the secret sauce in it's entirety, just rent it out if that makes sense.

B&S was made on Unity for example, that doesn't mean you own the entirety of the Unity software itself, it's still in entire ownership of Unity Technologies, Unity Tech simply permits you to make B&S with their program and market B&S independently without selling WarpFrog to Unity Tech. In a sense Unity provides game developers with a service for a fee agreed terms.

It's either that or you build Blade & Sorcery from the ground up, as in have to write the lines of codes yourself just to make basic shapes or import models to specific co-ordinates and what-not. (Before I found Unity I tried DarkBasic Pro which is pure raw coding for basic results.) Unity was granted to you to allow B&S to be more easily developed.

That's what I'm suggesting with B&S' VR framework. Don't sell out the entire rights to it, just rent it out as a developers tool that other developers can use, for a fair use fee for Kospy of course.

But I'll leave it at that. I just think it be nice if there was more of a market with adventure VR games where I feel truly immerse. Virtual Reality is a powerful bridge between imagination and immersion.